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| They can't see the Forrest for the trees. Tennessee lawmakers. A Confederate general. (Page 9/12) |
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randye
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APR 14, 02:41 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by rinselberg:
Some of the messages in this thread read like the frantic squawking of a chicken that's being strangled.
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We've noticed, and yet the solution is so simple.
All you have to do is stop your squawking and the problem is remedied.
| quote | Originally posted by rinselberg:
the name of "Donald J. Trump"
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Interestingly but not surprisingly, NOBODY except YOU mentioned his name anywhere in this thread.[This message has been edited by randye (edited 04-14-2021).]
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blackrams
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APR 14, 07:04 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by randye:
Interestingly but not surprisingly, NOBODY except YOU mentioned his name anywhere in this thread.
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Just an attempt to drive a reaction. I'm convinced it's all about attention seeking syndrome. But, that's just my opinion and to be honest, my opinion only counts in how I rate others.
I know this. I also accept the repercussions of what I say and do. Decisions have rewards and consequences. 
Rams
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maryjane
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APR 14, 11:57 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by blackrams:
Why would you ask such questions when the answers are so obvious. 
Apparently, you're looking for a pissing contest. Sorry, I already went.
Have a good day.
Rams |
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Yep, I can see where you did it.
https://www.fiero.nl/forum/...ML/126311-2.html#p60
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blackrams
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APR 14, 12:07 PM
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 If you say so.
Rams
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williegoat
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APR 14, 12:54 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by randye:
Interestingly but not surprisingly, NOBODY except YOU mentioned his name anywhere in this thread.
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Actually, I did, on the previous page: https://www.fiero.nl/forum/...ML/126311-2.html#p54
| quote | Originally posted by williegoat:
Now for the trick question: How do we know that anything we read about N.B.Forrest is any more accurate than what we have read about D.J.Trump, B.Kavanaugh or H.Biden? |
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You quoted it in the very next post.
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rinselberg
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APR 14, 01:19 PM
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"Atlanta school to drop Confederate general's name and honor Hank Aaron"
| quote | (Reuters) - A public school in Atlanta, Georgia which carried the name of a Confederate general will be renamed after Hank Aaron, honoring the legendary baseball player who battled racism in the process of breaking the record for most home runs in a career, the New York Times reported here.
The Atlanta Board of Education unanimously voted on Monday to approve removing the name of Confederate general Nathan Bedford Forrest from Forrest Hill Academy and renaming it the Hank Aaron New Beginnings Academy, accord to the NYT report.
“Names do matter,” Jason F. Esteves, Atlanta’s school board chairman, said at the meeting, according to the NYT report. School board members said Forrest’s legacy was at odds with the community and its values. |
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In my ceaseless and insatiable (and manic and futile) quest for attention, I just duplicated this entire report--save for one last paragraph.
Reuters staff; April 13, 2021.
https://www.reuters.com/art...on-nyt-idUSKBN2C10FV
What's worse than a Yank? Why it's Hammerin' Hank !
What a revoltin' development this is ![This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 04-14-2021).]
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randye
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APR 15, 05:11 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by williegoat:
Actually, I did, on the previous page:
You quoted it in the very next post.
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I stand corrected. Thank You.
Clearly, the noise from the squawking chicken distracted me and I missed it.
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rinselberg
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APR 17, 01:58 PM
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After the recent recommendations of the Tennessee Historical Commission were publicized, including the recommended relocation of the large bronze of Nathan Bedford Forrest from the Tennessee State Capitol Building to the nearby Tennessee State Museum, Susan Cooper Eastman opined at some length about "all things Nathan Bedford Forrest."
"The General, in Black and White: What the debate over Nathan B. Forrest High School says about us"
Susan Cooper Eastman for Folio 2.0 Weekly Magazine; March 18, 2021.
https://folioweekly.com/sto...-says-about-us,22353
Ms Eastman's column includes several references to (one) Eric Foner.
| quote | Nathan Bedford Forrest was a homicidal criminal,” says Eric Foner the DeWitt Clinton professor of history at Columbia University and one of the country’s foremost experts on the Civil War and Reconstruction. More important, he says, this pervasive historical revisionism, this insistence on glossing over the sins of yesteryear, prevents long-standing psychic wounds from healing.
“Reconciliation requires truth,” Foner says. “You have to have one to have the other. It’s not, ‘Slavery is over. You need to get over it.’ Reconciliation requires facing [the entire] truth, and facing the truth about Nathan Bedford Forrest.” |
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| quote | Forrest wasn’t just a slave trader. He was a man who made his fortune on the backs of others’ coerced labor. He not only called lhe Civil War a battle over slavery, but also was so passionately behind the pro-slavery cause that he paid for his own cavalry to fight the Union.
As for Forrest’s later involvement with the Klan, the commonly accepted notion that Forrest was the group’s first grand wizard didn't originate with a liberal Northerner bent on sullying his good name. Instead, it’s clearly stated in a friendly 1914 history of the Klan written by Laura Martin Rose, the historian for the United Daughters of the Confederacy.
The revisionists’ history relies heavily on the general’s own denials to Congress. But Forrest had every reason to lie. “The Klan was a terrorist organization like Al Qaeda,” Foner says. “Nobody is going to admit they’re a member of Al Qaeda to Congress." |
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| quote | And then there’s the most noxious event in the Forrest story: Fort Pillow. In April 1864, some 300 Union soldiers — including more than 200 black soldiers, along with civilian women and children — were massacred in cold blood after Forrest’s Confederate troops had overrun and secured the fort. “Not only had the Confederates murdered most of the garrison after it had surrendered,” wrote Civil War historian Albert Castel in 1959, “but they had buried Negro soldiers alive, set fire to tents containing Federal wounded, and committed other terrible atrocities."
A month after the massacre [in1864], a congressional committee report put it this way: “The atrocities committed at Fort Pillow were not the result of passions committed by the heat of conflict, but were the results of a deliberately decided upon and unhesitatingly announced policy.” Forrest and his troops viewed the [Union's] black soldiers as less than human; they did not “recognize the officers and men of our [Union] colored regiments as entitled to the treatments accorded by all civilized nations to prisoners of war.”
In the words of U.S. Army Major General Stephen Hurlbut . . . "The information which I have from all sources official and otherwise, is that – whether by permission of [the Confederate] officers, or contrary to [that] permission, I cannot say — a butchery took place there that is unexampled in the record of civilized warfare."
Forrest’s defenders seize on that caveat. All this happened before the general arrived at Fort Pillow, they say, and when he discovered the massacre, he immediately put a stop to it. Had he authorized it, Nelson says, Forrest surely would have been hanged as a war criminal. Instead, President Andrew Johnson pardoned him.
“Every war criminal in history says that he didn’t know,” Foner counters. “He was in command. He was responsible for what happened. That’s why his name was on a school. He was the commander. If you’re in command, you’re responsible.” |
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| quote | The Duval County School Board's 1959 decision to name a school after [Nathan Bedford Forrest] had nothing to do with the [Confederate general's] military genius or his later repudiation of the Klan’s intimidation tactics. It was an emphatic middle finger to the federal government, [after the U.S.] Supreme Court had recently ordered school desegregation nationwide.
“These names aren’t just pulled out of a history dictionary,” Foner says. “They often make a statement. Naming a school after Nathan Bedford Forrest five years after Brown v. Board of Education made a statement, a statement more about 1959 than about 1865." |
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more references to Eric Foner, on the topic of Nathan Bedford Forrest
So who is Eric Foner?
| quote | | Eric Foner, DeWitt Clinton Professor Emeritus of History [at Columbia University], specializes in the Civil War and Reconstruction, slavery, and 19th-century America. He is one of only two persons to serve as President of the Organization of American Historians, American Historical Association, and Society of American Historians. He has also been the curator of several museum exhibitions, including the prize-winning "A House Divided: America in the Age of Lincoln," at the Chicago Historical Society. His book, The Fiery Trial: Abraham Lincoln and American Slavery won the Pulitzer, Bancroft, and Lincoln prizes for 2011. His latest book is Gateway to Freedom: The Hidden History of the Underground Railroad. [He co-authored "America’s Reconstruction: People and Politics After the Civil War."] |
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https://history.columbia.edu/person/foner-eric/
All this, of course, raises the obvious question:
| quote | | When it comes to Nathan Bedford Forrest, does Eric Foner know what he's talking about, or is he just "Foner'ing it in"..? |
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Like these people:
?[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 04-17-2021).]
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randye
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APR 18, 01:48 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by rinselberg:
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 [This message has been edited by randye (edited 04-18-2021).]
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rinselberg
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APR 19, 01:18 PM
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"When in Rome, do as the Romans do"
"Advisory panel says to move [Nathan Bedford] Forrest statue in Rome . . . to museum."
| quote | | An advisory committee says that a . . . statue of Confederate general Nathan Bedford Forrest should be placed inside a . . . museum. |
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Associated Press; April 19, 2021.
https://newschannel9.com/ne...in-rome-ga-to-museum
I hope they're thinking about this in Nashville. The Tennessee State legislators. Let Rome be their guide star in this matter.
Some say, even today, that this Confederate General was the man who saved Rome.[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 04-19-2021).]
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