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| Question on John Deere lawn tractor engine oil drain plug (Page 3/4) |
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1985 Fiero GT
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APR 27, 05:57 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by Patrick:
Does all wheel steering count as "zero turn"?
When I bought my property, I actually negotiated to have two lawn tractors included in the deal... the John Deere 345 (discussed above) and an AWS unit labelled as a Craftsman (sold by Sears Canada) which was made by Murray. This is what it looks like...
I didn't even realize that AWS was something that was available on lawn tractors. I soon discovered though that something was wrong with it (after I bought the property) when I realized that both rear wheels/tires could be turned independently by giving either tire a good kick. It turns out that a lever is broken underneath it that connects the rear wheels to the rest of the steering mechanism. Anyway, I focused on getting the John Deere running (mission now accomplished), and this lawn tractor will be a future project.
I mention all this just to bring AWS into the discussion in case it qualifies as "zero turn". I can't say I'm impressed with the build quality of this Murray lawn tractor (ie the broken rear steering lever), but AWS may be an option to look at depending on what is currently available.
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No zero turn is a 0"uncut radius, where the front wheels steer entirely 90 degrees, and one rear wheel goes forwards and the other backwards, like a tank, but with castors on the front (for the dual handle ones), or if you get a steering wheel version, 90* steering. I bent a tie rod on a fairly big cub Cadet zero turn by digging the wheel into a hole at speed and the bottom of a ditch, that was fun haha, the thing could also do a small wheely, unmodified, and had no suspension (that was not so fun).
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Patrick
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APR 28, 04:27 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by 1985 Fiero GT:
No zero turn is a 0"uncut radius...
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Okay thanks, I was just wondering.
There's something the John Deere 345 lawn tractor has that I just love, it's something none of my Fieros have... POWER STEERING. It's fabulous!  [This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 04-28-2025).]
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blackrams
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APR 28, 03:06 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by maryjane:
BadBoy and Cub Regret Cadet are supposedly still made here in 'Murica..
I don't know for sure anymore tho.
Dixie Chopper is made way down South in Indiana USA. They s'posed to be FAST! |
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My son has a Bad Boy (60 inch cut), he swears by it. Have considered one but hard to justify spending that much on a mower for me. Yeah, I pinch pennies.
I have a six foot finish mower (PTO driven) for my Kubota tractor, I may just buy a cheap push mower to make a round or two around my home and just use the Kubota from now on. Seems like a obvious and less expensive option.
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Rams
Learning most of life's lessons the hard way. . 
You are only young once but, you can be immature indefinitely.
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maryjane
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APR 28, 04:36 PM
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| quote | | No zero turn is a 0"uncut radius, where the front wheels steer entirely 90 degrees, and one rear wheel goes forwards and the other backwards, like a tank, but with castors on the front (for the dual handle ones |
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Are there people that think 'zero turn' means that it can turn 90 or 180° within it's own footprint???
They come kinda close, but they are simply too light to do it every time. There's not enough weight on the smallish locked rear tire to hold it firmly in place, plus the geometry front to rear just isn't there.
The term was coined for and means exactly what it says and nothing else, that no wheel of any kind has to be rotated by the operator rotate in order to result in a change in direction....steering type wheel or a wheel on the ground...that's all.
The only wheeled vehicles that I know of that can easily turn 90-180° are real tractors with independent rear brakes and you don't really want to use them too much pulling a mowing attachment (or anything else. ) You can easily find yourself flung from the seat or turned over with wheels to the sky.
Of course, farm and industrial tractors with lots of heft and large diameter rear wheels aren't the only ones that do (did) it. The story behind McLaren's extra pedal in it's F1 car's cockpit is well known..[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 04-28-2025).]
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Patrick
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JUN 22, 02:12 AM
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maryjane
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JUN 22, 09:06 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by Patrick:
I've been using my John Deere lawn tractor for the last two months. Works great. Yes, I eventually figured out how to engage the electric PTO for the mower deck/blades.
So earlier this week I was mowing the lawn, and the blades suddenly stopped. Turning the PTO switch off and on didn't do anything. I went to back up a bit, and the mower thumped up and dawn as it ran over something. I couldn't believe what I saw. There sitting in the grass was the electric PTO from the John Deere! 
When I had the John Deere mostly all apart earlier this year, the one thing I didn't check was the tightness of the bolt holding the new looking electric PTO onto the end of the engine's crankshaft.  Obviously, whoever installed it didn't tighten the bolt enough... and it had come completely out at some point while I was cutting the grass this week. I thought it might be an impossible task to find the bolt in the grass... but there it was, complete with its washer, about 20 feet away.
The wiring connector got a bit screwed up when the PTO dropped off the crankshaft and yanked the terminals apart, but I put it all back together (tightening the bolt with an impact gun) and it all works just fine. I think I dodged a bullet there!
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This, is/was a very common problem with electric PTO magnetic clutches on many different brand riding lawn mowers. That clutch gets lots of stress and vibration from the belt and deck and the bolt either backs out or breaks off..or both. Tech notes said to use red thread locker on the bolt but the problem with that is, if the electric coil quits working, it's almost impossible to get the bolt out to change the clutch. Broken pto bolts were an almost weekly thing where I worked..or bring the unit in just as you described with a perfectly good working pto clutch but the wires broken off too close to be able to splice back together. That means a customer had to buy a new clutch assy and they were not cheap even back around 2010. I can just imagine what they cost nowadays.
I'm not going to tell you to bypass the reverse gear safety switch (Kicks the pto out anytime the machine is put in reverse) but that constant on/off of that pto clutch is one of the major contributors to wearing it out early.......
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cliffw
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JUN 22, 10:10 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by cliffw:
Patrick, that is not a lawn tractor, it is a lawn mower.
I have never seen a oil drain "plug" like that. It appears to me it is all one unit.
Over tightening is a common problem, be it an oil plug, an oil filter, and many other things. I was taught to tighten first, before trying to loosen. I don't know how that makes sense but I have never broken a head hold since. |
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Patrick, I have failed you.
I should have mentioned Green Tractor
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Patrick
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JUN 22, 05:26 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by maryjane:
Tech notes said to use red thread locker on the bolt but the problem with that is, if the electric coil quits working, it's almost impossible to get the bolt out to change the clutch.
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I've never used much thread locker over the years, so my experience with removing a nut or bolt where it's been applied is quite limited. Are you saying that an impact gun would have a problem with removing that bolt if red thread locker was used? If so, would a weaker version suffice?
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| quote | Originally posted by maryjane:
That means a customer had to buy a new clutch assy and they were not cheap even back around 2010. I can just imagine what they cost nowadays.
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Just for "fun", I looked up the price at my local John Deere dealership... $568.14 (In US funds that would be $413.78) Outrageous!
| quote | Originally posted by maryjane:
I'm not going to tell you to bypass the reverse gear safety switch (Kicks the pto out anytime the machine is put in reverse) but that constant on/off of that pto clutch is one of the major contributors to wearing it out early...
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Right from the get-go, I suspected that engaging the electric PTO would be a high stress operation for it, so not only do I limit doing it as much as possible, but I always throttle down the engine prior to engaging the PTO. I also cut the grass in such a manner that I do not back up at all during the process. If I can't enter an area of the lawn and continue to drive forward in order to exit it, I return to that spot later with the gas-powered push mower to finish the job. That might be a heckuva nuisance with a larger property, but for 1.1 acres it's not really a problem.
 [This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 06-23-2025).]
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maryjane
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JUN 23, 09:51 AM
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Yes, an impact wrench 'should' be able to remove that size bolt except they are usually a relatively long bolt with most of the bolt's shank not being threads. Lots of room for fatigue in the length vs the width of the bolt. Many different brands use that same type elec clutch and we removed them with a torque wrench set at 70 ftlbs IIRC. Had to use a narrow strap wrench to keep the engine from rotating. Ya never knew if the boolt was going to unscrew or break off froma pre-existing crack and if it did, you better hope it left some bolt sticking out the end of the crankshaft..
You pay extra for any part on those green painted things.
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Patrick
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JUN 23, 03:09 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by maryjane:
Many different brands use that same type elec clutch and we removed them with a torque wrench set at 70 ftlbs IIRC.
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I suspect that's a typo?
| quote | Originally posted by maryjane:
Had to use a narrow strap wrench to keep the engine from rotating.
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I wasn't sure how to keep the crank from turning, which is why I ended up using an electric impact gun to tighten the PTO bolt. I didn't wish to hammer away with it too much, and possibly break the bolt, so I erred on the side of caution. I'll be double-checking that bolt before cutting the grass for awhile!
| quote | Originally posted by maryjane:
You pay extra for any part on those green painted things.
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Combine that with price gouging by certain Amazon vendors and you have this...
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Not even free shipping at that ripoff price.  In total it would be just over $50(US). Turns out it's actually quite a bit less expensive at the John Deere dealership, but still a lot for a damn washer (for the PTO).[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 06-23-2025).]
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I've got the mower deck removed in order to sharpen all 6 blades (12 cutting edges!) and to service the three blade spindles. I can tell from looking under the engine that it has what appears to be a brand new PTO unit installed. Nice and shiny!
The babies are so slow, as opposed to the adults that can move like pinballs on crack!