. I recently bought a new (to me) home on 1.1 acres. It came with a John Deere 345 lawn tractor. The previous owner wasn't exactly a mechanic, so I've stripped a lot of the lawn tractor apart to check it over and repair as I see fit.
The grass is rapidly growing, and I need this lawn tractor ready to rumble this week.
I've got its Kawasaki FD590V (V-twin) water-cooled engine now running smoothly, so I'm ready to change the oil and filter before I put this beast to work. Seems like something simple, but... I'm not 100% sure how the oil drain plug is supposed to be removed. There appear to be different types of drain plugs used on these machines, and I grabbed the image below from someone's YouTube video of their engine which has the same type of drain plug as mine. Keep in mind, this is a vertical crankshaft engine. The engine in the image below has been tipped on its side.
I assume (because I don't know for sure) that the plug on the end (green arrow) unscrews from the fitting identified with the blue arrow. I've been spinning wrenches enough years to know how to use two box wrenches in such a manner that you can slightly offset the two wrenches and squeeze them together to loosen such a fitting. However, when I try this, the end plug does not want to budge. I don't understand why an oil drain plug should be so freaking tight... which is why I'm wondering if anyone one else here has a similar oil drain plug assembly on their John Deere lawn tractor.
I'm about ready to try an impact gun on the plug with a box wrench holding the inner fitting. I don't want to go too crazy with the impact gun though, as the rest of the assembly (which attaches to the block) is just aluminum and I don't want to crack/break it.
So, is anyone familiar with this style of oil drain plug? Am I going about loosening the plug in the correct manner?
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 04-15-2025).]
Patrick, that is not a lawn tractor, it is a lawn mower.
I have never seen a oil drain "plug" like that. It appears to me it is all one unit.
Over tightening is a common problem, be it an oil plug, an oil filter, and many other things. I was taught to tighten first, before trying to loosen. I don't know how that makes sense but I have never broken a head hold since.
I have never seen a oil drain "plug" like that. It appears to me it is all one unit.
If the area identified by the blue arrow was smooth (like a pipe) I'd agree with you, but it isn't. It's made to accept a wrench, as is the plug on the end identified with the green arrow. Deductive reasoning would indicate that a wrench is expected to be used on both components, which makes sense as this would prevent any twisting motion to be transferred to the rest of the aluminum assembly which bolts to the block. I suspect that I am trying to go about this in the correct manner... but I'm hoping for some reassurance from someone who's familiar with this style of drain plug.
quote
Originally posted by cliffw:
... that is not a lawn tractor, it is a lawn mower.
Not sure why you wish to be pedantic about this... but here's a screen grab from the site I linked to above.
Love those old JD's. I have a 316 from the mid 80's with an Onan engine. Damn near bullet proof. Has the hydrostat control on the dash, which is handy. But they probably moved it to floor pedals because you could fall off easily at full boogie hitting a ditch then the damn thing would just keep going.
[This message has been edited by MarkS (edited 04-15-2025).]
The little bit of research I did seems to show there's supposed to be a spout under the filler cap to drain the oil from. That appears to be missing so I wonder if ol boy broke it off by accident and just found something with the same thread to stick in there. I have half a mind to say try to remove the part the blue arrow is pointed at. It almost looks like there's a washer or something between it and the tube it's screwed into.
Worst case I think you had the right idea about impacting the green arrow off while holding the blue with a wrench. If you break it, I'm sure you can find something with the same pitch at ACE.
But they probably moved it to floor pedals because you could fall off easily at full boogie hitting a ditch then the damn thing would just keep going.
Yes, there are pedals for forward and reverse... plus a brake pedal of course. In regards to falling off, there's a sensor/switch attached to the bottom of the seat that does something safety-wise if the seat becomes vacated during operation.
quote
Originally posted by Additivewalnut:
The little bit of research I did seems to show there's supposed to be a spout under the filler cap to drain the oil from. That appears to be missing...
Keep in mind that the image of the engine above of somebody else's engine has exactly the same oil drain assembly as mine... so I suspect this is OEM. There were variations over the years of the oil drain assembly used/installed by John Deere. The following is an enlargement of the oil drain area from the photo of my JD at the top of the thread. If you squint, you can see it's the same style of oil drain assembly as the engine from the YouTuber's video pictured above.
CLICK FOR FULL SIZE
quote
Originally posted by Additivewalnut:
It almost looks like there's a washer or something between it and the tube it's screwed into.
Yes, it kind of looks like a rubber O-ring in the photo. I'll have to take a closer look at my engine the next time I'm out there to see if it has that same feature. (I haven't actually moved in yet, and I'm an hour away from the place.)
quote
Originally posted by Additivewalnut:
Worst worst case, unbolt the tube from the block!
I was hoping to avoid doing that, as the oil would come out of the block on top of the middle of a frame rail. Could be messy... but yes, it's an option.
May be helpful if you hadn't found it yourself already!
Thanks for that, but that's for the GX345, a newer version of what I have. I did find the factory manual for the 345, but it's unfortunately of no help with this.
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 04-16-2025).]
"Yes, there are pedals for forward and reverse... plus a brake pedal of course. In regards to falling off, there's a sensor/switch attached to the bottom of the seat that does something safety-wise if the seat becomes vacated during operation. "
On mine, only if the deck PTO is engaged, 'course I never checked to see if there was a malfunction in the harness somewhere.
Mine's probably the same then, as I'm able to start the engine without being seated.
In regards to the PTO. I haven't actually looked up how to engage it yet. I've got the mower deck removed in order to sharpen all 6 blades (12 cutting edges!) and to service the three blade spindles. I can tell from looking under the engine that it has what appears to be a brand new PTO unit installed. Nice and shiny!
Yes, it kind of looks like a rubber O-ring in the photo.
I dug a bit deeper online... and yes, that is an O-ring. I discovered this by doing something I probably should've done in the first place... I looked up this lawn tractor in the John Deere parts catalog. The two red arrows below pointing at #14 and #15 are what I have, and #24 is the O-ring. So yes, it does appear that the plug on the end (#15) is supposed to unscrew from the fitting (#14)... but damn it's tight!
That is a good lawn tractor. Be cautious the hood plastic like to crack so treat it gently. For the Kawasaki liquid cooled engines about 3-4 times a year take off the engine cover clean the cover and screen from the fine debris to keep it from over heating; this more needed mid season when it gets dry and late fall when leave get chopped up and the debris flies.
Be cautious the hood plastic like to crack so treat it gently.
Too late! The plastic hood was held together with gaffing tape. I removed the hood in pieces. The plastic is so brittle! I can understand plastic being chosen by JD due to it not rusting, but geez, it's way too fragile. It's too bad that JD didn't instead use the same material that Pontiac chose for Fiero body panels. Anyway, I don't plan on reinstalling this busted up hood. I'll be going for the rat rod look.
A second lawn tractor actually came with the property I bought, a currently non-functional Craftsman with all-wheel steering. It has a nice sturdy metal hood.
quote
Originally posted by Hank is Here:
That is a good lawn tractor.
Except for the craptastic plastic hood... yes, it appears to be a nice machine. It also came with a relatively rare Piranha 44" mulching deck. The image below is of one I found online. I appear to not have the bottom piece in the photo, which fully compliments its mulching ability. I'll see what kind of a job the deck does without it, and if necessary, keep my eyes open for a replacement component.
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 04-16-2025).]
I found an image of an oil plug with the part number indicated in the parts catalog image a couple posts back.
CLICK FOR FULL SIZE
Yes, that pretty much looks like what's on the end of my oil drain assembly. Armed with this knowledge, I was bound and determined to get the oil drained from my John Deere's engine today.
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:
I've been spinning wrenches enough years to know how to use two box wrenches in such a manner that you can slightly offset the two wrenches and squeeze them together to loosen such a fitting.
I tried that again today. No dice. I've got a pretty strong grip, but I could not squeeze hard enough to loosen the nut. So... slight change of tactics. I offset the two wrenches in the opposite orientation and used a short prybar to separate the two wrenches. It took a few attempts, as that drain plug did not want to budge... but finally... (as George Costanza divulged)... it moved.
I have no idea why anyone would've tightened that drain plug so friggen tight. There's a rubber O-ring on there for crying out loud. It was not going to leak or get loose if it was simply snugged up like a normal person would do. Geez!
Anyway, I changed the oil and filter, changed the coolant, sharpened all six blades, greased all the fittings, reinstalled the mower deck... and tried cutting some grass. Worked like a charm. I'm a happy camper.
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 04-18-2025).]
In a former life, I worked for an ag distribution dealership whose shop worked on any make or model lawn equipment and farm equipment. If you only knew how many times we got lawn equipment in with no oil in the crankcase because someone did not tighten the drain plug tigh enough....... 'o' rings deteriorate and that plug is probably straight threads, not tapered. That means the only thing really holding tension is the 'o' ring. Once it gets smaller, the tension is gone and the plug can back out from vibration and heat/cool expansion/contraction cycles..
Your missing deck piece is a mulching plug. Without it, the cuttings will prematurely exit the rear of the deck instead of getting rotated around in there, and cut up finer each go-around. That part also acts as a wear shroud for the rear part of the deck. All that grass/dirt and sand swirling around under there will wear the rear part of the deck thin pretty quick. Cheaper to replace the wear shroud than the whol;e deck.
The other option is to buy and install the grass chute that would be there if ya don't mind a long windrow of brown dead grass cuttings, which will eventually lead to long dark green live grass swaths where the long dead brown grass decayed into natural fertilizer.
You could also acquire the bagger attachment instead of the mulching plug if you really like handling and storing rotten stinking piles of grass to spontaneously combust when you least expect it to..
JD, is NOT your grandfather's tractor company. Many if not most of their smaller (and some larger) products are made overseas.
Lipstick on a pig................ In the Ag community, if a grass cutting machine does NOT have a horizontal PTO shaft coming out the back (behind rear axle) AND a 3 pt lift in the back, no matter what else the manufacturer tries to claim , it's still a lawnmower. And with the exception of IH Farmalls of the 1950s and prior, if the deck is under the prime mover instead of behind it, It's still a lawn mower.
[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 04-19-2025).]
Lipstick on a pig................ In the Ag community, if a grass cutting machine does NOT have a horizontal PTO shaft coming out the back (behind rear axle) AND a 3 pt lift in the back, no matter what else the manufacturer tries to claim , it's still a lawnmower. And with the exception of IH Farmalls of the 1950s and prior, if the deck is under the prime mover instead of behind it, It's still a lawn mower.
Yes, it is... and the price for this large chunk of plastic locally is $324 (Cdn). I was thinking it probably wouldn't be all that difficult to fabricate something relatively simple to effectively restrict the three exit chutes in much the same manner that the mulching plug does. I then found a thread on My Tractor Forum where the fella discussed the homemade mulching panel(s) that he had created.
If I decide I need to try this mod...The blue arrows below point to the type of metal stock I'd start with to utilize and mount where the mulching plug would normally reside, indicated by the red outline. The green arrows indicate the three exit paths, with the different levels of restricted flow. Looks like a relatively simple concept to implement.
CLICK FOR FULL SIZE
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 04-19-2025).]
Lipstick on a pig................ In the Ag community, if a grass cutting machine does NOT have a horizontal PTO shaft coming out the back (behind rear axle) AND a 3 pt lift in the back, no matter what else the manufacturer tries to claim , it's still a lawnmower. And with the exception of IH Farmalls of the 1950s and prior, if the deck is under the prime mover instead of behind it, It's still a lawn mower.
Man, never realized this was such a sticky wicket. So PTO on the front w/ hydraulic connectors is a mower too. I had the opportunity to buy a snow blower front end for the 316 but I missed out, still regret that. Always thought of mine as a garden tractor, but it doesn't matter. Unfortunately, the newer Deere's that are sold at the Home Depot don't get very good reviews.
I can't contribute to this thread with any good information reference the mower being asked about but, I'm (somewhat) looking for a new mower. My current zero turn is like me, getting old and tired. I've come to the conclusion that just about any new zero turn mower made for the residential market is pretty much crap regardless of brand name. So, I started looking at commercial versions. My goodness, they are proud of those puppies.
You get what you pay for (as usual) but................................ Just curious but is there an American made mower out there? Or at least one assembled here?
------------------ Rams Learning most of life's lessons the hard way. . You are only young once but, you can be immature indefinitely.
I've come to the conclusion that just about any new zero turn mower made for the residential market is pretty much crap regardless of brand name.
Does all wheel steering count as "zero turn"?
When I bought my property, I actually negotiated to have two lawn tractors included in the deal... the John Deere 345 (discussed above) and an AWS unit labelled as a Craftsman (sold by Sears Canada) which was made by Murray. This is what it looks like...
I didn't even realize that AWS was something that was available on lawn tractors. I soon discovered though that something was wrong with it (after I bought the property) when I realized that both rear wheels/tires could be turned independently by giving either tire a good kick. It turns out that a lever is broken underneath the tractor that connects the rear wheels to the rest of the steering mechanism. Anyway, I focused on getting the John Deere running (mission now accomplished), and this lawn tractor will be a future project.
I mention all this just to bring AWS into the discussion in case it qualifies as "zero turn". I can't say I'm impressed with the build quality of this Murray lawn tractor (ie the broken rear steering lever), but AWS may be an option to look at depending on what is currently available.
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 04-28-2025).]
When I bought my property, I actually negotiated to have two lawn tractors included in the deal... the John Deere 345 (discussed above) and an AWS unit labelled as a Craftsman (sold by Sears Canada) which was made by Murray. This is what it looks like...
I didn't even realize that AWS was something that was available on lawn tractors. I soon discovered though that something was wrong with it (after I bought the property) when I realized that both rear wheels/tires could be turned independently by giving either tire a good kick. It turns out that a lever is broken underneath it that connects the rear wheels to the rest of the steering mechanism. Anyway, I focused on getting the John Deere running (mission now accomplished), and this lawn tractor will be a future project.
I mention all this just to bring AWS into the discussion in case it qualifies as "zero turn". I can't say I'm impressed with the build quality of this Murray lawn tractor (ie the broken rear steering lever), but AWS may be an option to look at depending on what is currently available.
No zero turn is a 0"uncut radius, where the front wheels steer entirely 90 degrees, and one rear wheel goes forwards and the other backwards, like a tank, but with castors on the front (for the dual handle ones), or if you get a steering wheel version, 90* steering. I bent a tie rod on a fairly big cub Cadet zero turn by digging the wheel into a hole at speed and the bottom of a ditch, that was fun haha, the thing could also do a small wheely, unmodified, and had no suspension (that was not so fun).
BadBoy and Cub Regret Cadet are supposedly still made here in 'Murica.. I don't know for sure anymore tho.
Dixie Chopper is made way down South in Indiana USA. They s'posed to be FAST!
My son has a Bad Boy (60 inch cut), he swears by it. Have considered one but hard to justify spending that much on a mower for me. Yeah, I pinch pennies.
I have a six foot finish mower (PTO driven) for my Kubota tractor, I may just buy a cheap push mower to make a round or two around my home and just use the Kubota from now on. Seems like a obvious and less expensive option.
------------------ Rams Learning most of life's lessons the hard way. . You are only young once but, you can be immature indefinitely.
No zero turn is a 0"uncut radius, where the front wheels steer entirely 90 degrees, and one rear wheel goes forwards and the other backwards, like a tank, but with castors on the front (for the dual handle ones
Are there people that think 'zero turn' means that it can turn 90 or 180° within it's own footprint??? They come kinda close, but they are simply too light to do it every time. There's not enough weight on the smallish locked rear tire to hold it firmly in place, plus the geometry front to rear just isn't there.
The term was coined for and means exactly what it says and nothing else, that no wheel of any kind has to be rotated by the operator rotate in order to result in a change in direction....steering type wheel or a wheel on the ground...that's all.
The only wheeled vehicles that I know of that can easily turn 90-180° are real tractors with independent rear brakes and you don't really want to use them too much pulling a mowing attachment (or anything else. ) You can easily find yourself flung from the seat or turned over with wheels to the sky.
Of course, farm and industrial tractors with lots of heft and large diameter rear wheels aren't the only ones that do (did) it. The story behind McLaren's extra pedal in it's F1 car's cockpit is well known..
[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 04-28-2025).]
There appear to be different types of drain plugs used on these machines, and I grabbed the image below from someone's YouTube video of their engine which has the same type of drain plug as mine. Keep in mind, this is a vertical crankshaft engine. The engine in the image below has been tipped on its side.
I've got the mower deck removed in order to sharpen all 6 blades (12 cutting edges!) and to service the three blade spindles. I can tell from looking under the engine that it has what appears to be a brand new PTO unit installed. Nice and shiny!
I removed the hood in pieces. The plastic is so brittle! I can understand plastic being chosen by JD due to it not rusting, but geez, it's way too fragile. It's too bad that JD didn't instead use the same material that Pontiac chose for Fiero body panels. Anyway, I don't plan on reinstalling this busted up hood. I'll be going for the rat rod look. 
It turns out that a lever is broken underneath the tractor that connects the rear wheels to the rest of the steering mechanism. Anyway, I focused on getting the John Deere running (mission now accomplished), and this lawn tractor will be a future project.
