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88 2.5 rebuild by Zeak
Started on: 10-26-2014 03:58 PM
Replies: 60 (2216 views)
Last post by: edfiero on 11-09-2015 10:58 AM
Zeak
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Report this Post10-26-2014 03:58 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Started pulling apart the bone stock duke in my 88 today.
Shes been burning oil and smoking sense I bought her. I have finally got to a point at my job where I can
afford to give my sad little fiero the proper care it needs.
While I was pulling the intake and exhaust off, I found the the stock head gasket was in
good shape. The stock exhaust header had the normal cracks on both sides. What I did not expect was was for one side to fall off in my hand.


The cylinder walls look and feel great. the bad thing is that I could shave in the refection. Got a new glaze braker for that.
Heres the other pics before I start cleaning. Still need to pull the rest of the block, but I'm trying to take my time. This is not my first engine, but I still want to make sure I take my time and do things right. Going with sealled power pistons and moly rings.




------------------

1988 Fiero 2.5

[This message has been edited by Zeak (edited 10-26-2014).]

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Gall757
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Report this Post10-26-2014 07:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Gall757Send a Private Message to Gall757Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post


Is that blue stuff cooked oil?

[This message has been edited by Gall757 (edited 10-26-2014).]

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Zeak
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Report this Post10-26-2014 07:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Afraid so. Oil was getting into the combustion chamber and there was so much blow-by that I had to install a oil catch can on the valve cover vent.
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Zeak
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Report this Post10-26-2014 08:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
On a related note. (did not want to start another thread)
Dose the exhaust haft to be this long? The hoop on the trans side seems like it would contribute to alot of extra under hood heat.
My pipe and Cat need to be replaced anyway.
I was thinking it could come out of the header and head right under the cradle wile reusing the stock flex points.
Maybe have a small, high flow cat under the engine with the proper heat shielding.
(photo credit to IFLYR22)

[This message has been edited by Zeak (edited 10-26-2014).]

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theogre
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Report this Post10-26-2014 11:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for theogreClick Here to visit theogre's HomePageSend a Private Message to theogreEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Zeak:
On a related note. (did not want to start another thread)
Dose the exhaust haft to be this long? The hoop on the trans side seems like it would contribute to alot of extra under hood heat.
My pipe and Cat need to be replaced anyway.
I was thinking it could come out of the header and head right under the cradle wile reusing the stock flex points.
Maybe have a small, high flow cat under the engine with the proper heat shielding.

Picture shows 88 OE exhaust is to stop breaking exhaust manifold.
Second joint to right in above picture and pipe hanger to trans is 88 fix to isolate cat weight from crap manifold design.

You want 88 pipe.

Many think heat is a problem but cheap shield etc solve that. Heat really does not matter when the car is moving.
That picture shows OE shield on the pipe. Many have rusted.
I made starter shield... www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/133868.html#p13
Stops heat soak by pipe and cat.

------------------
Dr. Ian Malcolm: Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.
(Jurassic Park)


The Ogre's Fiero Cave (It's also at the top and bottom of every forum page...)

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Zeak
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Report this Post10-27-2014 08:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks for the info!
Got some more progress made.
Pulling the 2.5 from the top was not to bad after I removed the intake, exhaust, and the head.
Going to soak her in gunk and then pressure wash everything thats external.

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Zeak
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Report this Post10-28-2014 08:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Broke the darn crank sensor on the back of the coil packs. Guess it was time for a new one. My serpentine belt tensioner had a new pulley on it but I guess it was a little loose as it was grinding on the plastic that covers the spring. Can that be rebuilt or do I haft to buy the hole thing?
Did the pressure washing this afternoon after I got off work and am going to take apart the internals and wire-wheel the block and head.

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Zeak
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Report this Post10-29-2014 07:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Got some more work done.
Not sure how old the bearings are, but they look good.



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theogre
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Report this Post10-29-2014 08:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for theogreClick Here to visit theogre's HomePageSend a Private Message to theogreEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
the belt arm worn then replace tension assm.
RockA etc have them.

Should have metal "spring" and you move it to new tensioner but many are missing. I Think just make noise when pulley/tensioner are bad.
Arm is pointing to where the spring mounting point. Not covered in cave...

See my Cave, Serpent Belt

DIS brick look like missing PIM shield.
See my Cave, DIS Ignition

rebuild an 88 then first carefully check balancer/oil pump assm.
88+ is known for balance assm problem that kills whole engines.

Check Jasper etc rebuilt engine. Likely cheaper and has a warranty.
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Zeak
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Report this Post10-30-2014 11:32 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Your defiantly right about the shield missing. Looking into getting one from my local pick and pull.
As for the pulley, I'm just going to use an adjustment bar and run it like the 84 2.5.
Thanks for all the great info in the cave.

[This message has been edited by Zeak (edited 10-30-2014).]

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theogre
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Report this Post10-30-2014 06:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for theogreClick Here to visit theogre's HomePageSend a Private Message to theogreEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
down grade for V belts? is bad move. V belts can't use harmonic balancer and w/o that can kill timing gear and balancer/pump. Is part of why timing gears die.
just use new tensioner and harmonic balancer.
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Zeak
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Report this Post10-30-2014 07:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'm not down grading to v-belts. Just going to find the same belt that I have now only shorter. I'll use the stock tensioner without the pulley to cap off the hole in the block.
I'm not trying to build a racecar here. I just want to be able to drive to work and not haft to replace the tensioner in another 80k.
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Zeak
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Report this Post11-02-2014 11:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Some more digging. My poor little duke is so dirty..... T-T
(also my harbor freight vice called it a day)



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Jims88
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Report this Post11-03-2014 07:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Jims88Click Here to Email Jims88Send a Private Message to Jims88Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Good luck with your engine build; how many miles were on the old Duke?
My Harbor freight vice does this once a year


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TopNotch
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Report this Post11-03-2014 09:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TopNotchClick Here to visit TopNotch's HomePageSend a Private Message to TopNotchEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Since you no doubt need new valves and re-conditioned seats, have a machine shop check the head for cracks. Mine had a small one when I rebuilt my 88 duke, so I got a later model head (better flowing).
See this thread for more on my rebuild.
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Zeak
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Report this Post11-04-2014 06:24 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Jims88:
Good luck with your engine build; how many miles were on the old Duke?

Thanks. It just rolled over to 180k.


 
quote
Originally posted by TopNotch:
Since you no doubt need new valves and re-conditioned seats, have a machine shop check the head for cracks. Mine had a small one when I rebuilt my 88 duke, so I got a later model head (better flowing).
See this thread for more on my rebuild.

I plan on doing that. Just haft to get all the gunk off first. lol

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hcforde
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Report this Post11-06-2014 03:03 AM Click Here to See the Profile for hcfordeClick Here to Email hcfordeSend a Private Message to hcfordeEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
So I guess I will be getting a vise elsewhere. Maybe the old Wilton's ARE worth the money.

Thanks for the headsup!
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Zeak
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Report this Post11-06-2014 10:40 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Tried to clean up my old valves. All 4 of the exhaust ones are shot. New ones will be in within 4 days....
The head was checked over and aside from LOTS of carbon buildup. Its in good shape. Still trying to source a proper shield for the coil assembly.
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Gall757
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Report this Post11-06-2014 11:25 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Gall757Send a Private Message to Gall757Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
It may be a camera trick...but look at that wear on the shaft. It looks like .010!
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Zeak
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Report this Post11-06-2014 04:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I think that's just some sort of coating they put on the valve. The more narrow point measures the same as the top and bottom of where the keepers go on the other end. I'll compare them to the new ones when they come in.
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Zeak
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Report this Post11-09-2014 12:54 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Went to the parts store and paid $2.99 for a small exhaust connector.
It's 18 gauge galvanized steel. Made a paper tracing of the pim and them cleaned it up and traced it onto the connector.
Going to cut it down the back side and unroll it and then cut the holes. (It's hard to find galvanized steel for cheap around here)
On the orange rubbers that seal the coils. I only have one per side. How thick should they be? There only as thick as a nickel at the moment.
Thoughts?

[This message has been edited by Zeak (edited 11-09-2014).]

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Zeak
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Report this Post11-10-2014 09:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Got the shield cut out, but I'm not happy with it. It looked great until I tryed to do the more detailed cuts for the coils to connect to.
I'm thinking I need a dremel, not a hand drill and chainsaw file. lol
In other news, My new valves came in.
There soooo nice looking.

[This message has been edited by Zeak (edited 11-10-2014).]

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Zeak
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Report this Post11-12-2014 11:12 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Got everything cleaned up and the first coat of bonding primmer on.
(sat some lug-nuts in the sparkplug holes to keep them clean) lol

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Zeak
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Report this Post11-13-2014 03:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Got my 2nd coat of chevy orange curing.
(sorry the #2 pic is blurry.)
Dose anyone know if and how the bottom end is vented?

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edfiero
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Report this Post11-14-2014 08:31 AM Click Here to See the Profile for edfieroClick Here to Email edfieroSend a Private Message to edfieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Why not Pontiac blue?
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Zeak
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Report this Post11-14-2014 04:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Because I'm having the body painted next year.
general lee orange :3
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Zeak
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Report this Post11-15-2014 01:15 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Made a little progress tonight before the wife started yelling about the noise.
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Zeak
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Report this Post11-16-2014 05:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Doing some more cleaning. Wanted to show what the result of putting too thick of a bead of rtv on the oil pan. It did not fully cure and leaked alot.
I was also very surprised at how much dirt, dust, and rocks came out of my alternator. Still produced a charge....


[This message has been edited by Zeak (edited 11-17-2014).]

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Zeak
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Report this Post11-20-2014 11:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Getting the last 2 pistons installed and I have been slowly moving the crank assembly to insure nothing was binding. Now that the bottom end is all together. It seems stiff. Nothings grinding that I can tell. I used a plasta gauge on the crank and con rods and all was well within spec. Thoughts?
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Zeak
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Report this Post11-27-2014 03:21 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
So this might work.
Got a belt thats just over 48'' long. Made the hole on the tip of the old tensioner wider so It has a bit of adjustment.
If it dose work great. If not then I'm only out the price of the shorter belt and I haft to buy a new tensioner anyway.
Going to install the oil pan in the morning and let the rtv set up for a few days before it sees any oil.

[This message has been edited by Zeak (edited 11-27-2014).]

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Zeak
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Report this Post12-03-2014 10:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Got my battery tray mounted and the new cables ran.
Edit- not the battery I'm going to use. It's a dead one I used for fitment.

[This message has been edited by Zeak (edited 12-03-2014).]

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Zeak
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Report this Post12-10-2014 11:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Slow progress.


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Report this Post12-12-2014 07:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Jims88Click Here to Email Jims88Send a Private Message to Jims88Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Motors back in the car, looking good
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Report this Post12-13-2014 10:42 AM Click Here to See the Profile for SquishyxoutClick Here to Email SquishyxoutSend a Private Message to SquishyxoutEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Keep up the good work, I'm going to be going through the same process more or less,

On a side note, I'm digging the color, what brand engine enamel did you use?
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Zeak
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Report this Post12-15-2014 09:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
-Jims88- Thanks! To answer your question from way before when we where talking about broken vises. The od claims 179k. The only thing the other owners did to her was the timing gear.

-Squidhyxout- Chevy orange from VHT Engine Enamel. Also highly recommend there primer. Good stuff.

Heres a side by side of my new gear reduction starter next to what I can only assume is the factory starter. (still worked, certainly had enough lube from my bad oil pan seal.)



Got most of the wiring back on. the dog-bone went on without much hassel and I reran the new battery cables so there not touching anything that gets hot or moves.

[This message has been edited by Zeak (edited 12-15-2014).]

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Report this Post12-15-2014 11:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Shho13Click Here to Email Shho13Send a Private Message to Shho13Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Wow this is looking good! Keep up the good work and keep taking pictures... Stuff like this is fascinating!!!

------------------
"Discord"
Red 1988 GT under restoration!

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

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olejoedad
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Report this Post12-16-2014 09:21 AM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadClick Here to Email olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Why is your battery in the trunk?
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Zeak
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Report this Post12-16-2014 10:26 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:

Why is your battery in the trunk?


Why not? It's out from under the deck lid vent, so that will have much better airflow out. (remember that air comes up from the bottom of the car, not in.)
It's also not exposed to the snow and ice during the winter.
I'm not building a track car. A 96hp iron duke will see to that. I'm 6'2'' and 240 pounds. I think the battery in the rear trunk will not make too much of a difference.
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Zeak
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Report this Post12-17-2014 12:25 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ZeakSend a Private Message to ZeakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Wanted to ask what this connections point is....
The plastic bit with 2 bolt studs needs to be replaced as they both spin when you try to put the nuts on.
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Report this Post12-17-2014 08:01 AM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadClick Here to Email olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
That is the Battery Junction Terminal.
The same style is used on several GM models from the 80's and 90's.
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