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  Chrysler 3.5 HO V6 swap (Page 3)

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Chrysler 3.5 HO V6 swap by seajai
Started on: 08-03-2012 06:21 PM
Replies: 311 (28250 views)
Last post by: seajai on 07-04-2017 12:05 AM
Fierofreak00
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Report this Post12-09-2012 11:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Fierofreak00Click Here to Email Fierofreak00Send a Private Message to Fierofreak00Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Simple and functional, that's all it needs be. Good work. -Jason

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Silicoan86
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Report this Post12-10-2012 12:40 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Silicoan86Click Here to Email Silicoan86Send a Private Message to Silicoan86Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by seajai:
Already looking into a WRX 2.0 turbo swap for my next one. The wife looked at me kinda sideways when I mentioned it to her though. I almost got the feeling she was questioning my sanity


THIS would be awesome. I've always talked about doing that swap myself, and even spent time in the garage measuring with the two cars next to each other. Someday...

[This message has been edited by Silicoan86 (edited 12-10-2012).]

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seajai
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Report this Post12-16-2012 10:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

On to the fuel system. I got the fuel tank pulled out of the Chrysler and removed the fuel pump module.



The Chrysler pump module is a 2-piece plastic design where the bottom telescopes in and out of the top, which means it fits the depth of the Fiero tank perfectly. The Chrysler tank is molded plastic and the pump is held into the tank with a large nut that threads onto the tank. It's also about 1 1/2" larger in diameter which means the hole in the tank must be enlarged and a new way to secure the pump designed.



My solution: I had a couple steel rings CNC plasma cut to secure the pump.



Here is how much needs to be trimmed



To get the pump module to fit in the tank, I had to turn the float arm 180deg and install it in this orientation.



The problem was the wiring connector and pump outlet were pointing the wrong way. So by separating the halves of the pump module and turning the top 1 notch over, I was able to get it to point in the right direction.



The rings were drilled and tapped.



I split the lower ring so I could insert it into the tank and held it in place with a flat head bolt.

So here is the Chrysler pump installed in the Fiero tank, bolted in place with the lock ring. I need to make a gasket yet to seal it, and the outlet is too tall and will hit the tunnel, so I will need to build a "dome" into the tunnel to get it to fit.

[This message has been edited by seajai (edited 12-16-2012).]

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RCR
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Report this Post12-17-2012 11:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for RCRClick Here to Email RCRSend a Private Message to RCREdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Very cool...While you have it apart, verify the wiring from the connector to the fuel pump, especially if there is an internal connector. I just had to rework the connector for my Aztek fuel module because the terminals inside the module fret (corrode due to vibration). Simple to fix if you look ahead of time.

Bob

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Fierofreak00
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Report this Post12-17-2012 12:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Fierofreak00Click Here to Email Fierofreak00Send a Private Message to Fierofreak00Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

There is an internal connector inside the module. But, speaking from experience, there have been no issues with corrosion on those.

The box, you thinking outside it. Nice work on the fuel pump, I was wondering how your were ging to do that. -Jason

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Jims88
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Report this Post12-19-2012 09:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Jims88Send a Private Message to Jims88Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post


Very Impressive design build project; creative problem solving and outstanding fab work!!

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seajai
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Report this Post12-19-2012 09:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Jims88:


Very Impressive design build project; creative problem solving and outstanding fab work!!



Thank you for the compliments.

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katatak
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Report this Post12-19-2012 10:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for katatakSend a Private Message to katatakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Great to see someone thinking outside the box - nice work so far. Looking forward to seeing the finished product.

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pontiackid86
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Report this Post12-20-2012 06:10 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pontiackid86Click Here to Email pontiackid86Send a Private Message to pontiackid86Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

This is going to be interesting. this motor was what made the prowelr kind of a laughing stock of chrysler. Gorgeous car but lacking in speed due to the weight and setup. i have the same motor in my dads car... real power house per say but the 300M setup is one heavy pig on this motor.. cant wait to see what it does in a lighter setup.

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seajai
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Report this Post12-20-2012 07:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by pontiackid86:

This is going to be interesting. this motor was what made the prowelr kind of a laughing stock of chrysler. Gorgeous car but lacking in speed due to the weight and setup. i have the same motor in my dads car... real power house per say but the 300M setup is one heavy pig on this motor.. cant wait to see what it does in a lighter setup.


According to 060calculator.com , 250 HP in a 2800lb car should give me a 5.5 second 0-60 time, I'm sure the real world time will be a little higher. What sold me on this swap, power-wise, was a ride in a 3800sc car that was pretty close to stock. I thought it was plenty quick with just enough power to make it a fun ride. Besides, I got size 15 feet, and too much HP underneath them just means more speeding tickets for me.

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pontiackid86
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Report this Post12-21-2012 03:50 AM Click Here to See the Profile for pontiackid86Click Here to Email pontiackid86Send a Private Message to pontiackid86Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by seajai:


According to 060calculator.com , 250 HP in a 2800lb car should give me a 5.5 second 0-60 time, I'm sure the real world time will be a little higher. What sold me on this swap, power-wise, was a ride in a 3800sc car that was pretty close to stock. I thought it was plenty quick with just enough power to make it a fun ride. Besides, I got size 15 feet, and too much HP underneath them just means more speeding tickets for me.



You wont be disappointed. My 1st time over 100 MPH was with one of these motors in my dads 300M special... and i was well above 100 in it...did not take long to get there.. if you can see about finding the tune for the 300M special... it will pump a little more power out of the car.. Also i see that you are using the LHS trans... how do you plan on incorporating the auto stick feature?

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seajai
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Report this Post12-21-2012 09:18 AM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

For the autostick, I may just install the floor shifter from the 300 because it already has the hall effect switch built in, but I have been kicking around a paddle shifter idea as well. It will just depend on how much energy and ambition remain when I reach that part of the build.

[This message has been edited by seajai (edited 12-21-2012).]

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seajai
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Report this Post12-26-2012 08:00 PM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Reached another milestone in the project with the end of the major metal fabrication work.

First up, I had to cut a hole in the tunnel to make room for the fuel sender outlet and electrical connector. This required the fabrication of a small dome to cover it.



I bent it using a home-made brake, the results were ok but I thought it could be better. I had been looking around for a real finger brake, and luckily, I was able to score a Di-Acro 24" brake that can bend up to 16ga material, and I got it for a song. It's missing a couple fingers but I should be able to track them down.



So, armed with my new brake, I could fab up the pieces needed to box in the firewall. First off, the cam covers needed clearance on the top so I made a angled box for that.



This is where it needs to go:



Clamped in place:



Both sides spot welded in place:



The center area needed to be built out for radiator hose clearance and have a removable panel for access to the hose and other components.



View from the engine side:



The lower structure had been cut out to make room for the balancer and drive belts. That area was boxed in using 16ga material.

After all that I re-installed the engine/trans for what seemed to be the 10,000th time to check clearances, and all is good. So now its on to the other stuff like wiring and finding new spots to run the throttle and shift cables as well as a new pass through for the wiring harness. I talked with Arrington Performance in Martinsville VA, and they can do all the mods to my PCM for $350 bucks, so I think I'm good to go on that front.

[This message has been edited by seajai (edited 07-13-2014).]

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85sliverGT
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Report this Post12-27-2012 07:17 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 85sliverGTClick Here to Email 85sliverGTSend a Private Message to 85sliverGTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by seajai:


According to 060calculator.com , 250 HP in a 2800lb car should give me a 5.5 second 0-60 time, I'm sure the real world time will be a little higher. What sold me on this swap, power-wise, was a ride in a 3800sc car that was pretty close to stock. I thought it was plenty quick with just enough power to make it a fun ride. Besides, I got size 15 feet, and too much HP underneath them just means more speeding tickets for me.


Seajai I forgot to tell you, when we went out in my car at the moa meet the car still had a few bugs to be worked out, it now pulls a bit harder like it should.

Your project is looking great! I had some doubts when you told me you were going to do this, but my doubts are long gone. Excellent problem solving going on here. Think she'll be ready for summer? I'd like a ride!

Blake

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seajai
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Report this Post12-27-2012 08:47 AM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by 85sliverGT:


Seajai I forgot to tell you, when we went out in my car at the moa meet the car still had a few bugs to be worked out, it now pulls a bit harder like it should.

Your project is looking great! I had some doubts when you told me you were going to do this, but my doubts are long gone. Excellent problem solving going on here. Think she'll be ready for summer? I'd like a ride!

Blake


I'm hoping to be done by April-May sometime, barring anything major happening. Rides for sure!

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mrfred8
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Report this Post12-27-2012 08:58 AM Click Here to See the Profile for mrfred8Click Here to visit mrfred8's HomePageSend a Private Message to mrfred8Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by seajai:


I'm hoping to be done by April-May sometime, barring anything major happening. Rides for sure!


Are you going to bring it over to Frazee for the Shipman show, I would love to see this swap.

------------------
--Jeff aka mrfred8 aka (Hat tip to Mr. J. Jones!)
http://jalopnik.com/5901950...or-her-sweet-sixteen
- 88 Yellow GT
- 86 Silver SE

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seajai
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Report this Post12-27-2012 09:46 AM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by mrfred8:


Are you going to bring it over to Frazee for the Shipman show, I would love to see this swap.


Plan on attending a few more shows for 2013. Is there a date set yet for Frazee?

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Report this Post12-27-2012 09:54 AM Click Here to See the Profile for mrfred8Click Here to visit mrfred8's HomePageSend a Private Message to mrfred8Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

July 27th - http://www.tylershipmanmemorialcarshow.com/

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seajai
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Report this Post12-27-2012 10:01 AM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Thanks for the link, got it bookmarked.

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Tony Kania
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Report this Post12-27-2012 11:07 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Tony KaniaSend a Private Message to Tony KaniaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Impressive fab skills.

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bmwguru
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I am very impressed.

Dave

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www.hausofguru.com

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tesmith66
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Report this Post12-29-2012 08:10 AM Click Here to See the Profile for tesmith66Send a Private Message to tesmith66Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Love the sheet metal work. You should convert that fuel pump bump into a door or removable panel for easy access. My Grand Prix had an access panel and it was very, very nice when I had to replace the pump.

Good work!!!

------------------
1986 SE Aero coupe.

3.4 DOHC swap is complete and running, now just have to finish the rest of the car...

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seajai
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Report this Post12-29-2012 09:10 AM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Thanks everyone for the great compliments, it really means a lot to me. This is my first venture into metal work and I'm happy it's turning out as good as it is. I thought about making a fuel sender access door but the almost 6" diameter fuel sender would have required me to cut out too much of the structure of the tunnel.

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seajai
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Report this Post12-30-2012 12:33 PM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Got my cover made. Used rivnuts on the frame and attached the cover with #10-32 screws. Think I'll use foam weathertrip to seal it up.

[This message has been edited by seajai (edited 12-30-2012).]

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seajai
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Report this Post12-30-2012 10:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Got the throttle cable hooked up today. I ended up moving the cable pass-through over to the left about 9" from its original position, exiting just above the main cross beam.



The stock Fiero cable was about a foot too short and had a different end on it than the Chrysler, and the stock Chrysler cable was only 3' long. My solution, hook the two cables together. First off, I built a bracket to attach the cables. Second, I cut off the ends of the cables and housings. Luckily both the Chrysler and Fiero cable housings were .250" outside diameter which allowed me to use standard plumbing compression fittings to attach them to my bracket. My fittings came with a small tube designed to slide inside plastic line to keep it from collapsing, I used one of those to crimp the cables together and added some solder to strengthen the connection. I'll probably make a plastic cover to pretty it up a bit.

[This message has been edited by seajai (edited 12-30-2012).]

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PBJ
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Report this Post12-31-2012 09:15 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PBJClick Here to Email PBJSend a Private Message to PBJEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Was not sure what I was going to see when I first saw the thread title. I am impressed, very nicely done!

Pete

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88 3800 turbo...10 sec Quarter Mile Member.

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Report this Post12-31-2012 10:34 AM Click Here to See the Profile for carnut122Send a Private Message to carnut122Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I'm glad to see you're progressing.

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fieroguru
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Report this Post12-31-2012 10:58 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguruSend a Private Message to fieroguruEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Way to think outside the box! I really like the firewall tweak and the throttle cable solution.

My only suggestion for the throttle cable setup would be to make the bracket from C shaped material (like 1x1 tubing with one side removed) with the top/bottom and visible side closed and the open part to access the cables placed along the valve cover. That way the bracket by design keeps the "mystery" hidden, but everything would still be accessible by removing the bracket. I would also suggest some cable slits at the threaded holes so if need be you can remove the cable from the bracket without having to undo their crimped/soldered connection.

Keep up the good work!

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JohnWPB
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Report this Post12-31-2012 12:27 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JohnWPBClick Here to visit JohnWPB's HomePageSend a Private Message to JohnWPBEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by seajai:
Plan on attending a few more shows for 2013. Is there a date set yet for Frazee?


Wow, totally missed this thread till now. I just read every post, all 3 pages to catch up, and subscribed to the thread. Saying this is an ambitious build is an understatement! I do hope you bring it to Frazee in July, as I would love to see it in person!

[This message has been edited by JohnWPB (edited 12-31-2012).]

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seajai
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Report this Post12-31-2012 03:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by fieroguru:

Way to think outside the box! I really like the firewall tweak and the throttle cable solution.

My only suggestion for the throttle cable setup would be to make the bracket from C shaped material (like 1x1 tubing with one side removed) with the top/bottom and visible side closed and the open part to access the cables placed along the valve cover. That way the bracket by design keeps the "mystery" hidden, but everything would still be accessible by removing the bracket. I would also suggest some cable slits at the threaded holes so if need be you can remove the cable from the bracket without having to undo their crimped/soldered connection.

Keep up the good work!


Thanks for the suggestions, it's great having another pair of eyes to look at something. I wasn't completely happy with how it turned out, and your suggestions got the ol' brain cells cooking. So I re-thought the design and here is throttle cable version 2.0. I used a piece of steel plumbing pipe welded to the factory bracket and I cut a slit on the bottom side of the pipe to insert the cable. I'm much happier with this look. Now on to the shift cable!

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Report this Post12-31-2012 05:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguruSend a Private Message to fieroguruEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

That looks 100% better!

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seajai
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Report this Post01-04-2013 12:19 AM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Finished the fab work on the shifter today, and this one took a bit of head scratching to get it done. The challenges here were 2 fold. First, the Chrysler cable had an aluminum housing as part of the cable and mounted to the transmission with a single bolt to a boss cast into the case, so there wasn't anywhere to attach a normal type bracket. Second, the shift arm was set up for the cable to "push" into park, but the Fiero shifter "pulls" the arm into park.

I was hoping to use the Chrysler shifter because it had the "autostick" switch built into it but it just wouldn't fit so I decided to stay with the factory shifter, which means I am going to have to come up with another way to make the autostick work. Plus, the Chrysler shift cable was too short. So using the Fiero shifter and cable, I decided to use the transmission bracket as well. I needed to make a frame to mount the bracket, as well as cut a wedge out of the bracket to change the cable angle. With that accomplished I needed to fabricate a new arm 180deg off from the factory arm to change from a "push" to a "pull". This was a lot of trial and error to get the length of the arm right to make the detentes in the Chrysler trans line up with the stops in the Fiero shifter. In the end, I got P R N oD to line up perfectly, 3rd and 2nd are off slightly but I may just modify the shifter with new stops.

Here are a few pics.





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Report this Post01-06-2013 09:23 PM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Another weekend has come and gone and more progress has been made.

The cooling system on the Chrysler engine has the thermostat on the lower hose as well as a thermostat bypass for the hearer core built into the water neck. The coolant flows from the upper hose through the radiator and back to the lower hose. Coolant flowing through the heater core returns back to the thermostat bypass on the water neck, the surge tank is also on the return/bypass circuit. This is similar to the Fiero heater core return but I needed to return the core all the way back to the engine so I had to plug the fitting on the return pipe. The other issue I have is the upper and lower radiator hook ups on the engine point to the wrong sides of the car. This means the upper hose will be hooked up on the right side pipe and the lower on the left. I will have to switch the connections to the radiator under the front tub to get the flow correct. To make my heater core hard lines I used 3/4" 18ga steel tubing and preformed heater hose to connect everything. The folks at my local O'Reilly's auto parts have been extremely helpful in the project and I was able to go back and look through their selection of hoses to find ones that worked.

Here a few pics of my weekend progress:









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seajai
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Report this Post01-09-2013 10:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Coolant tube for the upper radiator hose, I got lucky and scored some mandrel bent pipe sections. Just need to get a couple more radiator hoses and I'll be able to move another one to the "done" column.







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seajai
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Report this Post01-12-2013 11:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Finished the cooling system modifications today. I have been able to find off the shelf hoses that would work, except for one. I needed a straight piece that was 1.5" on one end and 1.25" on the other but that's not a standard part. Luckily I was able to find what I needed at Speedwaymotors.com The amazing part was, I ordered the hose online at 11pm Thursday night, and 3pm today(Saturday) it was on my doorstep. I've never got a part that quick, and it wasn't anything extra for shipping.



Installed:



The lower hose on the drivers side came from an Olds Aurora V8. I just cut off the 90deg bend on one end.



As explained before, I had to run the upper and lower hoses up the opposite sides of the car because of how the engine was set up. I had to switch sides on the radiator to keep the coolant flow correct. (That's another Aurora hose on the upper.)



I needed to find a smaller surge tank to fit the back of the Fiero because the Chrysler one was huge and the hoses exited in the wrong spots. After a couple hours of walking around the pick-n-pull looking at what seemed like hundreds of cars, I finally found one from a SAAB that fit nicely.



Think I'll try and finish the fuel lines tomorrow.

[This message has been edited by seajai (edited 01-12-2013).]

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engine man
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Report this Post01-13-2013 10:07 AM Click Here to See the Profile for engine manClick Here to Email engine manSend a Private Message to engine manEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Wow this car is coming out nice keep up the great job

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seajai
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Report this Post01-13-2013 10:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Got the fuel line run from underneath up to the engine. Need to run the nylon line from the pump to the steel line yet. I'm quickly running out of space in the engine compartment and I need to make sure I leave enough room for an exhaust system.

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Report this Post01-15-2013 07:12 PM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Sent my PCM off to Arrington Performance today to have the immobilizer programming removed and other things turned off (evap, heated O2 sensors, etc).

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Report this Post01-21-2013 11:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Checked another job off the list. Got the transmission cooler lines hooked up and added a Hayden Rapid-Cool auxiliary cooler. The Chrysler had an external cooler so I figured I better add one to be safe.



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