By checking injector feeds one by one, I've confirmed that all 6 injectors are receiving switched ign +12v, and are correctly connected to the pcm.
Here's the weird part, plugging in 1 injector at a time and cranking reveals that injectors 2, 4, 6 fire every time. 1, 3, and 5 maybe fire once, and then don't. If I plug in the '96 pcm from the lasabre, engine immediately fires up on all 6. I've verified that the '97 firebird pcm has the same grounds and injector pins.
So, at this point, the PCM is either bad, or my bank 1 o2 sensor absolutely NEEDS to be wired up fully before bank 1 injectors will fire.
Is there a good way to test that bank of injector drivers on the PCM? I really don't want to swap the PCM unless I have to, have already paid HPTuners for the license..
[This message has been edited by aaronkoch (edited 08-20-2011).]
Problem fixed! I bit the bullet and purchased a 98 grand prix pcm, repinned both pcm connectors, and fired her up. Imagine my relief when it ran perfectly.. So, now i need to purchase another license for hptuners to disable the emissions and tranny codes, & put the car back together. Wont be long till she's on the road...
Not too much.. Just fixed up a bit of PO wiring, and re-attached and secured the steering column (I really hate crawling in there upside down, especially since I'm 6'4".. ).
I've been busy saving and planning for my trip to GeForce LAN 6 with my oldest son this week. Now that the car is actually almost done tho, I'm getting excited again. It's hard to stay motivated for a multi-year project, but I'm trying very hard to make sure family comes first, before the car. If it takes a while, so be it.
Hey Pal!! How is it going? Still have the Monsoon deck here for you... I have been so tied up with work I haven't talked to anybody save for Tony... Spring is coming... wait for it...wait for it.... yeah right! Spokane, the Siberia of North America...
Ok, now I'm confused.. It turns out I didn't cheap out on the exhaust gaskets, so now I need to do some sleuthing to figure out where the leak is. Hmm. Seems like if it's not one thing, it's 5 others..
I had a couple of hours Saturday to take a look at the exhaust leak. Turns out, Joe's slipping in his retirement years and just forgot to tighten the bolts to the front flange. ROFL. Just need to re-assemble now, and get it aligned. We have a bunch of family stuff happening this week, but maybe this weekend, I'll have the panels on and the interior back in.
Aaron!! How the hell are you? We need to chat just to catch up. Also I need to bring you the Monsoon deck and Stacie's blanket... Which I actually have become attached too.. Miss talking to you.. I know you are close... closer...wait for it...wait for it... I am sick of waiting!!!! I want to see your car
Ok, finally got the battery mounted up front, and got the wiring run. Also, since I fixed the exhaust leak, and Spencer (Shill) came over, I did a quick sound grab video to show you guys why I went with the F-body manifolds. The car sounds a LOT like a stock V6, which in my mind is a great thing.. Especially since 3800's get a pretty bad rap for engine sound.
That's awesome. It can't change the firing order without changing the crank but it changes the exhaust pulses? Do you have any idea if this will work with a Series II or II supercharged?
To answer your question, yes.
Just to clarify, this IS a series II... Also, both the 60 degree v6 (2.8, 3.4, 3100, 3400, 3500, 3900) and the series II and III 3800's all fire a cylinder every 120 degrees of crank rotation. On the 60 degree engines, there is an additional 60 degree splay between cyl 1&2, 3&4, 5&6.
On the series II and III 3800's, they are 90 degree motors, with a 30 degree splay between pistons.
The difference is in the firing order. On a stock 60 deg motor (like the stock fiero), the firing order is 1 2 3 4 5 6. The exhaust goes from the passenger side to the drivers side, so the firing pulses are from the furthest away (to the y-pipe) to the closest. On a stock 3800 exhaust, the pipe is oriented the same way, but the firing order is 1 6 5 4 3 2. This means that the pulses go from shortest to longest. I don't know WHY that makes them sound like poop stock, but they do. The F-body manifolds usually face towards the transmission in an f-body, giving them the same short-to-long pulses. I flipped them, pointing them towards the front of the engine. This means the pulses are 120 degrees apart (just like the fiero's 2.8) and are ordered the same down the tube, so longest pulse, then middle, then shortest -- same as the 60 degree with a stock exhaust configuration is oriented.
You wouldn't believe how many people told me it wouldn't work.. But math usually does.
[This message has been edited by aaronkoch (edited 06-19-2012).]
Sorry, about the routing, I'll have to get pics for you when I go back under. I'm planning on pulling off the exhaust to remove a rattling heat shield, so I'll take a pic of the whole exhaust off the car for you too.
VERY productive day today. I replaced my temporary heater return plug with an actual plug that can tighten down, and ran the car for a while today. Even though it was pushing 90 here today, it ran nice and cool. After about 15 minutes of idling, it hit 195, and the fan came on as programmed. Then, it even shut off after dropping to 180.
So, since I have no more mechanical projects to dive into, I figured I'd get busy on the body. Spencer came over (Shill) and offered me moral support..
I got all the panels on, and fairly lined up. I need to make a run to get some plastic rivets tomorrow, so some of the trim isn't on yet, but it's close....
I really really want to drive to fiero fest on Aug. 10th. Tomorrow I'm tackling the interior.
Shot of driver's side right before I put the hood back on:
Shot from passenger side with my helper buddy:
Don't pick on me for my white panels, when I bought the car the two panels that I've replaced were cracked. I had the white ones off of a parts car, and the whole car will be painted white at a later date, so it worked out well. Looks goofy now, but I just want to drive it.
I built an intake out of 3" PVC, using about 12" of 3" PVC pipe, something called a no-hub adapter, and a Fram CA9345 filter.
The stock L36 intake rubber attachment takes a 3.5" pipe, and 3" ABS/PVC is 3.5"OD, so SCORE. I don't have any exhaust on that side of my motor, so I'm pretty sure it'll stay plenty cool over there for the plastic.
I ran PVC straight from the intake to the "No Hub adapter." The reason I chose this piece is that it slip fits over the 3" pipe, and then has a 3.5" section with a raised lip at the end to ensure that the filter can't work loose.
The filter is a Fram CA9345, and is sealed on one end and a 3.5" slip fit on the other. I had to lube the no-hub adapter with wd40 and stretch it on, and it ain't going anywhere.
Next, I went to work sealing the holes that some ninny cut in the firewall for speakers. I got a tube of seam sealer, cut some panels from galvanized sheet metal, and gooped / riveted the panels on. Done.
Then, I pulled the carpets out of the garage, and all the interior pieces that have been sitting in boxes for years, and cleaned them up. The stupid cats peed on the underlayment, so I had to make new ones from heavy closed cell foam. Then I put in the carpets, and almost died from heat exhaustion. I'm done for the weekend..
Finally, somebody PM'ed me about exhaust routing. I crawled under and took some pics.
Well, it's not painted yet, but it's all back together, and it's getting aligned tomorrow. I took my wife up and down the street for the inaugural drive, and she feels really good.
I would be posting pictures, but it was too dark. It was really hard to be nice on the throttle, the L36 has a really nice torque curve. The motor isn't broken in though, and the alignment is WAAAY off, so I didn't want to tear things up too badly.
Looks like I might make it to NW Fiero Fest this year after all.
3 years, and 3 months, working only in spare time.
I think I gave myself heat stroke yesterday, as I felt like the shaky dead today. But, after lots of water, some exciting moments in the bathroom, and some rest, I dragged myself over to Les Schwab to get the car aligned.
The guy that did the alignment was extremely good at his job, and had me back there a couple of times making sure he was setting it up like I wanted.
Here is the multi-colored (for now) plastic pig waiting to get her screws turned..
And sitting on the rack:
I'm happy to report that everything is awesome. Drives straight, no wiggles, shimmy, vibration, or anything else. I can't believe how smooth it rides, was expecting a bit more unnecessary roughness with poly bushings, lowering springs, and lower profile tires. Oh, and another thing, I absolutely LOVE the 3800's amazing torque profile, and I only have the NA. Granted, Joe Jr. did a BUNCH of cleaning up on the heads, and the exhaust is pretty free flowing, but MAN it feels good.
It's all I can do to keep my foot out of it.
In case you guys run into this, I'll post my stupidity in the hopes it will save somebody else grief. When I first started driving it, I had a high idle. It would start and run fine, but the idle would hover around 1200-1400. I also had a CEL, so I whipped out my bluetooth OBDII adapter and phone, and the only code stored was a "Idle higher than expected." I checked the IAC, all the vacuum lines, and everything I could think of, and no help. I did a quick spray-over with starting fluid to help find the leak, but it never revved, so no leak. Hmmm...
I started searching for 3800 high idle on google, and low and behold, the set screw on the throttle body had been turned WAAAAYY in. I backed it out til it was no longer "helping" the throttle stay open, and the problem immediately disappeared. DOH. At least it was an easy fix.
Also learned an interesting tidbit: The PCM will happily control the radiator fan via the relay and the car runs nice and cool (about 3/8 up the temp gauge, 192 indicated on scanner). I don't have AC in my car anymore, but if I run the engine fan via the AC button on the climate control, the PCM throws a P1656 code when it "sees" the floating relay voltage go to ground. The code reads something like "Fan relay driver voltage not as expected." Guess I'll have to just trust the PCM... It works quite happily on it's own.
I've got 40 miles on the clock today, and no other problems at all. Starts instantly (not even a half a crank), runs SMOOTHLY, pulls evenly, and has the most insanely awesome wail while accelerating with the combination of the free-flowing intake and my weirdo exhaust. I sounds a lot like a 370Z, but deeper. I'll try to figure out a way to get it on video.
Thanks to everybody here in Spokane / Cd'A who helped me so much over the 3+ years it took me to get to this point, Looks like I'll finally have a Fiero at NW Fiero Fest this year again.