Im brand new to the forum. Ive been a member of other forums and know this is where you go to get it right the first time. Ill appreciate any and all advise.
I know there are thousands of threads on this subject but Im getting very confused with everything out there.
I have an 85 GT and just picked up a 3800 II from a 2000 model Park Ave. I have the wiring harness and ECM. My car has a 4 speed manual. I dont know if I should keep the tranny of get something different due to the high rpm's in 4th.
This is about all I know. Im hoping to get some direction. I know there are issues with programming and wiring. Again, brand new, please help! Thanks guys..
Need to decide if u wanna have a manual or auto Fiero. If u wanna keep it a manual then look into swapping the the F-23 and getting rid of the 4 speed. If u want an auto then of course stick with the 65E trans that is mated to the 3800. From there you will need mounts, harness, PCM reprogram, ect for the swap which all can be found on here. Take your time with the swap and do it right the first time so it looks good an performs the same way. I have done many 3800 swaps so if u have any questions feel free to PM me.
Strength wise hard to beat the auto that comes with it but fun wise the manual is nice to drive. being a PA engine you will need a few things from a GTP or Regal engine like the SC belt tensioners and ign mod bracket and the oil filter adapter to fit in the Fiero. If you decide to go manual you will also need a PCM programmed to match but even with auto it is still a good idea to have a matching programmed PCM. Dan
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DARN Cars now open with Over 30 years wiring experience between cars and trade as an avionics technician in both Canadian Air Force and civilian aviation. Over 25 years experience building and modifying cars. Over 10 years of full Fiero engine swaps and harnesses building and still going.
[This message has been edited by FIEROFLYER (edited 08-19-2013).]
The auto that came with the 3800 was trashed from a wreck. Not too bad but bad enough. I could buy another tranny. I like the idea of manual but know Ill probably get tired of it. I really want it to be as simple as possible..
If I get an auto I guess Ill have to replace the shifter and cables??
Yes. You'll need the auto shifter assembly, shift select cable, and there's a few places that sell a cable mount that fixes the fwd to mid engine gear orientation so its not backwards. I'm not sure about the pedal assembly, but you have to change the safety switch I believe, or bypass it.
Even with those changes it may still be a simpler swap than some of the more modern manual swaps, and should be more durable as well. The 4t65e-HD trans is a pretty tough cookie, should never have strength issues unless you go monster tq and beat the piss out of it.
[This message has been edited by EvilSqueezles (edited 08-19-2013).]
Welcome Just did this swap in my 85GT, awesome motor and trans. All the guys above, phonedawgs, mustang and fieroflyer are invaluable when it comes to this swap, they helped me out more than I can say. Good luck with it!!
Thanks a lot guys. Im gonna look for a 4t65e-HD and see what I get. I guess Ill just get the old motor out and get it off the cradle at least. I would like to sell it but it doesnt look like there are a lot of buyers out there. It is a great motor with 62k on it.
Thanks a lot guys. Im gonna look for a 4t65e-HD and see what I get. I guess Ill just get the old motor out and get it off the cradle at least. I would like to sell it but it doesnt look like there are a lot of buyers out there. It is a great motor with 62k on it.
U dont need to use a HD trans..U can use a non HD 65e and not have any issues. This will open up ur options on finding a trans. Alao I suggest picking up a spare cradle to build the swap on so car atleast stays drivable or a roller.
Just throwing this out there, I have an auto trans that i was planning on scrapping just because I don't need it. It has 105,000 miles, 3400 hours on it (Says the computer in the car). Its from an 04' Grand Prix GTP Comp G with paddle shifters. I'd sell it for cheap if you wanted to ship it from 83705. I'd put it on a half pallet, and you could ship via FedEx freight.
Just throwing this out there, I have an auto trans that i was planning on scrapping just because I don't need it. It has 105,000 miles, 3400 hours on it (Says the computer in the car). Its from an 04' Grand Prix GTP Comp G with paddle shifters. I'd sell it for cheap if you wanted to ship it from 83705. I'd put it on a half pallet, and you could ship via FedEx freight.
Trans will not work without alot of work cause of the tap shift.. .I have the same trans just collecting dust in my shop..
You are correct; this is the best place to go for this info.
I am 90% done with my 3800 swap, its my second Fiero engine swap, but I have helped with a few more and even did a few older platform swaps. Most were old Pontiac 400/455 motors (think pre-FI, ECM). I also just pulled/replaced an F40 attached to an LS3, so this is what I recommend.
First. Honestly ask yourself how do you plan to use the car, how often do you plan to drive it, how many miles a year. Do you want an auto or manual trans? Are you going to take it to the track or autocross with it? Then plan out a budget and a timeline. How much of the work are you going to do yourself, how much are you going to “ship out”?
Then double the budget and triple the timeline.
Second. Every, and I mean every question you have, has been asked and answered. Finding the answer is another question. This is what I recommend. Open “Google” and use this formula to find all the information you need.
site:fiero.nl
after the .nl you leave a space, then type the keyword you are looking for. Example
site:fiero.nl 3800, axle site:fiero.nl 3800, harness site:fiero.nl 3800, motor mounts
using this formula will speed things up.
Third. Pick a specific subject, use the formula above and then read, read, read and print. Get yourself a 3 ring binder, and some binder tabs. That way you can separate the sections. Create one for engine, harness, exhaust, axles. (you get the idea). This will be your build book, use it for notes, and write it all down. This has saved my bacon more that once. Also, download and save all the pictures that will help you. Save them into a folder on your desktop, and print them to put in the book.
Fourth. Don’t be afraid to ask for help. Even though all the questions have been asked, you may be seeing it from a different angle, and maybe the other questions didn’t lead to the best answer. Ask away, but be prepared for “trolls, laptop builders, idiots with bad information and then the truth”. Overall you will find that people will answer your question with the correct data, but you have to also bounce it off your own “gut”.
Finally, sometimes you just have to go for it. Do it your own way, design and build your own “thing”. Just because it's always been done a certain way, does not mean that it can be done better, cheaper or different.
But always remember that you’re doing this to have fun. Once it stops being fun I can guarantee that the project will stall and maybe even end up on the “for sale” board. You will encounter some tough spots, just work though them. Go back to your build-book often, and soon you will be amazed how much information you have gathered. Someday, you will be typing this to some young kid who just picked up his first Fiero.
Good luck, take a lot of pics and start a build thread.
Just throwing this out there, I have an auto trans that i was planning on scrapping just because I don't need it. It has 105,000 miles, 3400 hours on it (Says the computer in the car). Its from an 04' Grand Prix GTP Comp G with paddle shifters. I'd sell it for cheap if you wanted to ship it from 83705. I'd put it on a half pallet, and you could ship via FedEx freight.
Great info guys. Thanks. So far my plan is to decide on a trans. I would like a manual but it sounds like an auto would be easier. Any recommendations on a manual? Then I will start thinking about harness and programming. Am I going to have to change axles? Also, I guess Ill need a mount kit. Just trying to number things. 1. Tranny, 2. Harness, etc. Any help with numbering the order in which I should plan would help greatly.
If you stay with a Fiero manual or go with the F23 then stock axles work but for the F40 you need different axles and a jack shaft. Personally I love driving a 3800 Manual Fiero and always prefer it that way but I do not live in a large city with lots of traffic and neither of my Fieros are daily drivers.
I for one had a 4 speed in my old 88 3400 turbo and beat the snot out of it from time to time... that 4 speed was about the only thing that dident give me issues
