It was yet again close to the great ideas on this forum but pretty weird. This car always has to do things a little harder than it should The e brake cable on the drivers side was stuck in the sleeve. I had my Dad come over and he used some pliers to compress the springs on the calipers while I attached all the brake cables together. Once we did that I was able to break the one on the drivers side loose. Its now working! My Subaru wheels still need to have the ring in the center (the hub centering ring) filed down and I'll paint them solid black at the same time.
Anyways I have photo proof of it not in the driveway!!!!!!
It didn't go far with the wheels the way they are so that and checking the lights is whats keeping it from tearing up the town ;-)
I ground down the lip on the inside of the wheels so now they fit over the hubs on the Fiero. It wasn't too hard, I recently got a die grinder and a compressor so that helped a lot. I doubt I could have fixed them as fast or as well without it I also took the opportunity to paint the wheels and I have to say I think they make a huge difference in the cars overall appearance. It looks much less crappy now I also moved it into my backyard parking pad area now that its running and I'm going to try to bleed the brakes again while its on a level surface. Its a pretty fun little car to drive; I just think it needs to have the brakes dialed in a bit more.
Todays project is to get the brakes bled. I got the E brake sort of adjusted, its enough to stop the car on a flat surface but it could use a little more adjustment.
Anyways its a space car now!
Jessica
UPDATE: I bled the brakes and they feel a lot better. Not sure how they should feel, but I think they are good enough to stop the car
[This message has been edited by 78_elky (edited 07-15-2015).]
Well I drove it around the block and the brakes seem to be working well! It died in the driveway kind of randomly and I just left it and went and had dinner. Then I went back out fired it up and drove it around The I turned it off and went to move my truck when I came back to the Fiero it wouldn't start, I ended up having to mat the gas pedal to get it to start and then rev it up for a while. I'm going to try and figure it when/why its dying before I take it on a longer trip (or buy a trip permit from the DMV). Jessica
Um, what is a trip permit? It sounds self-explanatory, but I've never heard of such a thing at the DMV.
Well its like a paper temporary plate that you stick in the window. The car has no plates and the title is from out of state so I have to drive it to the DMV (or tow it) so they can do a visual inspection of the vin and transfer the title. The only issue is that without plates I could get in trouble driving it on the road so the trip permit is the answer. I already have a set of plates to put on it but their registration ran up in 2010 and they were for another car so I hate to put them on and then get pulled over for that. I think the trip permit is just a sneaky way to make $30.
So I've been driving the car around for the last couple days and it idles well (still fast between 1500 and 2500rpm) but when I press on the throttle the engine stalls, sometimes it dies other times not. I've switched the TPS and I've checked the idle voltage; one was .2 one was .37 and the one I adjusted was .5v I then checked my coolant temp sensor and it was showing 70 ohms at 210* and it should be at 480 ohms or something around there. I picked up a new one and I'm hoping that it will help with the high idle problem (not sure that it will but its worth replacing for $17).
If you've got any ideas let me know, I've heard that the car needs to get up to 35mph or more for a little while to reset the computer but I hate to risk driving it to a place thats 35mph just to have it die or get stuck in the middle of the road somewhere haha
Pretty sure. I have the EGR blocked off at the valve and manifold with aluminum plates because the EGR tube was cracked. I pulled the upper and middle intake apart and made sure all the gaskets o-rings and hoses are all new and sealed. The engine idles fine for almost a minute when I first start it but then it ramps up to 2500 or 3000. Also the engine will surge if I pull a vacuum line.
I've tried 2 used TPSs and in both cases I've had the car die and throw a code 22 TPS low voltage error code.
I am going to try a brand new TPS tomorrow.
I also built a cable to use winaldl to see whats going on but so far I'm just getting a comm 1 error. So I've got to get that sorted before its any help to me. I used an old cell phone charger for a power source and a bunch of stuff I had lying around. I did have to get a DB9 to USB adapter, so I'm out $17 Jessica
One of the members on here makes those cables. I'm not sure what the format or conversion is, but it's nice to start with a known working diagnostic tool. Wiring is something I avoid.
Well the TPS fixed the dying issue when I stepped on the gas. Took the car out for its longest drive yet. A few blocks (all in the neighborhood at 25ish) and about 10 minutes or so. Its still idling high at about 1500 or 2000 in gear so I'm going to put a new IAC in and see if that helps because it is showing symptoms of failing when I test it. I'll get the IAC on Friday so I should be able to have it on the road this weekend if it in fact fixes the issues
I'm pretty sure I have those all fixed now. I removed the upper and middle intake and valve covers and resealed it all with new gaskets. I also replaced the pintle caps and O-rings on the injectors and all the other O-rings in the fuel system. If I pull a vacuum line the engine surges until I plug the hole then it goes back to where it was. The engine also runs with a good 700-1000 rpm idle at startup for about a minute but its inconsistent (sometimes it'll be fast other times not) and it ends up increasing idle speed after the initial startup.
I should have the IAC this evening and if that doesn't fix it then I'll go from there.
The car was in a storage locker for 4 years in pieces and it was a mess; before that it "ran but not well" according to the previous owner. He pulled it out of a field that it had sat in for an unknown number of years. Given the dates on the receipts and junk I found in the car it hasn't been on the road since the late 90s. I usually wouldn't try and fix a car by buying new sensors but I'm finding that all the electronics and rubber pieces on this car are in pretty sorry shape.
OK so the list of issues has grown or maybe me driving the car has just shed light on more issues.
Restart after running is very hard Idle is 1300-1800rpm Speedo is pegged at 130mph (odometer also not working, but all other gauges do work) Idles well at 700rpm for about 30 seconds or a minute but then something happens and the idle steadily increases till it is at 2500rpm (cold start in park)
I've deleted the EGR tube so no leak there, and I don't think there are other vacuum leaks because it has all new lines and I've resealed the manifold and injectors. The TPS is new, the IAC is new, the Engine Temp Switch is new, the IAT is new, and all the Ignition components are new.
The only pieces I've not replaced I know of are the O2 sensor and the MAP sensor. Its almost like the engine runs good in open loop but it increases the idle when it goes into closed loop. I jumped the ALDL connector and the idle drops.
Any ideas Fiero gurus?
Jessica
[This message has been edited by 78_elky (edited 07-31-2015).]
Can you elaborate on ”restart after running is very hard”? Lots of cranking, long wait, etc. Does it restart OK if you turn the key to run for 3 seconds, turn it off, turn to run for 3 seconds, then start? One of mine did this. The injectors were leaking. Some cleaning, all good. Another one that did this had a bad ICM. My current one has a bad fuel pump.
For the speedometer, you need to test with WinALDL. If the speed is OK there, test the wiring. If not, time to check the ECM.
May as well replace the O2 & MAP sensors. Never tried on a Fiero, but you could always unplug the MAP sensor to test for any change. Same for the IAC. Did you check the wire for the O2 sensor?
[This message has been edited by tshark (edited 08-01-2015).]
I tried to run the engine with the MAP unplugged and it really didn't make a big difference in the idle speed but it did run very bad.
Restarting the engine is odd; usually it goes just fine but every once in a while it acts like it won't start. I went to the gas station and filled the tank the other day after letting the car warm up and driving around and in the 5 to 10 minutes I sat there the car cooled only a little. I cranked the engine but it wouldn't catch (it felt like trying to cold start a car with a carb and no choke). I gave it a little gas while I was cranking and my the second or third try it fired but didn't sound very good. After driving to the edge of the parking lot to get on the main road it sounded better and didn't feel like it would die when I pulled out into traffic.
The speedometer still doesn't work but I noticed the odometer and trip meter are also not moving at all.
I'm going to investigate the VSS and see how the wiring looks and if its plugged in.
The engine also revs really high unless I lift off the gas and let it shift. If I'm not flooring it and just 1/2 throttle or less it won't upshift until I hit 4500 rpm.
The idle is still high but its almost driveable
Jessica
[This message has been edited by 78_elky (edited 08-06-2015).]
The upshift problem may be related to the TV cable going to your transmission from the throttle body. I changed engines in my 88 and forgot to remove the cable- so it got stretched in the process. Had to adjust it according to info found in the "search" here. Probably best to find the fast idle problem before getting into the transmission issue, however. Keep at it, you will prevail.
The upshift problem may be related to the TV cable going to your transmission from the throttle body. I changed engines in my 88 and forgot to remove the cable- so it got stretched in the process. Had to adjust it according to info found in the "search" here. Probably best to find the fast idle problem before getting into the transmission issue, however. Keep at it, you will prevail.
I inspected the TV cable the other day and the sleeve is frayed and loose at the point it should be held onto the transmission. I also found an adjustment procedure in the Haynes manual I have so I'll do that when I have some time.
I've driven the car since and the idle came down to 1400 rpm according to the tach (I think it is just reading a little higher than it really is). It is pretty driveable at that rpm but I can tell it is still not low enough. Not sure if its a sensor or a vacuum leak but I've kind of fixed/checked all the vacuum leaks as I've gone and there have been a few really big ones so I'd think it was all sealed up by now. Plus the car will start to surge if I pull any vacuum line. Its also running really rich; so there are at least some clues to what is going on. Jessica
You sound very mechanically inclined and I applaud your sense of dedication to the Fiero project. If you can get the car up and running by not investing $1000's then you have made a good choice. Experience has taught me that it was better to spend a bit more and get something drivable than it was to fix up a beater but that's just my way of looking at it. Fiero's are fun cars to dive and it is hoped that shortly you will have your Fiero on the road. Welcome to the forum that has made master mechanics out of ordinary people. BTW, check the EGR tube for leaks (they are very common) and your O2 sensor. if you replace the sensor go with the AC Delco or Denso brand. Those are the only brands that tend to work correctly. Also check all codes. If you take a trip to Autozone they do it for free if they have the older GM scan tool/code reader. ------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
[This message has been edited by Dennis LaGrua (edited 08-18-2015).]
You sound very mechanically inclined and I applaud your sense of dedication to the Fiero project. If you can get the car up and running by not investing $1000's then you have made a good choice. Experience has taught me that it was better to spend a bit more and get something drivable than it was to fix up a beater but that's just my way of looking at it. Fiero's are fun cars to dive and it is hoped that shortly you will have your Fiero on the road. Welcome to the forum that has made master mechanics out of ordinary people. BTW, check the EGR tube for leaks (they are very common) and your O2 sensor. if you replace the sensor go with the AC Delco or Denso brand. Those are the only brands that tend to work correctly. Also check all codes. If you take a trip to Autozone they do it for free if they have the older GM scan tool/code reader.
Yeah I had a huge hole in the EGR tube...so now I have two block-off plates on the openings. I still have everything hooked up correctly but there just isn't a tube for the exhaust gasses to pass through when the valve opens. It isn't ideal but that old tube was pretty much a goner.
I've spent a fair bit on the Fiero at this point but the ones I looked at locally that have been running and driving cars still need a lot of the things I've done to this one or things I still want to do to this one. For instance the brakes on a lot of the ones for sale are old and look questionable, and so do the steering and suspension components. I already went through the brakes and they are now very nice and work well. I plan to replace the steering and suspension on this car before I get an alignment and start driving it more than just test drives around the neighborhood.
I'm pretty mechanically inclined, I'm a mechanical engineer and I have a pretty healthy amount of experience working on cars since I was a kid with my Dad. I'm in the process of doing a frame off restoration on my first car an El Camino. I'm dealing with replacing the rusty floor at this point (oh what fun!)
Has the throttle stop screw been messed with? It is located on the right side of the throttle body on the top next to the cables. It should be sealed from the factory, if its accessible someone prolly tampered with it. Here is a good link on how to adjust it properly. http://www.gmtuners.com/tech/TPS_IAC.htm
Has the throttle stop screw been messed with? It is located on the right side of the throttle body on the top next to the cables. It should be sealed from the factory, if its accessible someone prolly tampered with it. Here is a good link on how to adjust it properly. http://www.gmtuners.com/tech/TPS_IAC.htm
I have 3 throttle bodies at this point and all 3 have the cover intact. The PO said he had an idle hunting problem and it would die. All that was fixed when I took the top end apart and resealed everything. I just have a sometimes high idle. That is a great link, I'm going to do some more reading now
I've been reading about how the ignition is timed and fuel is metered by the computer and I decided to change out the O2 because my research suggested that the MAP and O2 are what keep the computer in closed loop and running the engine smoothly. Once I replaced the O2 the idle dropped a little lower and it doesn't surge up to 2000+ rpm quite as often. I also drove the car again this week and it drove like there was no problems what so ever. If it had been a vacuum leak I highly doubt it could fix itself. This makes me think it may be the MAP sensor (its also the last sensor on the car that is original) because it could be faulty or intermittently failing and causing the high idle.
The problem with getting the car to start after its ran then sat for 5-10 minutes is another issue and my haynes manual says that could be leaking or faulty injectors (I really hope that isn't the case).
Jessica
[This message has been edited by 78_elky (edited 08-30-2015).]
AS far as your injectors, you can run a fuel pump pressure leak down test, you can tell if the injectors are leaking. Hook up your pressure tester, pinch off the fuel return line, turn your key on the pressurize system, turn key off, and watch the fuel pressure for leak down. I think one pound in ten minutes is acceptable
[This message has been edited by notwohorns (edited 08-30-2015).]
AS far as your injectors, you can run a fuel pump pressure leak down test, you can tell if the injectors are leaking. Hook up your pressure tester, pinch off the fuel return line, turn your key on the pressurize system, turn key off, and watch the fuel pressure for leak down. I think one pound in ten minutes is acceptable
Thanks for the how-to, I'll have to try that the next time I'm working on the car Jessica
Jessica I see, you have a bad ass S-10 in your driveway as well. I also used to have one just like it and 2 fieros in my driveway. It's a pleasant surprise to see a female rehabilitate a Fiero. Fiero's are considered cult classics and most regular garage mechanics find it difficult and too specialized to enjoy working on them so the people that are willing to take the challenge and succeed are generally considered people who can fix anything. Most people either hate or love these cars. I wish you luck and on this forum and in the Ogre's Cave you will find all your questions answered plus maybe a few more from curiosity.
Jessica I see, you have a bad ass S-10 in your driveway as well. I also used to have one just like it and 2 fieros in my driveway. It's a pleasant surprise to see a female rehabilitate a Fiero. Fiero's are considered cult classics and most regular garage mechanics find it difficult and too specialized to enjoy working on them so the people that are willing to take the challenge and succeed are generally considered people who can fix anything. Most people either hate or love these cars. I wish you luck and on this forum and in the Ogre's Cave you will find all your questions answered plus maybe a few more from curiosity.
Thanks for the kind words about the S10 Its my crazy little daily driver. I've come to the conclusion the Fiero is definitely a weird car! I'm beginning to really grow fond of it though. It handles as well as or better than my 98 Camaro; and the suspension is completely out of alignment and worn out! I had the Camaro and the S10 along with my El Camino and I found they all felt about the same to drive (not power wise but very similar none the less). I sold the Camaro to fund the restoration on my El Camino but with only one car if I have a failure I'm stranded so I was looking for a nice cheap car to be a backup. The Fiero had a very low entry point but its been fighting me tooth and nail this whole time (and costing me some money too) but it feels completely different than anything I've owned in the past or driven so I'm committed to getting to see how it really is to drive a good one.
I plan to tackle the suspension after I get the engine running consistently. I've come to terms that this will likely be in the middle of the "wet season" here in the Pacific Northwest so it should be a really fun experience to do all this outside. After that I'll worry about the cosmetic issues with the car.
Jessica
Edit: I replaced the MAP sensor and it now runs consistently at a low rpm and better than it ever has. I still have some trouble starting the car when it is warm and it is definitely flooded and the mileage is horrible. I'm going to check the injectors and other fuel systems things tonight if I get home early enough. I also had to pull the drivers side headlight assembly and sand down some new bushings so it would work again. I should have just rebuilt both at the same time but the drivers side seemed to work but made a bad noise. I just need to put the assembly back in the car now. Lots of fun!
[This message has been edited by 78_elky (edited 09-03-2015).]
Well I'm still alive! Still working on the cars. The El Camino has new floors and its looking really great, the body is almost ready to come off the frame even!
The Fiero is also coming along nicely. I really love driving it; its like having a street legal go kart!
Unfortunately its not been running all that great or reliably. I fixed the hot start problems and the running rich problems though. The hot start issues were solved by replacing the coolant temp sensor, and deleting the cold start injector; I did that while I had the intake and everything apart to replace the leaking injectors. Its been a night and day difference with the new parts but I can't seem to get the car to be all that reliable. I also adjusted the TV cable and that helped it to drive out a lot better and not shift so rough. I've been working with my Dad on the car lately and we think its an issue of the IAC not being quite right(maybe I replaced a bad one with a new bad one). Lots of good info on the board to help with all this; I'm pretty confident I'll figure it out soon (I really hope so at least).
I also have some parts on the way and some I got stupid cheap on craigslist that should make the car drive pretty great (and even more like a go kart); so I should have some fun updates soon
Jessica
Oh I almost forgot what do you guys think about these fog lights? They're just sitting there right now for the picture so I can think about how much I like them.
[This message has been edited by 78_elky (edited 09-22-2015).]
Since I'm not familiar with the area, how much fog do you get? I'll admit I like having good fog lights, but I've mostly used them in the rain to help see the lines on the road. Function is my primary concern. Personally, I like the recessed white strip fog lights.
I'm glad you're getting your Fiero's issues worked out.
We get tons of rain here, and a decent amount of fog. Plus I drive through the middle of nowhere to and from work so I like to be able to see well. I used to drive my El Camino with sealed beams (for 10 years straight) and thought they were OK but now I've had better and can't go back. I'll be retrofitting a set of HID projectors at some point but this would be a small help for the time being. I think I'll try to find something to recess into the holes more. I'm not too fond of those fog lights on the Fiero, I just don'tthink they really fit; the fact I've already got them was all that was good about them. Jessica
I think I'm going to pull the front cross member / sub frame to refurbish it and remove the rust. The metal plate below the radiator and some other pieces might have to come out to get de-rustified as well. Might as well do all this now once while the car is apart.
Lots of cleaning and painting in the next few days.
I got the front crossmember out as well as the steering rack and intermediate shaft. Took me about an hour; really not too bad. I think it has taken me 4 hours total to strip the front end, and I've already put in more than double that cleaning and painting the parts I have off the car. I pulled the crossmemeber to make it easier to clean as well as get it in the garage where my welder is. Its a really big welder and getting it into the back yard is a lot more hassle than just removing that part.
Lots of progress on the other parts as well I've removed all the ball joints and bushings from the front parts. The upper arms and sway bar are all redone and ready to go back in the car. The lower arms are ready to be cleaned and stripped to get them ready for paint.
I don't know why all the intermediate shafts are rusty. You can replace the rack boots & clips while it's out...may as well do the tie rods also, re-lube the gears, & rebuild.
I've got new tie rods, ball joints and bushings. I also have Eibach drop springs, so I need to weld the bump stops after I remove an inch or so from the perch. That is what I've read on this forum at least regarding drop springs. I'll also be replacing the ripped boots on the steering rack; and deciding if the isolators need replacing. They looked pretty good when I pulled them. Jessica
I picked up a used media blaster to help clean the odd shaped parts I keep pulling off cars. Its working really well and is a lot better than using the wire brushes on a drill or angle grinder. This was while I was cleaning the front lower A-arms. I'm almost done (ran out of daylight yesterday) with the blasting so I'll be onto painting and reassembly. The crossmember is also all cleaned up now, so I'm going to cut and weld the bumpstops hopefully tonight or sometime before the weekend. Jessica
Hey Jessica! I enjoy reading your Fiero exploits... Here's a pic of the cross member from my '84 SE (it was 'a little weak') and the replacement I got from a wrecker. I sandblasted it and painted it with POR15. Great stuff you might want to try if you haven't already.
[This message has been edited by David Hambleton (edited 10-06-2015).]
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