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A particularly pathological form of idiocy by 2.5
Started on: 01-12-2022 10:19 AM
Replies: 51 (544 views)
Last post by: williegoat on 01-21-2022 10:28 AM
2.5
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Report this Post01-12-2022 10:19 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Wonder whats going on in this world? Why are people so weird these days? When did this happen?

Check it out


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXBjVau1w7Y

Thread marked politics, because everything is politics.

Yes, I do agree with what he says, thats why I posted this particular one.

I would love for you to share and discuss your thoughts, videos, writings, on these topics, theirs effect on society, causes or solutions, just a ramble, tyrade, etc.

[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 01-12-2022).]

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Report this Post01-12-2022 11:37 AM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
What in particular do you agree with?
You go first.
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Report this Post01-12-2022 11:51 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bClick Here to Email ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
the REDS UNDER THE BEDS ARE DEAD
and have been for years

your fool is ranting about 50's fears rerun way too late

maybe he should be on about the rise of the reich
as that is a far more clear and present danger to the homeland
but that would upset the pigs for the rump faction of his cult

maybe he could go on about some real danger
but beating a dead horse is a reichwing theme and is good for fund raising

or I guess he could just get a real job and do something useful ?

------------------
Question wonder and be wierd
are you kind?

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Report this Post01-12-2022 11:53 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by sourmash:

What in particular do you agree with?
You go first.


I don't think I disagree with anything said. Except maybe that post modernists don't care about suffering.
As for proposing solutions, we should learn from this history as it is presented, and stop repeating it before it is too late. Stop suppressing it. How to do that? I suppose one easy to understand general step would be treat people as individuals with individual responsibility.

[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 01-12-2022).]

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Report this Post01-12-2022 11:57 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

2.5

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quote
Originally posted by ray b:

the REDS UNDER THE BEDS ARE DEAD
and have been for years

your fool is ranting about 50's fears rerun way too late

maybe he should be on about the rise of the reich
as that is a far more clear and present danger to the homeland
but that would upset the pigs for the rump faction of his cult

maybe he could go on about some real danger
but beating a dead horse is a reichwing theme and is good for fund raising

or I guess he could just get a real job and do something useful ?



So you dont see the identity politics even happening then? I find it hard to avoid hearing them daily.
I have heard some do say "the devil doesn't exist". "Nothing to see here".

Jordan has opened the eyes of countless youth, he is doing something very important, and calling him a fool is an odd choice to say the least.
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Report this Post01-12-2022 12:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 82-T/A [At Work]Send a Private Message to 82-T/A [At Work]Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ray b:

the REDS UNDER THE BEDS ARE DEAD
and have been for years




Haha! I'd not heard that before.

But incidentally... the person who literally sat behind me at my last job, was an avowed Communist. Believed strongly that this is where we needed to be. His parents escaped from China, but of course, he knows better than them. You would not believe what his job was, and what power he had under his control.
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Report this Post01-12-2022 12:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Gov and media are suppressing the real crimes of certain groups that pose immediate and likely threat to individuals as well as being a threat to society. At the same time they're focusing unrealistic amounts of energy on the limited crimes of others because they know one group is attacking the middle class that the media and gov hates.

A radical mows down a crowd with an SUV and they focus on the vehicle as the perp.
A radical leftist mows down hundreds in Vegas with a gun and we never get a cause.
Radicals burn, loot and murder and we get a new group of feds coming after mom's at school boards complaining that teachers are training non-White children to hate them thru CRT.
A radical lefrist shoots politicians at a baseball game.....on and on..

[This message has been edited by sourmash (edited 01-12-2022).]

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Report this Post01-12-2022 12:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The other aspect to this is many people don't actually have this dire agenda, but they promote it maybe even unknowingly. All the people that might see one hopeful thing in the propaganda and cling to it, so it seemingly justifies whatever else may be. Folks with caring hearts, who perhaps don't look very far down the road to see reprocussions. They can end up being easily lead. Combine that with being opposed to the "other side" that has been demonized, the enemy created because we humans always need one, creating a dog eat dog competition.
I sort of ran into an analogy while typing: The thing about dogs or pets in general, many have been broken and domesticated, they won't do well when the food bowl is removed. Hence my point about individuals and personal responsibility. It seems plain to me we are being divided against eachother, why, because for one reason it weakens us. Also fear makes us react with less thought.

[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 01-12-2022).]

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Report this Post01-12-2022 12:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bClick Here to Email ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 2.5:


So you dont see the identity politics even happening then? I find it hard to avoid hearing them daily.
I have heard some do say "the devil doesn't exist". "Nothing to see here".

Jordan has opened the eyes of countless youth, he is doing something very important, and calling him a fool is an odd choice to say the least.


no the devil is made up boggieman just like your god AND OR HIS SON
THE PURPOSE IS NO [hard] WORK for the preachers aka money for NOTHING

he is huckster selling snake oil cures for IMAGINARY ILLS

WE HEARD THIS BS IN THE 50/60'S from the john birchers funded by the bro's K's daddy
it is just BS rerun but inconveniently the boggieman DIED IN THE MEANTIME

YOUR BOY NEEDS TO FIND USEFUL EMPLOYMENT

------------------
Question wonder and be wierd
are you kind?

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Report this Post01-12-2022 12:35 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ray b:


no the devil is made up boggieman just like your god...

he is huckster selling snake oil cures for IMAGINARY ILLS

WE HEARD THIS BS IN THE 50/60'S ...

YOUR BOY NEEDS TO FIND USEFUL EMPLOYMENT



Talk about the topics. Or perhaps youd rather not.

Really "we" heard about it in the 60s... and you didnt believe it, well look where we are now.

I already replied to how "useful" Jordan has made himself. No doubt youd rather he didn't. Anything else?

Bringing up God doesnt quite change the subject if that was your objective.

[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 01-12-2022).]

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2.5 you like JP.
Ray and sour, you both seem like you aren't too thrilled by him.

Just think.... think of all the time the three of you can save by NOT replying in this thread. all the time saved by NOT back-and-forthing.

also,

Monkeys do NOT have purple armpits.

purple armpits, monkeys don't have 'em.

When you read the word "monkey" or hear the word "Monkey" , a few neurons in your brain will think "Those things don't have purple armpits". FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE.

You're welcome!


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Report this Post01-12-2022 01:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bClick Here to Email ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 2.5:


Talk about the topics. Or perhaps youd rather not.

Really "we" heard about it in the 60s... and you didnt believe it, well look where we are now.

I already replied to how "useful" Jordan has made himself. No doubt youd rather he didn't. Anything else?

Bringing up God doesnt quite change the subject if that was your objective.



EXCUSE ME

you injected the devil I ran with your lead
god vs reds is a fav theme in the reds under the beds school of fear and loathing

but god is dead killed by facts and reason as are the reds granted a few are still moving like zombies tooo unaware they are DEAD
simple when you really understand
IF THERE IS A GOD THERE WOULD BE A RELIGION
but instead we have every one every where gets to make up a religion no two the same
hint where is the god ?

reds scam only worked when and where they held total and absolute power by military take over of a RIGHTWING GOVERNMENT
NO LEFTWING or even moderate centrist government ever became commie anywhere at any time
so a simple effective anti-red plan is never elect a rightwing government wonder why the anti-commies hate that plan ?

yes he is the reichwings useful idiot of the moment they tend to burn thru them ever faster recently

BTW no the demo's flawed as they are
ain't commies
and never have been
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Report this Post01-12-2022 02:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by TheDigitalAlchemist:

2.5 you like JP.
Ray and sour, you both seem like you aren't too thrilled by him.

Just think.... think of all the time the three of you can save by NOT replying in this thread. all the time saved by NOT back-and-forthing.



I find what JP says here to be honest, logical, realistic and informed.

Someone doesnt like him? Why? If it is true and that is a reason, I will say for myself I do not understand how not liking someone is justification for disregarding what they say as false or foolish because they don't like them. Disagree? Fine, either state why or ya... it is kind of pointless to conversate. Sort of just becomes a troll contest against a thread's useful content. It also to me at least shows the perverbial troll has no real argument. But yes, if anyone would like to argue with the arguments, please do.
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Report this Post01-12-2022 03:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

2.5

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quote
Originally posted by ray b:


EXCUSE ME
you injected the devil I ran with your lead

reds scam only worked when and where they held total and absolute power ...

BTW no the demo's flawed as they are ain't commies and never have been


Ah ok, I can get that. But some say "the devil doesnt exist" is what I said. referring to your saying marxism/communism/post modernism doesnt exist. I hear that CRT doesnt exist as well, oddly enough. It wasnt about the devil, the notion was about the claiming (X) doesnt exist. To me replying as you did was an attempt to distract. Oh well I know what you meant at least. I think. Though it still distracts.

Watch the video, yes he said they have moved on to using identity politics as pposed to force. For now.
You injected "reds" you may need to get over it to go on hearing new things.

BTW, like I said some folks are in effect well meaning pawns.

[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 01-12-2022).]

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Report this Post01-12-2022 03:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 2.5:

The other aspect to this is many people don't actually have this dire agenda, but they promote it maybe even unknowingly. All the people that might see one hopeful thing in the propaganda and cling to it, so it seemingly justifies whatever else may be. Folks with caring hearts, who perhaps don't look very far down the road to see reprocussions. They can end up being easily lead. Combine that with being opposed to the "other side" that has been demonized, the enemy created because we humans always need one, creating a dog eat dog competition.
I sort of ran into an analogy while typing: The thing about dogs or pets in general, many have been broken and domesticated, they won't do well when the food bowl is removed. Hence my point about individuals and personal responsibility. It seems plain to me we are being divided against eachother, why, because for one reason it weakens us. Also fear makes us react with less thought.


Dude, you're deluding yourself by feeding on that stuff.

You are not nearly as astute as the founder's were and they prescribed a nation pretty well. Until the 1960s there was a limit on migrants and immigration. The Supreme Court had rulings saying who was allowed to come in what amounts.

Now, all bets are off and it's gonna be a free for all going forward. Those people coming are not concerned with your feelings and ideology of hand holding.

You will NEVER convince Asians in India or China not to self segregate and work in their own interests to take and keep stuff from here. That's about half the global population waiting to take your jobs, money and keep it from you.

Africans are another more than billion people. Look at what happens to non-Africans in South Africa, Somalia, Zimbabwe, etc.. The polite word is "dispossession". They took their farms and told them to leave in some of those. Now in South Africa politicians openly call to murder the Whites. The White Farmers are being butchered. Literally.

The country you've been living in is GONE. You're living on the carcass now.
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Report this Post01-12-2022 04:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bClick Here to Email ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
his whole idea is the slippery slope a little leftest idea grows and can't be stopped as it always slides to the commie total result

problem is it don't ''work'' that way any place ever ! it is a dearly loved MYTH of the RIGHTWING

FACT IS THE REDS GET INTO POWER

ONLY AFTER

A RIGHTWING GOVERNMENT HAS FAILED AND LOST A REVOLT aka civil war
or the germans lost the war in WW2 and the red army invaded a rightwing country like germany

so if no rightwing government no revolution no commies
worked in cuba nic russia and china
then nam and next door

NO left or center government ever went red there is no SLIPPERY SLOPE NEVER WAS

HOW IS THAT FOR A HISTORY LESSON ?
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Report this Post01-12-2022 05:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by sourmash:


Dude, you're deluding yourself by feeding on that stuff.

You are not nearly as astute as the founder's were and they prescribed a nation pretty well. Until the 1960s there was a limit on migrants and immigration. The Supreme Court had rulings saying who was allowed to come in what amounts.

Now, all bets are off and it's gonna be a free for all going forward. Those people coming are not concerned with your feelings and ideology of hand holding.

You will NEVER convince Asians in India or China not to self segregate and work in their own interests to take and keep stuff from here. That's about half the global population waiting to take your jobs, money and keep it from you.

Africans are another more than billion people. Look at what happens to non-Africans in South Africa, Somalia, Zimbabwe, etc.. The polite word is "dispossession". They took their farms and told them to leave in some of those. Now in South Africa politicians openly call to murder the Whites. The White Farmers are being butchered. Literally.

The country you've been living in is GONE. You're living on the carcass now.


"That stuff", you may need to be more specific. You mean the fact that I don't think everyone has the same agenda (or at least realizes they do) and some are just being lead around by their feelings? If you think they all know, then thats ok if you think that, I don't.

The rest of your reply IM not sure I have a bone worth pickin with.
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Report this Post01-12-2022 05:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ray b:

his whole idea is the slippery slope a little leftest idea grows and can't be stopped as it always slides to the commie total result

problem is it don't ''work'' that way any place ever ........


Any idea can grow. I also recommend quit focusing on left/right and D/R, C/L etc. saying this is this and that is that, etc. Look at the individual ideologies, the ideas that literally grew...how they work and don't work and where they lead and have lead. How humans work. You also have a bit of a history problem being compatible with your words.

Refute each of these ideas if you like, the idea, pick a number, the person who complied them numbered them, could be some good points to jump off from if they are actually listened to and understood:


Link to share:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AvsPbOY5Lgg

#4 is quite disturbing
#2 is what equity really means, this is being implemented in many jobs, schools and municipalities already.
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Report this Post01-12-2022 05:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for williegoatClick Here to visit williegoat's HomePageSend a Private Message to williegoatEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Much of what Jordan Peterson says used to be called "common sense". The fact that he has to say it implies that it is no longer common, and that is disappointing.
There are far too many people who have not had the opportunity of experience that develops common sense. I believe this is the result of a life which is too easy. Strength is developed from adversity.
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Report this Post01-12-2022 05:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 2.5:


"That stuff", you may need to be more specific. You mean the fact that I don't think everyone has the same agenda (or at least realizes they do) and some are just being lead around by their feelings? If you think they all know, then thats ok if you think that, I don't.

The rest of your reply IM not sure I have a bone worth pickin with.


The stuff about not letting divisions happen between people. We can be accepting and inclusive and the different ethnicities are going to take everything offered and do less than reciprocate in return.
It's past time to look.out for self interests.
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Report this Post01-12-2022 07:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ray b:

his whole idea is the slippery slope a little leftest idea grows and can't be stopped as it always slides to the commie total result

problem is it don't ''work'' that way any place ever ! it is a dearly loved MYTH of the RIGHTWING

FACT IS THE REDS GET INTO POWER

ONLY AFTER

A RIGHTWING GOVERNMENT HAS FAILED AND LOST A REVOLT aka civil war
or the germans lost the war in WW2 and the red army invaded a rightwing country like germany

so if no rightwing government no revolution no commies
worked in cuba nic russia and china
then nam and next door

NO left or center government ever went red there is no SLIPPERY SLOPE NEVER WAS

HOW IS THAT FOR A HISTORY LESSON ?


You just said the left doesn't cause revolution. But when they do, it's the right's fault.

Lefties intentionally cause a right wing gov (or any gov) failure as a means for revolution.

They invite in hordes of urchins to destabilize. The USA has been doing this recently under left and right presidents.

The left will cause arms races to bankrupt a nation to cause an outcome. One outcome goal has been to install a central banking system. Another was to get the nation under the thumb of private bankers.

The worst examples of human carnage have been left wing examples.
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Report this Post01-12-2022 08:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bClick Here to Email ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by sourmash:


You just said the left doesn't cause revolution. But when they do, it's the right's fault.

Lefties intentionally cause a right wing gov (or any gov) failure as a means for revolution.

They invite in hordes of urchins to destabilize. The USA has been doing this recently under left and right presidents.

The left will cause arms races to bankrupt a nation to cause an outcome. One outcome goal has been to install a central banking system. Another was to get the nation under the thumb of private bankers.

The worst examples of human carnage have been left wing examples.


first I said nothing about why people revolt
just note the before every red take over a bad rightwing government was in charge
the reds have never been able to take over a leftest government or even a centrist one
one finds a jerk rightwing dictator is a prior condition for a red take over to succeed
russian had the king/czar china had Chiang Kai-shek cuba a mob boss called batesta ect


so if one is a real anti-commie not backing rightwing dictators is a simple solution
to prevent commies
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Report this Post01-12-2022 08:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The USA is the liberal, leftist thug overthrowing and destabilizing all kinds of nations. We do it with overwhelming resources or muscle. We are a bully. We installed many dictators.

Our goal is to force degenerate social behavior on traditional or conservative people.

I'm anti Soviet communism. I'm anti-authoritarian and anti-totalitarian.

So, no. Your statement, that dog won't hunt. The US gov proves you wrong.
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quote
Originally posted by 2.5:

Wonder whats going on in this world? Why are people so weird these days? When did this happen? I would love for you to share and discuss your thoughts, videos, writings, on these topics, theirs effect on society, causes or solutions, just a ramble, tyrade, etc.

Hello, 2.5, and hello to everyone else who has shown up here.

I just perused that 7-minute YouTube of Jordan Peterson, and my reactions about the guy are all negative. I'm with "ray b" about this guy. He's a huckster, selling some stale, recycled "Reds Under the Bed" snake oil from the second half of the 20th century. Anyone who repeats the words "Marxism" and "postmodernism" that many times in just 7 minutes can't be making any sense. He should go back to practicing clinical psychology in some real, hands-on kind of way, instead of just bloviating empty theories and generalities like someone who's only complaining about the weather.

Jordan Peterson wants to inflate Identity Politics into an enormously exaggerated boogeyman, instead of trying to think about it rationally.

The question that seems to be on 2.5's mind, time and time again, is "How did we get where we are, as a nation and as a society?"

It's a question that's explored with exceptional insight (IMO) in a recent essay in The Atlantic, from Atlantic staff writer George Packer.
 
quote
George Packer is a staff writer at The Atlantic. He is the author of Last Best Hope: America in Crisis and Renewal, Our Man: Richard Holbrooke and the End of the American Century, The Unwinding: An Inner History of the New America, and The Assassins’ Gate: America in Iraq.

George Packer is age 61. He's also written for The New Yorker, and his New Yorker bio is more revealing:
 
quote
George Packer, a staff writer from 2003 to 2018, has covered the Iraq War for The New Yorker and has also written about the atrocities committed in Sierra Leone, civil unrest in the Ivory Coast, the megacity of Lagos, and the global counterinsurgency. In 2003, two of his New Yorker articles won Overseas Press Club awards—one for his examination of the difficulties faced during the occupation and reconstruction of Iraq, and one for his coverage of the civil war in Sierra Leone. He is the author of several books, including “The Unwinding: An Inner History of the New America,” “Our Man: Richard Holbrooke and the End of the American Century,” and “The Assassins’ Gate: America in Iraq,” which was named one of the ten best books of 2005 by the New York Times and won the New York Public Library’s Helen Bernstein Book Award and an Overseas Press Club book award. In addition, he has written two novels, “The Half Man” and “Central Square.”
He's a man who's seen a thing or two.

I'm going to provide a link to his essay in The Atlantic. I don't think anyone would be blocked from seeing it because they are not a subscriber to The Atlantic. I think it's a "freebie."

"HOW AMERICA FRACTURED INTO FOUR PARTS"
 
quote
People in the United States no longer agree on the nation’s purpose, values, history, or meaning. Is reconciliation possible?
George Packer for The Atlantic; July/August 2021.
https://www.theatlantic.com...our-americas/619012/

Here's how he starts:
 
quote
Nations, like individuals, tell stories in order to understand what they are, where they come from, and what they want to be. National narratives, like personal ones, are prone to sentimentality, grievance, pride, shame, self-blindness. There is never just one—they compete and constantly change. The most durable narratives are not the ones that stand up best to fact-checking. They’re the ones that address our deepest needs and desires. Americans know by now that democracy depends on a baseline of shared reality—when facts become fungible, we’re lost. But just as no one can live a happy and productive life in nonstop self-criticism, nations require more than facts—they need stories that convey a moral identity. The long gaze in the mirror has to end in self-respect or it will swallow us up.

Tracing the evolution of these narratives can tell you something about a nation’s possibilities for change. Through much of the 20th century, the two political parties had clear identities and told distinct stories. The Republicans spoke for those who wanted to get ahead, and the Democrats spoke for those who wanted a fair shake. Republicans emphasized individual enterprise, and Democrats emphasized social solidarity, eventually including Black people and abandoning the party’s commitment to Jim Crow. But, unlike today, the two parties were arguing over the same recognizable country. This arrangement held until the late ’60s—still within living memory.

The two parties reflected a society that was less free than today, less tolerant, and far less diverse, with fewer choices, but with more economic equality, more shared prosperity, and more political cooperation. Liberal Republicans and conservative Democrats played important roles in their respective parties. Americans then were more uniform than we are in what they ate (tuna noodle casserole) and what they watched (Bullitt). Even their bodies looked more alike. They were more restrained than we are, more repressed—though restraint and repression were coming undone by 1968.

Since then, the two parties have just about traded places. By the turn of the millennium, the Democrats were becoming the home of affluent professionals, while the Republicans were starting to sound like populist insurgents. We have to understand this exchange in order to grasp how we got to where we are.

The 1970s ended postwar, bipartisan, middle-class America, and with it the two relatively stable narratives of getting ahead and the fair shake. In their place, four rival narratives have emerged, four accounts of America’s moral identity. They have roots in history, but they are shaped by new ways of thinking and living. They reflect schisms on both sides of the divide that has made us two countries, extending and deepening the lines of fracture. Over the past four decades, the four narratives have taken turns exercising influence. They overlap, morph into one another, attract and repel one another. None can be understood apart from the others, because all four emerge from the same whole.

The first narrative: Free America

Call the first narrative “Free America.” In the past half century it’s been the most politically powerful of the four. Free America draws on libertarian ideas, which it installs in the high-powered engine of consumer capitalism. The freedom it champions is very different from Alexis de Tocqueville’s art of self-government. It’s personal freedom, without other people—the negative liberty of “Don’t tread on me.”

The conservative movement began to dominate the Republican Party in the 1970s, and then much of the country after 1980 with the presidency of Ronald Reagan . . .

Packer discusses the narratives of the "four Americas", starting with Free America, followed by Smart America, Real America, and finally, Just (as in "Justice") America.

These nuggets appear in larger-sized text:
 
quote
Rather than finding new policies to rebuild declining communities, Republicans mobilized anger and despair while offering up scapegoats.
 
quote
The winners in Smart America have lost the capacity and the need for a national identity, which is why they can’t grasp its importance for others.
 
quote
Trump’s populism brought Jersey Shore to national politics. The goal of his speeches was not to whip up mass hysteria but to get rid of shame. He leveled everyone down together.

"How America Fractured Into Four Parts" has been adapted from George Packer’s new book, "Last Best Hope: America in Crisis and Renewal."

"How America Fractured Into Four Parts" pegs the Read-o-Meter at almost a full hour (57 minutes) for an average reader to plow through it attentively from top to bottom. So, kind of a "bad boy", as these online reads go, in terms of length. But I think its length is its virtue, in terms of responding to the question of "How did we get here?"

There are no photographs or images, other than some vaguely virtue signaling artwork like this:

[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 01-13-2022).]

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Report this Post01-13-2022 01:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bClick Here to Email ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
this guy ranting about reds under beds

WHEN

the real THREAT TO THE HOMELAND

is his elk
aka the trumpaloos
who when not trying to stage a putsch
ARE TRY TO DISTRACT WITH this BS
OR about TRANSGENDERS
OR SATAN and the child molesters
or abortion profits
or the fox talking points of the day as paid for by the bro's ''K''

all to distract and deflect
as they try to gerrymander the new districts to cheat harder in the next election
and limit even more voters from their rights by control of the state's rules
and their ID requirements funny when they other wise hate showing their papers to the man

but I think this guy nailed it

''The thing that is complicated is the fact that some people are seemingly OK with the fact that the GOP continues to morph into a criminal enterprise. Demonstrating in court that officials and elected representatives of the Republican Party should be prosecuted under RICO statutes would be a very complicated matter, and runs contrary to every legal tradition in the US, but it’s looking like it might be necessary. :well:



It’s only slightly less complicated to calibrate and deploy a series of prosecutions of the perpetrators of Jan. 6 in a fashion that will prompt a sufficient number of GOP members and officials to wake up to what they are doing to the Party of Lincoln and Teddy et alia and stop.



Mr Garland and Co. are currently engaged in this bi-partisan project, and IMHO it is the duty of every responsible citizen of the United States to support their efforts.
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Report this Post01-13-2022 02:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rinselbergClick Here to visit rinselberg's HomePageClick Here to Email rinselbergSend a Private Message to rinselbergEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ray b:

but I think this guy nailed it
''The thing that is complicated is the fact that some people are seemingly OK with the fact that the GOP continues to morph into a criminal enterprise. Demonstrating in court that officials and elected representatives of the Republican Party should be prosecuted under RICO statutes would be a very complicated matter, and runs contrary to every legal tradition in the US, but it’s looking like it might be necessary. :well:

It’s only slightly less complicated to calibrate and deploy a series of prosecutions of the perpetrators of Jan. 6 in a fashion that will prompt a sufficient number of GOP members and officials to wake up to what they are doing to the Party of Lincoln and Teddy et alia and stop.

Mr Garland and Co. are currently engaged in this bi-partisan project, and IMHO it is the duty of every responsible citizen of the United States to support their efforts.

Who dat say?

[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 01-13-2022).]

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Report this Post01-13-2022 03:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
All the things you support, tay b, are MSNBC and establishment talking points.
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Report this Post01-13-2022 04:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bClick Here to Email ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:

Who dat say?



trick for that

you hi-lite the section and hit google
who will tell you where it came from

in this case a guy on f-1 board posted that

------------------
Question wonder and be wierd
are you kind?

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Report this Post01-13-2022 04:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bClick Here to Email ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ray b:


trick for that [ edit that sometimes works ] failed here no idea why

you hi-lite the section and hit google
who will tell you where it came from [mostly]

in this case a guy on atlas f-1 board posted that named zmeej in the members only section
[thats why no google link found it ]



------------------
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are you kind?

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Report this Post01-13-2022 05:27 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:

Hello, 2.5, and hello to everyone else who has shown up here.

I just perused that 7-minute YouTube of Jordan Peterson, and my reactions about the guy are all negative. I'm with "ray b" about this guy.

Jordan Peterson wants to inflate Identity Politics into an enormously exaggerated boogeyman, instead of trying to think about it rationally.



Some of you keep saying boogeyman, as if they'd really like to convince folks that it doesnt exist. The same seem to be upset that Jordan Petersen says what he says. This is not surprising to me. All the while race baiting is used by politicians and media, and identity politics grow and are implemented into our society and places of work. It is hard ot believe you don't actually notice this.

[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 01-13-2022).]

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Report this Post01-13-2022 05:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

2.5

42575 posts
Member since May 2007
 
quote
Originally posted by williegoat:

Much of what Jordan Peterson says used to be called "common sense". The fact that he has to say it implies that it is no longer common, and that is disappointing.
There are far too many people who have not had the opportunity of experience that develops common sense. I believe this is the result of a life which is too easy. Strength is developed from adversity.


Agreed. Couple that with a society that more and more rewards victimhood and there is little motivation to even learn or think for ones self.
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Report this Post01-13-2022 05:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rinselbergClick Here to visit rinselberg's HomePageClick Here to Email rinselbergSend a Private Message to rinselbergEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
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Originally posted by 2.5:
Some of you keep saying boogeyman, as if they'd really like to convince folks that it doesnt exist. The same seem to be upset that Jordan Petersen says what he says. This is not surprising to me. All the while race baiting is used by politicians and media, and identity politics grow and are implemented into our society and places of work. It is hard ot believe you don't actually notice this.

I have taken notice--big time notice--of the Identity Politics that's become endemic to this country.

There's Identity Politics, and then there's the exploitation of Identity Politics. A certain level of Identity Politics is OK--even a good thing. It's when it goes beyond, and too often it does go beyond, on both sides (or all sides) of the political and cultural spectrum.

My problem with Jordan Peterson is that I see him taking this one aspect of everything that's at play--Identity Politics--but is he blind to everything else that's going on? Is he trying to sweep a lot of other important things under the rug and only talk about Identity Politics?

I wonder what Jordan Peterson thinks about January 6.

You (2.5) have seen and heard a great deal more of Jordan Peterson than I have.

Speaking of January 6, you might want to check the new January 6 thread, because two fairly dramatic news stories about it have just emerged earlier today. I already posted one. I'm about to post the other one. On the January 6 thread.
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Report this Post01-14-2022 09:00 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:
My problem with Jordan Peterson is that I see him taking this one aspect of everything that's at play--Identity Politics--but is he blind to everything else that's going on? Is he trying to sweep a lot of other important things under the rug and only talk about Identity Politics?
.


No. He experienced a sort of perfect storm, where someone with his background in psyche, and who also studied history, was being told (among other things) what he was allowed to say. When he said no, it got noticed, this created a platform. Other important things? We cant all fight against every injustice at once.
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Report this Post01-14-2022 09:45 AM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadClick Here to Email olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ray b:

the REDS UNDER THE BEDS ARE DEAD
and have been for years

your fool is ranting about 50's fears rerun way too late

maybe he should be on about the rise of the reich
as that is a far more clear and present danger to the homeland
but that would upset the pigs for the rump faction of his cult

maybe he could go on about some real danger
but beating a dead horse is a reichwing theme and is good for fund raising

or I guess he could just get a real job and do something useful ?



BS - the Reds under the Bed are almost in control of this nations governments - at all levels.

And rayb, you are one of them.
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Report this Post01-14-2022 10:25 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bClick Here to Email ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
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Originally posted by olejoedad:


BS - the Reds under the Bed are almost in control of this nations governments - at all levels.

And rayb, you are one of them.


you mistake the ranting of the reich-wing for facts

the fakenews has been accepted as gospel by the gullable

just a truth break in the mounting BS here
NO COMMUNIST GOVERNMENT EVER REPLACED A LIBERAL GOVERNMENT
EVERY COMMIE TAKE OVER WAS FROM A RIGHTWING GOVERNMENT
THE PROVEN WAY TO PREVENT A COMMIE TAKE OVER IS DO NOT HAVE A RIGHTWING GOVERNMENT

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Report this Post01-14-2022 10:26 AM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:


BS - the Reds under the Bed are almost in control of this nations governments - at all levels.

And rayb, you are one of them.


ray b means that he understands that the only thing preventing a totalitarian/authoritarian takeover in our lifetime is the right wing population.
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Report this Post01-14-2022 10:39 AM Click Here to See the Profile for blackramsClick Here to Email blackramsSend a Private Message to blackramsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'd be very interested to learn ray b's attitude toward such things as the current election/voting bills currently being pushed, social entitlements and the Defund the Police movement........

Rams
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Report this Post01-14-2022 11:42 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bClick Here to Email ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
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Originally posted by blackrams:

I'd be very interested to learn ray b's attitude toward such things as the current election/voting bills currently being pushed, social entitlements and the Defund the Police movement........

Rams


I think all citizens should be required to vote and FINED if they do not
we should be able to vote by phone computer mail or any other quick convenient way
BTW i THINK EVERY BIG LAW RULE ECT SHOULD BE UP FOR THE VOTE

no idea what you call ''social entitlements'' welfare '' for the rich perhaps ?

cops need TO BE UNDER CONTROL,
NO IMMUNITY FOR ANY ACTIONS, FOLLOW THE LAW LIKE EVERYONE ELSE
STOP STEALING PEOPLE'S MONEY AND PROPERTY WITHOUT REAL COURT HEARINGS
CHURN THE RANKS BY FIRING THE BOTTOM 10% EVERY YEAR
LIMIT COP UNIONS POWER
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Report this Post01-14-2022 02:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ray b:


you mistake the ranting of the reich-wing for facts

the fakenews has been accepted as gospel by the gullable

just a truth break in the mounting BS here
NO COMMUNIST GOVERNMENT EVER REPLACED A LIBERAL GOVERNMENT
EVERY COMMIE TAKE OVER WAS FROM A RIGHTWING GOVERNMENT
THE PROVEN WAY TO PREVENT A COMMIE TAKE OVER IS DO NOT HAVE A RIGHTWING GOVERNMENT



Humans use the tools at their disposal to gain and move power around, they'll use those tools no matter what label is on their head, R, D, C, L, etc. Watch for the ideologies not just which label you think is using them. As I said before don't focus so much on the labels. Thats a big part of how we are artificially divided.

But yes, the fakenews has been and will always be accepted as gospel by the gullible.


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