Not in this state, but he was on the bar of the previous state we lived in while in grade school. He was also a business owner in the area. He was also a person that would have made an example of a situation like that. We were taught to stand up for ourselves ( and think for ourselves ), and he would support such an act.
And trying to get close to the topic he would have been all over the school with this girl in the topic too.
Just thinking it does make a difference to have a person like that behind what you do. It can give you freedoms others dont have as well.
Grandparents too stupid to understand a simple dress code. Yes, quite sad.
quote
Originally posted by maryjane:
It's what caused the problem. The kid should never have been enrolled there by the grandparents if they were'n't willing to follow the rules that were in place at the time of enrollment or if they were just too stupid to understand the rules.
I whole heartedly agree. None of the other issues matter, you want to attend this school, this is the uniform. Don't like it, go some where else. Wouldn't matter if the boys were required to wear kilts and the girls all had to wear Nun's Habits. Pick the uniform you find most appealing or ridiculous, it really doesn't matter. That's the uniform. Parents and guardians or in this case grand parents are the reason this child isn't going to school where she wants to attend based on what's reported in the story. Although, I would also say that it must not be all that important to the little girl or, she'd follow the rules.
Some folks don't like rules, it doesn't really matter to me but, if it's my ball, we're gonna play by my rules or, I'll take my ball somewhere else and have fun with those who will follow the rules. Don't like it, go find your own ball.
------------------ Ron Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun?
My Uncle Frank was a staunch Conservative and voted straight Republican until the day he died in Chicago. Since then he has voted Democrat. Shrug
Parents and guardians or in this case grand parents are the reason this child isn't going to school where she wants to attend based on what's reported in the story. Although, I would also say that it must not be all that important to the little girl or, she'd follow the rules.
Some folks don't like rules, it doesn't really matter to me but, if it's my ball, we're gonna play by my rules or, I'll take my ball somewhere else and have fun with those who will follow the rules. Don't like it, go find your own ball.
Maybe I'm dense but I do not see where she broke the rules. Is it a dress-code violation? I do not see that mentioned. They are allowed to wear pants there.
Maybe I'm dense but I do not see where she broke the rules. Is it a dress-code violation? I do not see that mentioned. They are allowed to wear pants there.
She doesn't conform. She must be excommunicated from the order, like any good cult would do.
[This message has been edited by User00013170 (edited 03-27-2014).]
Originally posted by Boondawg: So, they could actually go beyond what the book "allows"?
Yes, as it is a private school.
quote
Originally posted by Boondawg: My curiosity lies within the statement "the biblical lifestyle". What is that?
What is this "biblical lifestyle"? And who's calling it? Is it in the book?
I'm serious...because if it ain't in the book, then just who is saying what is & isn't "the biblical lifestyle".
The Bible ... is a lesson, teaching of God. Basic Information Before Leaving Earth The Biblical lifestyle also included sinners ... prostitutes, homosexuals, thieves, adulterers, etc. The who whom is calling it is the school's governing body. Their desires of a Biblical lifestyle is just their interpretation of it. Just as different denominations of religion interpret differently, some being more strict for instance, no one individual can claim to know the true and correct meaning of all the words of the Bible. Which is why one would pray for understanding before reading the Bible. Some of it could be considered cryptic. I have gotten two or more different lessons from the same passage, at different times.
[This message has been edited by cliffw (edited 03-27-2014).]
The who whom is calling it is the school's governing body. Their desires of a Biblical lifestyle is just their interpretation of it. Just as different denominations of religion interpret differently, some being more strict for instance, no one individual can claim to know the true and correct meaning of all the words of the Bible. Which is why one would pray for understanding before reading the Bible. Some of it could be considered cryptic. I have gotten two or more different lessons from the same passage, at different times.
We all understand that. But can you pinpoint what exactly this girl has done to be singled out and kicked out of the school? All I see that she is guilty of is being fat and having a bad haircut.
My curiosity lies within the statement "the biblical lifestyle". What is that?
What is this "biblical lifestyle"? And who's calling it? Is it in the book?
I'm serious...because if it ain't in the book, then just who is saying what is & isn't "the biblical lifestyle".
Long form answer
1 Timothy 2 - 3:
"First of all, then, I urge that requests, prayers, intercessions, and thanks be offered on behalf of all people, even for kings and all who are in authority, that we may lead a peaceful and quiet life in all godliness and dignity. Such prayer for all is good and welcomed before God our Savior, since he wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth. For there is one God and one intermediary between God and humanity, Christ Jesus, himself human, who gave himself as a ransom for all, revealing God’s purpose at his appointed time. For this I was appointed a preacher and apostle – I am telling the truth; I am not lying – and a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and truth. So I want the men to pray in every place, lifting up holy hands without anger or dispute.
Likewise the women are to dress in suitable apparel, with modesty and self-control. Their adornment must not be with braided hair and gold or pearls or expensive clothing, but with good deeds, as is proper for women who profess reverence for God. A woman must learn quietly with all submissiveness. But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man. She must remain quiet. For Adam was formed first and then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman, because she was fully deceived, fell into transgression. But she will be delivered through childbearing, if she continues in faith and love and holiness with self-control.
This saying is trustworthy: “If someone aspires to the office of overseer, he desires a good work.” The overseer then must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, an able teacher, not a drunkard, not violent, but gentle, not contentious, free from the love of money. He must manage his own household well and keep his children in control without losing his dignity. But if someone does not know how to manage his own household, how will he care for the church of God? He must not be a recent convert or he may become arrogant and fall into the punishment that the devil will exact. And he must be well thought of by those outside the faith, so that he may not fall into disgrace and be caught by the devil’s trap.
Deacons likewise must be dignified, not two-faced, not given to excessive drinking, not greedy for gain, holding to the mystery of the faith with a clear conscience. And these also must be tested first and then let them serve as deacons if they are found blameless. Likewise also their wives must be dignified, not slanderous, temperate, faithful in every respect. Deacons must be husbands of one wife and good managers of their children and their own households. For those who have served well as deacons gain a good standing for themselves and great boldness in the faith that is in Christ Jesus. I hope to come to you soon, but I am writing these instructions to you in case I am delayed, to let you know how people ought to conduct themselves in the household of God, because it is the church of the living God, the support and bulwark of the truth. And we all agree, our religion contains amazing revelation:
He was revealed in the flesh, vindicated by the Spirit, seen by angels, proclaimed among Gentiles, believed on in the world, taken up in glory."
Paul, the Apostle to the Gentiles and former Pharisee, is instructing Timothy, a young spiritual leader, how to guide his flock. Direct cultural references aside (braids aren't as big a deal now as they were then), Christians are to hold themselves to a higher moral character in a spirit of humility and modesty. You have enough experience on the Forum to know that we who profess Christianity often falter against this ideal. Often we show to the world a greater sense of pride than we should - I am certainly guilty of this, and it weighs on me as I have this year been appointed a Deacon. This has caused additional introspection, to which I hope that improvement on my part shows. That notwithstanding, we are not to be provocative and live in peace in our surroundings. We are to pray for everyone, our friends on the Forum, our neighbors, even President Obama. That said, we are also to be "peculiar," "salt and light," in this world. We are ambassadors for Christ, and we are to model Him, not the world.
Each school/church/whatever should prayerfully consider things like dress code, and I know that in our school, it has had its tweaks over the 13 years our family has been there. I have always been comfortable as a jeans and tshirt type (other than when I work on a Sunday - darn that retail lifestyle), but I stick out like a sore thumb as a Deacon, so here, I am convicted by nobody else but me to conform to what should be expected of me being in a leadership role. The grandparents, in this case, should consider what is important to them, in this case. Sometimes, the public school route works. Given the state of Weymouth Public Schools, my wife and I decided that we would go bankrupt keeping them where they are. OTOH, a few towns away, my son's best friends (twins) believe that they are placed at Hull High as missionaries to their friends.
Romans 8:28 is as good a closer as any: "And we know that all things work together for good for those who love God, who are called according to his purpose,"
Likewise the women are to dress in suitable apparel, with modesty and self-control. Their adornment must not be with braided hair and gold or pearls or expensive clothing, but with good deeds, as is proper for women who profess reverence for God. A woman must learn quietly with all submissiveness. But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man. She must remain quiet.,
I dare you to tell that to my wife....i'll even kick-in your Emergency Room bill!
I dare you to tell that to my wife....i'll even kick-in your Emergency Room bill!
Rules in the Bible are written for believers. If she is not, she doesn't have to worry about what I or anyone else thinks. If she is, then she still doesn't have to worry, except for what her Lord and Savior thinks. Even then, it likely doesn't change over night. I am very much a work in progress.
One of my favorite "extra biblical" sayings: "God uses cracked pots."
Originally posted by css9450: ... can you pinpoint what exactly this girl has done to be singled out and kicked out of the school?
Not that I care but wearing jeans is a violation. She was kicked out ? I just skimmed the article and it is not worth doing so again. I read the grandparents took her out of school.
Originally posted by css9450: Nowhere did it say she wore jeans. If she did wear jeans, the article would mention it, I would think. And if that were the case, then I'd have to agree there was a violation.
The article inferred it, but true, it did not say she did.
quote
Sunnie Kahle, 8, sports a short haircut, likes to wear jeans and T-shirts ... She ... steered clear of any disciplinary issues, save for her desire to wear boy’s pants as part of her school uniform. (According to the school’s dress code, both elementary boys and girls are allowed to wear pants, but only boys are allowed jeans.)
quote
Originally posted by css9450: Just "boy's pants". At age 8, is there a difference between pants?
Yes. Even at age eight, girl's dress pants/slacks don't have zippers at the crotch, come in the color pink/purple/etc, but can also look like boys pants. With her short hair and a preference to wear pants, she was being confused with actually being a boy. The school does have a rule against practicing an alternative gender identity. Some religions require women to have their head covered by a habit, some include a covering of the face. Some believe women should have long hair. Other students could infer an alternate gender identity, or have their image of gender identity clouded. People pay big money to place their children in private school, in addition to still having to pay for public education. They pay to ensure their children are raised in an environment they prefer and the school advertises an environment. Screw the little tike and fark her grandparents. Let them ignore rules and go to public schools if they so choose. She should be able to maintain a 4.0 grade average. The life lessons from a public school, which they once had hoped to avoid, must not be that important to them.
Yes. Even at age eight, girl's dress pants/slacks don't have zippers at the crotch, come in the color pink/purple/etc, but can also look like boys pants. With her short hair and a preference to wear pants, she was being confused with actually being a boy. The school does have a rule against practicing an alternative gender identity. Some religions require women to have their head covered by a habit, some include a covering of the face. Some believe women should have long hair. Other students could infer an alternate gender identity, or have their image of gender identity clouded. People pay big money to place their children in private school, in addition to still having to pay for public education. They pay to ensure their children are raised in an environment they prefer and the school advertises an environment. Screw the little tike and fark her grandparents. Let them ignore rules and go to public schools if they so choose. She should be able to maintain a 4.0 grade average. The life lessons from a public school, which they once had hoped to avoid, must not be that important to them.
You're jumping to conclusions. The article says she "likes to wear jeans and t-shirts". True. But that can probably be said of every kid in that school.
The school dress code is very specific: Relevant passages in bold.
quote
All TCS Students
Must wear TCS uniform shirt from TCS uniform vendors. May wear an extra tee shirt or turtleneck underneath their uniform shirt that does not have the TCS logo as long as only the collar and/or sleeve areas show, and the shirt is of a solid color, like a uniform shirt, with no printing. May wear any official TCS jacket, fleece, sweatshirt, or sweater over uniform shirt. Students may also wear a solid color fleece, full-zippered sweatshirt (no pullovers), jacket or sweater over the uniform shirt but these items must have no writing, printing, or pictures. Jean jackets are not acceptable for classroom wear. All oxford style shirts must be worn tucked into the pants, slacks, or skirt with no shirttails hanging out. No hats, caps, sweatbands, sunglasses or visors are to be worn in the school buildings. No extreme hair styles or unnatural or extreme hair colors. Shoes with laces must be tied. No flip-flops, shoes with wheels in/on them, or bedroom shoes may be worn.
Elementary Girls (K-5)
May wear solid navy, khaki/sand, white, brown, gray, or black skirt or jumper or a denim jean skirt that is in good condition (no patches, no “destructed,” bleached out, or extremely faded fabric). Jumpers must be worn over a TCS shirt. These items must come at least to the top of the kneecap (grades 3-5). Skirts must have straight hems—no diagonal or handkerchief hems are permitted. May wear slacks in khaki/sand/stone, white, brown, navy, gray, or black (no jeans or denim pants). These must be classic, traditional pants (no warm up or sweat pants). Capri’s, gauchos and culottes are not permitted for regular school day dress. May wear casual shoes—flats, loafers, sandals, conservative boots, tennis shoes in good condition, etc. No athletic-sandals, shower/water sport shoes, slippers, or combat-style boots. Girls may not wear any backless shoes/sandals or shoes with heels over 1 inch. May not wear make up.
Pink or purple "girls pants" are against the rules also.
If she was indeed in violation of those items I bolded, why didn't the school come out and say so? Why don't they say "on Monday and Tuesday of this week she showed up in jeans and a t-shirt" or "her green hair is a distraction in class"? No, instead they remind the grandparents that the issue isn't about the girl's hair or clothing. So what is it? Is it somehow her fault she has an unflattering haircut? Like I said, she probably got that haircut at home. Maybe her grandparents spent all their money on tuition and don't have $20 or $40 or whatever it costs for girls at a salon these days. Give her six months or a year and her hair might like look all the others.
Instead the school is jumping to the same conclusion that you are. What evidence is there that she is "practicing an alternative gender identity"?
We had a girl just like her when I was in elementary school. A big girl who liked sports, which at an age where everyone is still growing made her the best athlete in class for a couple years. She had the same short haircut that this girl does, which really stood out in the 70s when everyone had long hair. Eventually all the other kids caught up with her and today she is normal size, normal height and is happily married with two kids or her own. Fortunately we didn't go to an oppressive religious school which might have jumped to the conclusion that she was going to turn into a lesbian or change her gender or some other nonsense like this school is doing with this girl.
[This message has been edited by css9450 (edited 03-28-2014).]
I think it's funny how so many want to infer this or that. It's a "PRIVATE" school, They have rules, follow the rules or, go to school somewhere else.
Obviously, they don't want a non-conforming attendee. LIke it or not, it is, what it is.
Life has rules we all have to live by, break the rules and you may get away with it but, if and when you get caught, don't whine about it.
I agree with Don, the grandparents are the problem. 8 year olds don't get a vote. That doesn't mean their desires shouldn't be considered and even allowed at times but, I'll repeat it.
8 Year Olds Don't Get A Vote. Parenting is the toughest job on earth. If you're trying to rear a child to be a responsible, caring and contributing adult as the end result.
------------------ Ron Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun?
My Uncle Frank was a staunch Conservative and voted straight Republican until the day he died in Chicago. Since then he has voted Democrat. Shrug
Originally posted by css9450: If she was indeed in violation of those items I bolded, why didn't the school come out and say so?
Why ask me ? The school did not kick her out. They say that they have worked with and cared for her for years to assist her to conform to what they believe are traditional values. Who cares if they are right or wrong in what they believe to be traditional values ? Those that do can elect not to go there. I hope the little girl is scarred for life, because that is what life does to you. It will be a teaching experience for her, about rules, authority, and rights ... of which the private institution also has. They advertise an environment and even mere appearance matters. My brother had to hope his kids were accepted where he wished to place them.
quote
Originally posted by css9450: Instead the school is jumping to the same conclusion that you are. What evidence is there that she is "practicing an alternative gender identity"?
Evidence, ? What is the legal definition of that behavior ? As I said, in an advertised environment even the appearance of such matters.
quote
Originally posted by css9450: Fortunately we didn't go to an oppressive religious school which might have jumped to the conclusion that she was going to turn into a lesbian or change her gender or some other nonsense like this school is doing with this girl.
I hope the little girl is scarred for life, because that is what life does to you. It will be a teaching experience for her, about rules, authority, and rights ... of which the private institution also has. They advertise an environment and even mere appearance matters. My brother had to hope his kids were accepted where he wished to place them.
Evidence, ? What is the legal definition of that behavior ? As I said, in an advertised environment even the appearance of such matters.
Scarred for life? Because of a bad haircut? You keep mentioning rules and authority but all I see is a bad haircut.
I'm fine with rules but don't punish kids if they haven't broken any.
It scares me to think of it, but this school probably has a long waiting list. Maybe its in the best interest of the school to chase away or discourage or kick out those who are not attractive enough to meet their high standards, which it seems this is really all about. Sad.
Maybe its in the best interest of the school to chase away or discourage or kick out those who are not attractive enough to meet their high standards, which it seems this is really all about. Sad.
You read this whole thread and that is what you think?
[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 03-28-2014).]
Originally posted by css9450: Scarred for life? Because of a bad haircut? You keep mentioning rules and authority but all I see is a bad haircut. I'm fine with rules but don't punish kids if they haven't broken any.
No, not for a bad haircut. For getting "booted out" of school, and a religious school to boot, and for having a bad haircut. I hope she grows up both hating and respecting authority. I hope her outcome creates a desire to become authority. As well as an understanding that society has norms. Everybody needs to learn the lesson of life that you don't get it your way. That people who grant privileges can take them away. Back at what Boondawg was was not understanding ... about the minimum rules ...
quote
Originally posted by Boondawg: The part "counter to or in opposition to the biblical lifestyle. This includes, but is not necessarily limited to," stumps me. So, they could actually go beyond what the book "allows"?
The kid and the grandparents were warned. Over the course of a few years. This was not a rule violation. It was a behavior violation. Recruits are booted out of the military all the time because they are deemed undesirable, not because they broke any rule.
quote
Originally posted by css9450: It scares me to think of it, but this school probably has a long waiting list. Maybe its in the best interest of the school to chase away or discourage or kick out those who are not attractive enough to meet their high standards, which it seems this is really all about. Sad.
Since we are forcing me to wear my psychiatrist's hat, let's explore your phobia. Why does it scare you ? Why is it sad ?
quote
Originally posted by maryjane: I had another comment, but opted at the last moment for "Why say anything?"
Scarred for life? Because of a bad haircut? You keep mentioning rules and authority but all I see is a bad haircut.
I'm fine with rules but don't punish kids if they haven't broken any.
It scares me to think of it, but this school probably has a long waiting list. Maybe its in the best interest of the school to chase away or discourage or kick out those who are not attractive enough to meet their high standards, which it seems this is really all about. Sad.
Its not about beauty, its about unwavering obedience. If they want them to walk off a bridge in the 'name of your god', without a second thought. Clearly this girl is showing signs of independent thinking, which can not be permitted in an environment like that.
It used to be called heresy and you were tortured and then killed.. now its called 'breaking the rules' and you are kicked to the curb.
Its quite simple really: "Faith" is a human construct created due to the inability for most people to cope with their own morality, and a lack of understanding of the universe. Organized religion was created to capitalize on that in order to scam the 'faithful'. More theft, death and destruction has occurred due this abuse of people than anything else in our history. Clearly a 'god' wouldn't allow his 'flock' to rape and pillage at will, in 'his name'. ( unless hes a sadist, then all bets are off )
[This message has been edited by User00013170 (edited 03-28-2014).]
Here is the letter the school sent to the grandparents: http://ftpcontent.worldnow....T_60114032514080.pdf It appears to have been an ongoing issue and the kid was in counseling for her 'identity issues'. I wonder if the counselor's advice was contradictory to the school's beliefs...
To you and i, a red bandanna in a pocket may mean nothing more than what it seems to be, but to kids these days.. it can mean a LOT more.. and the uniforms try to avoid all that mess.
That said, we are also to be "peculiar," "salt and light," in this world. We are ambassadors for Christ, and we are to model Him, not the world.
? What is the legal definition of that behavior ? As I said, in an advertised environment even the appearance of such matters.
.
