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front lower Ball Joints by itzikbns
Started on: 03-12-2024 10:22 AM
Replies: 11 (207 views)
Last post by: Patrick on 03-14-2024 04:03 PM
itzikbns
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Report this Post03-12-2024 10:22 AM Click Here to See the Profile for itzikbnsSend a Private Message to itzikbnsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Hi there,
I have ordered a new front lower Ball Joints, I press fit them to the lower control arms, but when I tight the castle nut (should be max 140 NM) it went way down below the hole for the split pin, since I am a cool guy I immediately panicked and ordered a new set from RockAuto... but now I have two issues, it's not a press fit to the L.C.A, only secured with a c clip ring, and still same issue with the castle nut, where I tight it down to the pin hole level, nearly with no tightening force and secured the castle nut with a split pin, is it OK?
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Frenchrafe
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Report this Post03-12-2024 02:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FrenchrafeSend a Private Message to FrenchrafeEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The ball joints should be press fitted. They have a serrated part that "bites" into the control arm logement.
The c-ring/clip is just for extra security. The joint must be press fitted otherwise they are not the right ones.
For the castle nut, I have noticed that the "cheaper" ball joints have "shallower" nuts (less tall).
I just reused my original nuts which lined up fine with the split pin hole.

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itzikbns
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Report this Post03-12-2024 03:23 PM Click Here to See the Profile for itzikbnsSend a Private Message to itzikbnsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks, I sent a mail to Rockauto to understand, it should be press fit and I don't understand how this could be... thanks for the tip regarding the original nut, I will try, did you manage to actually torque the castle nut to spec w/o lowering the nut too much?
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Patrick
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Report this Post03-12-2024 03:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by itzikbns:

I have ordered a new front lower Ball Joints, I press fit them to the lower control arms, but when I tight the castle nut (should be max 140 NM) it went way down below the hole for the split pin...


I don't understand why you'd be having an issue with the castle nut going down too far, but assuming there's nothing wrong somewhere (ball joint, nut, knuckle?), couldn't you just use an appropriate thickness washer to bring the castle nut up high enough for the cotter pin to engage the nut?

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 03-12-2024).]

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pmbrunelle
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Report this Post03-12-2024 05:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pmbrunelleSend a Private Message to pmbrunelleEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
You do not have to torque the castellated nut to 140 Nm. You can torque the castellated nut up to to 140 Nm if needed to align a castellated nut slot with the cross-hole in the stud. The nut still needs to be reasonably tight though.

 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:
couldn't you just use an appropriate thickness washer to bring the castle nut up high enough for the cotter pin to engage the nut?


Yes, that is a good idea, but seeing as this is a critical spot, I think a good quality (hard metal, and parallel flat faces) washer should be used, such as ARP.

[This message has been edited by pmbrunelle (edited 03-12-2024).]

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itzikbns
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Report this Post03-13-2024 12:15 AM Click Here to See the Profile for itzikbnsSend a Private Message to itzikbnsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks all,
I used a washer at the first assembly, it looked better but I wasn't comfortable with it...I will use a proper washer, but apparently I have bigger issue, I tried placing the previous BJ to the hole in the LCA and they all (3 sets, including the original) are now entering the hole in the LCA w/o press, it looks like pressing the new BJ extended the holes in the LCA, it did took like 6 tons of press to press the BJ to place, now I would probably need to buy new LCAs...unless there is a better idea
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Patrick
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Report this Post03-13-2024 12:42 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by itzikbns:

...now I would probably need to buy new LCAs...unless there is a better idea


If the ball joint is loose in the LCA, I believe you can tack-weld them in place.

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itzikbns
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Report this Post03-13-2024 12:53 AM Click Here to See the Profile for itzikbnsSend a Private Message to itzikbnsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
thanks, I will
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pmbrunelle
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Report this Post03-13-2024 05:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pmbrunelleSend a Private Message to pmbrunelleEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
How much bigger are the original ball joints compared to the new ball joints? I'm wondering how much smaller the hole would need to be.

Tack welding alone is probably a bad idea; the press-fit is the usual retention, with tack welding sometimes added as a backup.

You might be able to weld a bead around the press-fit area of the LCA. When the hot weld bead shrinks, the diameter of the hole should be reduced. I don't know if the diameter reduction will be enough for you.

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If you find a solution to the castle nut problem, then you should be able to use the newer larger ball joints in the enlarged holes of your LCAs?
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Patrick
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Report this Post03-13-2024 06:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by pmbrunelle:

Tack welding alone is probably a bad idea; the press-fit is the usual retention, with tack welding sometimes added as a backup.


I'm definitely not an expert on this... but I've been led to believe from what I've read here over the years, that due to the way the ball joints, knuckles and LCAs all work together, that the lower ball joints are actually being pulled into the LCAs through associated forces, not pushed out. So, in other words, as long as the ball joints are relatively secured in place (and can't be pulled through the hole), there shouldn't be any problem. Am I wrong?

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 03-13-2024).]

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itzikbns
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Report this Post03-14-2024 01:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for itzikbnsSend a Private Message to itzikbnsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
All,
Thanks for all the fruitful ideas, I manage to solve the issue, apparently, the first set I receive were at the upper spec of the diameter and it took 6 ton of pressure to press them in to the LCA, what probably expended the hole in the control arm, and thus, the second set moved in freely, I went back to the first set, it still required force to be pressed to the control arm and I tack-weld them as well, I used a spring washer for the castle nut and it is now well placed the even secured with torque
I would like to thank RockAuto, they are professionals and customer oriented, not only when you buy but when there are issues (rarely happens with them, I ordered more than 20 times with zero problems), they will refund me for my expenses,
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Patrick
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Report this Post03-14-2024 04:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Glad to hear it all worked out!
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