I plan on doing an LTG swap into my '88 Formula over the next couple of months. I have a fairly good understanding of everything required other than the transmission. I want to use the 6 speed F40 however from what I've researched, it appears the LTG uses a "High Feature" bolt pattern. Are there different bolt patterns from different F40 transmissions? (As in, do I need the F40 from a Saab vs one from a G6?) Thanks,
Forum member Roger Thelin makes many of the parts needed to do the Ecotec swap but only for certain model years and certain transmission choices. On your planned swap I would just try to use the transmission that came with that engine . Also bear in mind that the LTG engine is of a direct injection type that may present challenges in powertrain control management.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, P-log Manifold, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, Champion Radiator, S10 Brake Booster, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
I plan on doing an LTG swap into my '88 Formula over the next couple of months. I have a fairly good understanding of everything required other than the transmission. I want to use the 6 speed F40 however from what I've researched, it appears the LTG uses a "High Feature" bolt pattern. Are there different bolt patterns from different F40 transmissions? (As in, do I need the F40 from a Saab vs one from a G6?) Thanks,
Why do you believe that the LTG has the High Feature bolt pattern? It is my understanding that only the High Feature engines use that bolt pattern.
Forum member Roger Thelin makes many of the parts needed to do the Ecotec swap but only for certain model years and certain transmission choices. On your planned swap I would just try to use the transmission that came with that engine . Also bear in mind that the LTG engine is of a direct injection type that may present challenges in powertrain control management.
I wasn't aware of any FWD MT platforms that this engine came in. I could be wrong though. Are they that similar to the previous 2.2 ecotec/ And using the GM ECU kit for the engine.
quote
Originally posted by Daryl M:
Why do you believe that the LTG has the High Feature bolt pattern? It is my understanding that only the High Feature engines use that bolt pattern.
I started searching. Complete face palm. I was originally contemplating an LFX swap, hence getting confused about the bolt pattern.
From my research on mating up transmissions to the high feature v6's, the F40 came in 3 bellhousing configurations, 60degV6, Ecotec, and High Feature V6.
The LTG did come in the Buick Regal 2.0T and was mated to an F40 with the ecotec pattern... hit up ebay for Buick F40 transmissions to get a good look at the ecotech bolt pattern..
I had an LY1 ecotech F23 that I tried mating up to a high feature v6... the alignment pins work but the rest is way off....waaay off....
From my research on mating up transmissions to the high feature v6's, the F40 came in 3 bellhousing configurations, 60degV6, Ecotec, and High Feature V6.
The LTG did come in the Buick Regal 2.0T and was mated to an F40 with the ecotec pattern... hit up ebay for Buick F40 transmissions to get a good look at the ecotech bolt pattern..
I had an LY1 ecotech F23 that I tried mating up to a high feature v6... the alignment pins work but the rest is way off....waaay off....
Originally posted by msweldon: the F40 came in 3 bellhousing configurations, 60degV6, Ecotec, and High Feature V6.
The F40 came in at least 1 other bellhousing (possibly more): Opel Turbo Diesel. The starter for that one is over the differential:
There is also at least 2 different bolt boss patterns on the differential, so transmission mounts are not universal. The bracket in the picture fits the G6 version, but not the other one. The Regal is like the one in the picture and doesn't match the G6 version.
The front side of the transmission is equally different between the G6 and other F40s. The 4 large bolt bosses commonly used for F40 transmission mounts with the G6 version don't exist on the Regal and other versions. This is the non-G6 version:
There is also at least 2 different shifter mounting bolt patterns (3 Bolt G6, 2-bolt Regal, some other models mix and match...)
Lastly there is at least 2 different clutch line connection types G6 version is different than the Regal version. The G6 one comes out of the bellhousing horizontal, the Regal and some other exit the bellhousing vertical.
LTG and all Gen II Ecotec (Gen II as we call them inside GM), the ones with the exhaust and intake flipped from the earlier Ecotecs, have a unique bell housing pattern. Chevy performance sells/sold a manual and auto trans setup for it, as well as a FWD F40.
Any concerns about overheating? These motors are known to run hot. I am very interested in an LTG swap too because it's a great motor, very tunable, and most importantly - LIGHT, but the heat issue gives me a bit of pause. I have this motor in my Cadillac and it's smooth as silk (2017 CTS). BNR tuned with some minor additional mods will yield 300 hp easy, and it will do it hundreds of pounds lighter than a 3800 SC.
As others have mentioned, they do mate the LTG with a FWD 6 speed in the Buick Regal. Also, GM makes a standalone harness but I'm not sure if it only works with the performance LTG motor they sell (waaaay too much money IMO).
Any concerns about overheating? These motors are known to run hot. I am very interested in an LTG swap too because it's a great motor, very tunable, and most importantly - LIGHT, but the heat issue gives me a bit of pause. I have this motor in my Cadillac and it's smooth as silk (2017 CTS). BNR tuned with some minor additional mods will yield 300 hp easy, and it will do it hundreds of pounds lighter than a 3800 SC.
As others have mentioned, they do mate the LTG with a FWD 6 speed in the Buick Regal. Also, GM makes a standalone harness but I'm not sure if it only works with the performance LTG motor they sell (waaaay too much money IMO).
Keep us updated!
My goal now is to source a wrecked 2012/13 Regal GS as a donor car. Right now there's one in NM on copart but I'm not excited about shipping it across country.
I'm not worried about the heat aspect; I can always do cooling upgrades. Also, car will be more of a road toy than anything so doubt it will be taxed all that hard.
Originally posted by RandomTask: My goal now is to source a wrecked 2012/13 Regal GS as a donor car. Right now there's one in NM on copart but I'm not excited about shipping it across country.
Note that the 2012 and 2013 2.0T Regal used the European-derived LHU engine. In 2014, the Regal switched to the LTG engine.
------------------ Steve Mushynsky
1984 Fiero 2M4 34K miles
1986 Fiero SE I4 (donor now) Lots of good miles. One very bad mile.
1987 Fiero Tried to kill me (gone to a 'better place') Prior owner failed to tighten a bolt. Trailing arm separated at 70 mph
I plan on doing an LTG swap into my '88 Formula over the next couple of months. I have a fairly good understanding of everything required other than the transmission. I want to use the 6 speed F40 however from what I've researched, it appears the LTG uses a "High Feature" bolt pattern. Are there different bolt patterns from different F40 transmissions? (As in, do I need the F40 from a Saab vs one from a G6?) Thanks,
Time to pick up the pace! I love fiero swaps !
What made you pick the ecotec LTG, vs V8, vs 3800? Are there any other swaps that you considered. Just curious.
Thanks & good luck! Dime.
------------------ 84/87 NB, 3800SC, E-85, VS Cam, 2.8 Pulley, 4T65E-HD, HP Tuners, AEM Wideband, Regal GS Gauges, S-10 Brake Booster. 1/4 mile -11.85 at 114mph
[This message has been edited by DimeMachine (edited 12-23-2019).]
Any concerns about overheating? These motors are known to run hot. I am very interested in an LTG swap too because it's a great motor, very tunable, and most importantly - LIGHT, but the heat issue gives me a bit of pause. I have this motor in my Cadillac and it's smooth as silk (2017 CTS). BNR tuned with some minor additional mods will yield 300 hp easy, and it will do it hundreds of pounds lighter than a 3800 SC.
As others have mentioned, they do mate the LTG with a FWD 6 speed in the Buick Regal. Also, GM makes a standalone harness but I'm not sure if it only works with the performance LTG motor they sell (waaaay too much money IMO).
Keep us updated!
So is this hot running just an LTG thing? Early Ecotecs do not have that problem. I have never had an engine that ran so consistent temperature wise as the Ecotec in my car. Heat is something I barely think about.
------------------ 86 GT built 2.2 ecotec turbo rear SLA suspension QA1 coilovers on tube arms
Modern engines generally have a higher operating temperature than older engines. 215 is the new norm, vice the traditional 195. This makes them more thermally efficient.
That does not mean that they engines are "running hot"... they're running as designed. Like wftb said above, the thermal stability of modern engines is better than ever. That's one of those "baked in" improvements that's hard to see, yet took a lot of effort on the OEM's part to get there.
[This message has been edited by Will (edited 12-24-2019).]
