Hello All,

Was feeling pretty good about changing the clutch myself. Got the cradle back up and slid in the drive shafts. With the transmission in gear (any gear - R, 1, 2) I can free spin the drive shafts.

Here's what I can tell you. The flywheel was resurfaced and he had to take .060 off. I put a .050 shim behind the flywheel. When I installed the disc and the pressure plate, the bolts snugged up about 1/2 way in. I then sequentially tightened those bolts. I did not try to move the clutch disc, but every indication was that the pressure plate was putting force on the clutch disc against the flywheel.

The transaxle is currently drained of fluid. I replaced the two output shaft seals. They were not easy to get in and took some pretty good banging - but they did go in and seal nicely from what I could tell.

I was concerned that maybe, somehow the clutch slave cylinder was actually applying pressure and freeing the clutch so I loosened the two bolts on the bracket and made sure there was no pressure there. I grabbed the clutch arm and I could easily move it back and forth a bit - so I don't think there is anything jammed up related to the throwout bearing.

I'm just at a loss. What could possibly be keeping the transmission from locking up?

Thanks for any ideas. I really don't want to have to drop the damn thing again.

Steve

Did you compare the old clutch and throw out bearing with the old ones?? Iike throw out bearing length, clutch finger length, etc?

I compared the throwout bearing because the first clutch kit I got had the wrong bearing in it. I did not measure the height of the fingers. However I could tell when I disconnected the clutch slave cylinder that there was no pressure on the arm. My problem isn't disengaging the clutch - it's that the clutch is engaged as far as I can tell, the transmission is in gear, but when I put the drive shafts back in they spin freely.

Did you use a clutch disc alignment tool? Can you verify the release bearing is still on the fork? Dealing with a clutch replacement at the moment as well. How are you engaging gears? At the shifter or by hand at the transmission?

Its a good idea to remove the slave cylinder from the transmission to make sure that there is no interference. Alignment of the disc should be not be real critical as the flywheel does not use a pilot bushing and transmission shaft does not fit into it (V6). Center the disc with an alignment tool
If the transmission does not easily join to the engine. Check for disc alignment but first try to manually see if it is possible to fit the disc on the transmission shaft. It is possible that you may have the wrong disc. Then check for an exact match by comparing the new pressure plate to the old. If its the proper disc the trans input shaft must rotated so that the end fits into it. This can be done by rotating the entire transmission by hand a bit. If the transmission is in gear then it becomes difficult to align the shaft to the disc. Make sure that the input shaft spins freely.

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quote Originally posted by smulder: I compared the throwout bearing because the first clutch kit I got had the wrong bearing in it.

How did you determine that? The throw-out bearing needs to match the transmission fork (not the engine) and some can be put on backwards very easily.

quote Originally posted by Gall757: How did you determine that? The throw-out bearing needs to match the transmission fork (not the engine) and some can be put on backwards very easily.

The first t.o. bearing had the wrong inner bore and did not fit the input shaft. Even though the vehicle is an '86, I had to order a clutch kit for an '85 to get the proper parts. I'm assuming I have an early '86. In any case, the bearing was identical to what was being replaced. The bearing surface was facing the clutch/engine side when I put it back in. In any case, I can move the clutch are slightly with the slave loosened which would indicate that things are not jammed up. This is a weird problem because it's not about disengagement. At the drive shaft, even in gear, the drive shafts spin freely. The only way for that to happen is for the clutch to be disengaged, but every indication is that it is engaged and that the pressure plate is pushing the disc against the flywheel.

quote Originally posted by smulder: The first t.o. bearing had the wrong inner bore and did not fit the input shaft. Even though the vehicle is an '86, I had to order a clutch kit for an '85 to get the proper parts. I'm assuming I have an early '86. In any case, the bearing was identical to what was being replaced. The bearing surface was facing the clutch/engine side when I put it back in. In any case, I can move the clutch are slightly with the slave loosened which would indicate that things are not jammed up. This is a weird problem because it's not about disengagement. At the drive shaft, even in gear, the drive shafts spin freely. The only way for that to happen is for the clutch to be disengaged, but every indication is that it is engaged and that the pressure plate is pushing the disc against the flywheel.

Do the shafts rotate in the same direction, or in opposite directions?
Did you remember to lock one wheel when checking engagement?
In other words, the differential is doing its job.

Crash

quote Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua: Its a good idea to remove the slave cylinder from the transmission to make sure that there is no interference. Alignment of the disc should be not be real critical as the flywheel does not use a pilot bushing and transmission shaft does not fit into it (V6). Center the disc with an alignment tool If the transmission does not easily join to the engine. Check for disc alignment but first try to manually see if it is possible to fit the disc on the transmission shaft. It is possible that you may have the wrong disc. Then check for an exact match by comparing the new pressure plate to the old. If its the proper disc the trans input shaft must rotated so that the end fits into it. This can be done by rotating the entire transmission by hand a bit. If the transmission is in gear then it becomes difficult to align the shaft to the disc. Make sure that the input shaft spins freely. Thanks for the reply. I used the alignment tool to align the clutch disc when I put on and tightened down the pressure plate. I supported the transaxle and guided it in with two, 3" bolts threaded into the engine side with their heads cut off. I had to wiggle things slightly, but then the shaft when through the clutch disc and the transaxle easily slid into place and was all the way against the mating surface. So, every indication was that the input shaft when through the clutch disc and in no way did I need to use the bolts to tighten up or "draw" the transmission to the engine. At this point, I believe the problem can only be that the clutch disc is spinning freely which seems unlikely unless I'm really missing something. But, I can't figure out what I might have done to the transmission to screw it up. There is no transmission fluid in the transaxle but in a manual transmission I can't imagine that affecting anything. I'm just trying to find out any ideas before I have to disconnect everything and drop the cradle again and pull the transmission.

The '86 is a problem because of the change in transmissions. Parts stores list the 5 speed and ignore the fact that most cars got the 4 speed M17 for the V6 (Which I assume is what you have).

quote Originally posted by viperine: Did you use a clutch disc alignment tool? Can you verify the release bearing is still on the fork? Dealing with a clutch replacement at the moment as well. How are you engaging gears? At the shifter or by hand at the transmission?

I did use the alignment tool. I can't see to verify the bearing is still on the shaft, but I was careful and cautious putting it back together and it feels like it. I've engaged the gears both with the shifter and by hand.

You're OK!

quote Originally posted by smulder: Hey Crash, I think I might be a moron. So, if I put the transmission in gear, the shafts rotate opposite from each other. I had my son hold one drive shaft while I moved the other. If he held on tight, my side did not spin freely (so we were fighting each other). So, I think I'm ok. If I put the strut/control arm/wheel bearing assembly back on both sides and if I lock up one side and the other side doesn't spin freely I should be good?

No, not a moron, been there done that the first time I worked on a differential years ago...
I still remember the laughter!