I came across this thread https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/109963.html and did some searching but I was not able to come across anything definitive- Was anyone ever able to track down any information about this exhaust? I would really like to have more information.
I was mostly wondering if anyone has any better pictures or description or has replicated the results- I have to say I'm a bit dubious as to actually achieving that sound.
It looks to me like they took the middle cylinder for each bank and merged it with the two from the opposite bank. I'm not clear if then the two groups are run into a single pipe and then split out to duals or if they ran duals from the merged pipes.
On my 88 Mera I searched for a Ferrari sounding exhaust sound. I tired a few different things. What sounded the best and it is what I have on my 88 Mera is an aftermarket converter, kept the 2" pipe for faster exhaust flow, no muffler, a Y pipe to split into dual exhaust where the original exhaust pipe entered the factory muffler and dual resonator tips. I used a pair short Ansa dual resonator tips which are no longer available. Does not sound like a real Ferrari but sounds somewhat exotic. I wanted to offer exhaust kits to do this. IRM used to sell a system like this using Hooker resonator tips.
------------------ Rodney Dickman
Fiero Parts And Acc's Web Page: All new web page!:www.rodneydickman.com Rodney Dickman's Fiero accessories 7604 Treeview Drive Caledonia, WI 53108 Phone/Fax (262) 835-9575
Damn, I just realized it's a SBC in that Fiero. Oh well, I'll leave the clip here anyway.
Now that is what Rodney needs in his Mera. But seriously, it would be great to find out more details about the Taiwan exhaust and to know if those sound clips are on the level. I've never heard a pushrod V6 sound like that. I have a Flowmaster 80 series and have replaced the cat with a resonator feeding dual resonated tips (Monza in this case, I think the Ansas would sound similar) and it sounds good, but more muscle car than exotic. And every Fiero V6 I have ever heard has the same sort of lumpy loping idle (great if you want the muscle car sound again but does not suit the more exotic look of the Fiero).
The car in question has a much higher pitch idle and overall tone. Someone in a related thread mentioned that it sounded like the Infinity V6 in a G35 or G37 and I agree. It seems like only overhead Cam V6 engines produce that kind of sound which is why I'm hesitant to believe my ears with that soundclip.
Maybe I'll just have to swap in a set of 180 degree headers (with an LS engine between them).
Thanks for the replies- Still hoping some further info surfaces.
I understand. I just wanted to post the best sound I could come up with in case you were not successful and had to go to the next best option.
------------------ Rodney Dickman
Fiero Parts And Acc's Web Page: All new web page!:www.rodneydickman.com Rodney Dickman's Fiero accessories 7604 Treeview Drive Caledonia, WI 53108 Phone/Fax (262) 835-9575
I do appreciate your input. How loud is your setup? I tried something similar but used a glasspack style resonator where the cat goes and even using the resonated tips it was too loud for me but did have a nice tone when revving the engine.
The "Taiwan Fiero" exhaust is custom built to sound as it does. Nobody else has a Fiero with a stock 2.8 that sounds like this, because nobody produces a kit with such an exhaust setup. It is however perfectly possible to make the exhaust sound this way with a custom tuned exhaust designed to sound and flow this way. Exactly in the same way that the 180 degree header setup works on the SBC (but of course designed around a 60 degree cross plane sequential fire V6 instead).
Pairing 1 & 5 is fubared, so probably anyone else who builds an exhaust will have the sense NOT to do that.
Therefore, if someone builds their exhaust correctly, it is unlikely that the cool sound will be duplicated.
180 degree headers on a V8 on the other hand, are a good thing.
Honestly I don't think it would be any worse than dumping into a log manifold at a 90 degree angle like the stock setup does and it would be worth the work to get that sound.
Correct me if I'm wrong but it looks like they merged 1 and 5 and then merge with 3 (same on the other side: Merge 2 and 4, then merge with 6). It looks like those two merged exhausts then merge (2 into 1) and then feed a resonator and then split out again to dual outlets? I may try this on an engine on a stand and see if I can get that sound. Seems to me if this actually works someone could really sell these! (not that I want to, but given the failure rate of stock exhaust manifolds it seems there would be a market).
Originally posted by dobey: Exactly in the same way that the 180 degree header setup works on the SBC...
Actually, regular headers on the 60-degree V6 will work just like 180-degree headers on a V8. The purpose of the 180-degree headers on the V8 is to even out the exhaust pulses (because the V8 is an odd-fire engine). But the 60-degree V6 is even-fire already. No funky exhaust routing necessary.
The exhaust on that Taiwan Fiero is intentionally designed to disrupt the evenly-timed exhaust pulses. It's basically the opposite effect from 180-degree headers on a V8.
[This message has been edited by Blacktree (edited 03-30-2017).]
This won't help much, bt the best sounding Fiero I recall was my turbo 88 GT, which used a low restriction CAT and resonator and that's all. It was possible because a turbo on its own acts as a silencer and tones down the rap you'd otherwise get.
Darned thing sounded like a Dino Ferrari (also a V6).
Honestly I don't think it would be any worse than dumping into a log manifold at a 90 degree angle like the stock setup does and it would be worth the work to get that sound.
Correct me if I'm wrong but it looks like they merged 1 and 5 and then merge with 3 (same on the other side: Merge 2 and 4, then merge with 6). It looks like those two merged exhausts then merge (2 into 1) and then feed a resonator and then split out again to dual outlets? I may try this on an engine on a stand and see if I can get that sound. Seems to me if this actually works someone could really sell these! (not that I want to, but given the failure rate of stock exhaust manifolds it seems there would be a market).
Now if I could just get my hands on a Mera.....
The sound may be worth it... that's a judgement call. The exhaust may be no worse than the original logs; who knows?
Here's another hypothesis: the engine ran poorly, and the car was mothballed because the engine didn't run correctly?
I think that lots of trial/error would be needed to get the exhaust sounds right.
I'm going to make a exhaust for my Fiero based on functional requirements, and the sound is going to be what it is... I know I will need a muffler for noise requirements, but that's as much as I can predict, sound-wise.
quote
Originally posted by dobey:
How so? The firing order is 1-2-3-4-5-6, so pairing in this manner to get equal length headers makes pretty decent sense.
The cylinder opposite in the firing order to #1 is #4.
Originally posted by pmbrunelle: The cylinder opposite in the firing order to #1 is #4.
Here are the complementary pairs: 1/4 2/5 3/6
You seem to be assuming the goal is to create 180-degree headers. As previously mentioned, this is not required on the 2.8, due to the firing order, and equal length exhaust will give the same note/performance benefits as you would get with 180 degree headers on a cross plane V8.
In other words, the exhaust isn't really "paired off" as the 1-5 "pairing" might suggest, but seems to be a means to getting a shorter equal length header setup.
[This message has been edited by dobey (edited 03-30-2017).]
I have the Design One turbo on my 88 Mera. It more or less sounded the same before and after I installed the turbo. The converter is a very good muffling device. I tried many things. Mine is is medium/somewhat loud but IMO not obnoxious. Resonator tips do seem to loose their fiberglass packing over time. Mine sounded somewhat better when I first installed it. If I put in new resonator tips it would probably have a somewhat better quality sound again. I have a pair of Ansa replacement tips but it is hard to replace them so I probably won't.
------------------ Rodney Dickman
Fiero Parts And Acc's Web Page: All new web page!:www.rodneydickman.com Rodney Dickman's Fiero accessories 7604 Treeview Drive Caledonia, WI 53108 Phone/Fax (262) 835-9575
I have the Design One turbo on my 88 Mera. It more or less sounded the same before and after I installed the turbo. The converter is a very good muffling device. I tried many things. Mine is is medium/somewhat loud but IMO not obnoxious. Resonator tips do seem to loose their fiberglass packing over time. Mine sounded somewhat better when I first installed it. If I put in new resonator tips it would probably have a somewhat better quality sound again. I have a pair of Ansa replacement tips but it is hard to replace them so I probably won't.
Rodney,
I have also found that the "Italian" style resonated tips loose the packing after a while and don't work as well (also, if you car runs really rich it seems to load up the fiberglass with carbon also reducing the sound deadening).
I know the Ansa's are original equipment on many Italian exotics but the Pacesetter Monza tips work just as well and are much easier to find. Just repaint the yellow Monza tips with the orangish/red that the Ansa tips come with and I doubt anyone would know the difference. JM2CW.
On my 88 Mera I searched for a Ferrari sounding exhaust sound. I tired a few different things. What sounded the best and it is what I have on my 88 Mera is an aftermarket converter, kept the 2" pipe for faster exhaust flow, no muffler, a Y pipe to split into dual exhaust where the original exhaust pipe entered the factory muffler and dual resonator tips. I used a pair short Ansa dual resonator tips which are no longer available. Does not sound like a real Ferrari but sounds somewhat exotic. I wanted to offer exhaust kits to do this. IRM used to sell a system like this using Hooker resonator tips.
What's described above is very similar to the actual Taiwan exhaust except the original had custom resonator and headers.
I was working to get close to the Taiwan Fiero's sound and used 2.5 inch Truleo headers, 18 inch Vibrant resonator, 2.5 inch dia. custom made exhaust w/ Delta 40 style muffler and dual resonated tips.
This won't help much, bt the best sounding Fiero I recall was my turbo 88 GT, which used a low restriction CAT and resonator and that's all. It was possible because a turbo on its own acts as a silencer and tones down the rap you'd otherwise get.
Darned thing sounded like a Dino Ferrari (also a V6).
I had a 240Z with a resonator only and the exhaust tip was a twin (stacked) 18"-ish long U-shaped tip. It sounded very much like the video Fiero. Should be simple. The tone was incredibly rich. Not a drone sounding Flowmaster. Opened up, the song was beautiful. It sounded just as good revving down as revving up.
[This message has been edited by sourmash (edited 04-07-2017).]
So I appreciate all of the replies- especially the person who provided the info from the setup in question but I remain very skeptical that the "taiwan exhaust" note in the vids is actually a Fiero 2.8L.
I have never, repeat, never come across any Fiero with any exhaust setup (reflection or absorbtion type muffler) that is even close to this setup. From what I have seen documenting this exhaust nothing described would lead to such a unique exhaust note at idle or revving up. To me it sounds almost exactly like a Nissan/Infinity VQ35 or VQ37 engine. The fact that no one seems to have been able to replicate this sound reinforces my opinion.
There are lots of great sounding Fieros out there, but none sound like this.
Oh well, I'll leave the clip here anyway.
