So the 3800, whether in Series II, III, with or with the supercharger was a great upgrade for the Fiero. But, it is old. All I see around ten year old engines available that are questionable mechanically.
What other engine options are there? Within the last five or six years that will work with the Fiero?
There are guys who are smarter on this than I am, but there are a few reasons that the 3800 is still the dominant engine swap choice
1. Cost. You can get a whole donor car for $500-1000 easily for a 3800. On top of that, EVERYTHING that is required to make the 3800 just about a bolt-on swap is readily available at reasonable prices. Since the engine is so plentiful there are parts everwhere for relatively cheap. More modern swap engines such as the ecotec are far more expensive to obtain.
2. Availability. Go to any junk yard. There are 3800s there, frequently SC engines. Go on craigslist. There are TONS of 3800 cars for sale, usually for cheap.
3. Simplicity. This swap is a well worn path. That means there is a WEALTH of knowledge out there on how to do it. It's the reason I selected the 3800 for my swap. Just about every complication that you could encounter on a 3800 swap there are threads upon threads of how guys experienced the same problem and how they overcame it.
4. Simplicity. Yes, I am using this point again, but for a different reason. In the late 90s into the early 2000s is when car manufacturers really got in deep with computer control and integration of the engine with the BCM. The 3800 is one of the last of a dying breed of engines that is relatively simple to make run without some serious trickery on the computer or grafting the entire BCM from the donor car into your Fiero.
So the 3800, whether in Series II, III, with or with the supercharger was a great upgrade for the Fiero. But, it is old. All I see around ten year old engines available that are questionable mechanically.
What other engine options are there? Within the last five or six years that will work with the Fiero?
Anything you've got the money, time, and skills, to make fit. The 3800 Series III isn't that old. They were used through 2009. The High Value (3500/3900) V6 was used through 2011 model year. If you want a V6 from GM that's newer than that, you have two options: High Feature V6 or the new Gen V 4.3 V6.
Otherwise, if it has to be a GM engine, there's also the Gen IV and V V8 engines, or the Ecotec family of 4 cylinders. The base model 2016 Camaro comes with a 270 HP Ecotec 2.0, even.
...or the Ecotec family of 4 cylinders. The base model 2016 Camaro comes with a 270 HP Ecotec 2.0, even.
I'm pretty sure that if the Fiero were to be made today, this would be the engine that would be in it. Probably a NA for the base model cars and a turbo for the GT or Formula variants. The power to weight to displacement ratio for those engines is unreal.
What engine to use is all up to you there are so many choices out there 4 , 6 & 8 cylinders push rod or over head cam turbo, supercharged or NA and how much time or money and talent do you have at making it happen with that being said my pick would be Audi RS6 4.2 V8
If you want lightweight and real power without turbo lag, that Gen V 4.3 is basically an LT engine with 2 cylinders cut off (so it easily fits a Fiero engine bay)...I believe it's at least 70 lbs lighter than a 2.8 and produces 275+ hp and 290 Lb/ft of torque- It's not a spinner but it has an exceptionally flat power curve- You'll be over 200 hp by 2500 and stay above up to 5 grand- basically, any gear will pull at any speed...makes shifting kind of superfluous....
How does the Gen V 4.3 compare to a 3800SC in weight, power curve and ease of swap? The LV3 has cylinder deactivation, variable valve timing and direct injection. Is tuned for low to mid range torque and has long runner intake manifold. and has the benefit of modern design and aluminum block. The 3800 is, as stated, a completely plotted swap with anything needed inexpensively available with computer integration already thought out. What is needed to swap in the LV3. Will old 4.3V6 mounts work with a V8 swap kit? How difficult is it to swap in a modern engine electronically? PCM + BCM? Advanced reprograming? Not voicing opinion or preference. I really am curious as to what is involved in a swap with this engine. I imagine the LV3, except for mounts, would be very similar as a modern V8 swap. I am considering a swap. Had mostly decided on a 3800SC II, or an SC III with SC II throttle body and necessary other components. But maybe the LV3 is a better option, if not too involved or expensive. Then again, for now, I am on a limited budget. So, my decision will be base on projected cost.
Originally posted by Knight: How does the Gen V 4.3 compare to a 3800SC in weight, power curve and ease of swap? The LV3 has cylinder deactivation, variable valve timing and direct injection. Is tuned for low to mid range torque and has long runner intake manifold. and has the benefit of modern design and aluminum block. The 3800 is, as stated, a completely plotted swap with anything needed inexpensively available with computer integration already thought out. What is needed to swap in the LV3. Will old 4.3V6 mounts work with a V8 swap kit? How difficult is it to swap in a modern engine electronically? PCM + BCM? Advanced reprograming? Not voicing opinion or preference. I really am curious as to what is involved in a swap with this engine. I imagine the LV3, except for mounts, would be very similar as a modern V8 swap. I am considering a swap. Had mostly decided on a 3800SC II, or an SC III with SC II throttle body and necessary other components. But maybe the LV3 is a better option, if not too involved or expensive. Then again, for now, I am on a limited budget. So, my decision will be base on projected cost.
You'd need at least the 'basic' LSx swap kit from Archie, and that is $3700, to swap in the 4.3. Or you'd need the skills to make your own custom adapter plate, starter mount, etc… I think the 4.3 uses the same ECM as the Gen V V8s do, which would be the E92, and programming it is a bit different than the earlier ECMs. But, I do think HPTuners has some support for it now.
The 3800 doesn't require adapter plate, or mounting the starter somewhere else. It's a much cheaper and less involved swap to complete.
For what its worth I would just rebuild or go for a 3800 short block from ZZ Performance. You can order one with the XP cam installed and have other performance options that could push you to the 400 HP mark. Not cheap but easy and the end result will give more horsepower than most of the new engine swaps. Consider coming to Fieros at Carlisle/GM Nationals on June 18th and you can discuss this with the owners of the newer GM cars with those other GM engines. Haven't seen you there in a while. Carlisle is still a large fun event filled with excitement.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
Was headed to Harrisburg for a meeting and went passed Carlisle and there was some kind of car thing going on.
Every time I plan to go to Carlisle the weather calls for rain. It doesn't bother me, but my friends never want to go "to stand around in the rain." I will try for this year.
LNF Ecotec. Lighter than the V6 nd triple the power of the V6 with some tuning.
I presume the V6 you mean here is the stock 2.8. You're not going to get 400+ HP or 500+ lbs-ft out of the LNF/LDK/LHU/LTG on just tuning, and including weight of turbo, intercooler, and necessary additional hardware for the turbo, the weight is about the same as the stock 2.8.
They're certainly fun engines, but your claims are a bit exaggerated; and nobody has completed a GM SIDI swap into a Fiero yet. A few non-SIDI Ecotecs have been done, but the added weight of a turbo and additional intake and exhaust piping for it, still pretty much negates any weight savings claims.
