Hey! did some reading, saw some guy wanting to do an AWD conversion using the transverse gm 6t70 m7u tranny out of a 2014 buick regal. I called Buick and got a 3100 dollar price tage for the tranny...transfer case and shift assembly.
I have an ecotec Fiero, so i think this tranny would bolt directly to my engine (since it bolts to the 2.0l ecotec and i think the 2.4 and 2.0 are the same pattern)...and if i got a custom drive shaft and i guess axles and hubs for my front end, could i potentially have an AWD fiero??? (obv the gas tank is in the way of the drive shaft atm, and other things im not thinking of...but im sure we can work around that...i dont know, what do u guys think???)
The first problem that you will run into is that the 6T70 is designed to have the drive shaft to the rear wheels exit the rear of the transmission. The engine will be in the way of it leaving the front of the transmission.
The first problem that you will run into is that the 6T70 is designed to have the drive shaft to the rear wheels exit the rear of the transmission. The engine will be in the way of it leaving the front of the transmission.
The engine will be in the way? or bcc of the way my engine is mounted, the driveshaft is pointing towards the back of the car instead of to the front?
I can't post pics from here...but here is a pic of the "transfer case" that attaches to the transmission to give power to the rear wheels with the GM 6T70 transmission. http://www.wholesalegmparts...e/130222ML04-025.JPG
The oil pan will be directly in front of that, so it can't just be flipped to point forward instead. How do you plan to convert that to power the front wheels when the transmission is in the back?
[This message has been edited by CowsPatoot (edited 01-20-2016).]
I can't post pics from here...but here is a pic of the "transfer case" that attaches to the transmission to give power to the rear wheels with the GM 6T70 transmission. http://www.wholesalegmparts...e/130222ML04-025.JPG
The oil pan will be directly in front of that, so it can't just be flipped to point forward instead. How do you plan to convert that to power the front wheels when the transmission is in the back?
i was gonna mount the transfer case in the front of the car pointing towards the back of the fiero...but i think i get what your saying...on a buick regal..when at the front of the car looking into the engine bay, the transmission is on the RHS of the engine and has the driveshaft pointing towards the rear of the car...in my Fiero, the tranny is on the LHS and the driveshaft input is facing the back of the Fiero instead of towards the front where the transfer case would be....i dont see how the oil pan would be in the way...that part confuses me..
As stated, you will not be able to use a driveshaft from the exit of the regal transmission because it will go out the rear of the Fiero. If you built up some crazy center differential that sent the driveshaft toward the front of the fiero, then you'd have ground clearance issues. Take a look at how old school 4 wheel drive systems work.
Originally posted by 4thfiero: ...on a buick regal..when at the front of the car looking into the engine bay, the transmission is on the RHS of the engine and has the driveshaft pointing towards the rear of the car...
Are you sure about that? That's something that Honda does a lot, but I've never seen a GM car setup like that. You might want to double-check.
Are you sure about that? That's something that Honda does a lot, but I've never seen a GM car setup like that. You might want to double-check.
It is his terminology that is off, not his observation. When you look at it from the front, the transmission is on the right....yet it is still on the left side of the car.
In the Fiero, the drivetrain layout is the same as a FWD, except it was moved to the back of the car (in the same configuration). It was not turned around. Therefore, an off-the-shelf AWD from a FWD will not work in a Fiero. Now, one could make something work, with enough time and money, but it is not something that can be done in a weekend.
Originally posted by CowsPatoot: It is his terminology that is off, not his observation. When you look at it from the front, the transmission is on the right....yet it is still on the left side of the car.
OK, got it.
The OP may be confused as to how the Fiero drivetrain is situated, then. Because the Fiero drivetrain isn't turned around. It's just a FWD drivetrain shifted to the rear. The driveshaft on the Regal AWD setup would be sticking out the back of the Fiero. And if you turned the drivetrain around, then you'd have to drive the car in reverse.
I have looked at the options for an AWD Fiero several times... Like others have shared, Fiero is just the FWD drivetrain moved to the rear of the car, no flipping. The transmission is on the driver's side of the chassis.
GM front engine transverse AWD setups have the front axle shafts on the rear side of the engine (or the engine is in front of the front axle center-line). This allows the power takeoff (really a transfer case type function) to have a direct path to the rear differential located at the rear axle center-line.
The issue with using this setup in a Fiero is this power takeoff still points to the rear of the Fiero (trunk/muffler area) and the engine is physically between the front and rear axles. To get the power take off to point to the front, you would need an adapter plate to flip it 180 degrees. The real issue is if you do this, the power take off would be pointing right at (likely interfering with) the oil pan of the engine. If this is below the spinning counterweights of the crankshaft, then you should be able to mod the oil pan for clearance. It is is not, then you are looking at running another adapter plate at the engine/transaxle interface to rotate/clock the transaxle to lower the axle center-line vs. crankshaft center-line... Once that is done, then you mount the AWD rear differential in the front of the Fiero, but it would need to be mounted upside down to have the wheels spinning the right direction.
Lots of details to work out as well as significant fabrication... but it "might" be possible.
Here is the AWD setup from a 4t60/65 transmission. Clearly the power take off points to the rear and flipping it 180 puts it right into where the oil pan would go:
Here is the AWD setup for the F40. Again it points to the rear. The bigger issue with this one is the power takeoff is lower than the axle centerline. So flipping it 180 raises the location of the driveshaft that will connect to the end of the power take off... making interference with the crankshaft counter weights even more likely.
Ok- when I was 13 or so, I took a 69 Mustang model body and put the engine in the back- with the trany pointed forward.....Then I glued on a tranfer box, and ran a driveshaft under the trans/engine to a solid rear axle at the rear- The engine was a little high up, and there wasn't any suspension travel...but hey! Plastic model engineering....
What I keep waiting for is HYDRAULIC all-wheel drive- A pump pushes fluid thru hoses to the "Other end" and hydraulic motors(preferably mounted in the hubs) drive those wheels....Much easier to run hoses, but so far that system is not well developed or efficient. And, of course, those hydraulic motors might add a lot of un-sprung weight.....
This is definitely something I've considered for my Aventador build. Eventually I'll be going with a longitudinal engine setup which may give me some more options...it'd end up being excessively customized if I ever chose to go that route. The ideal setup would still be a reverse facing engine with the transmission located where the gas tank is. This would definitely be an exciting engineering challenge....but not cheap.
I suppose, if you were stretching the back of the car, you could use a transverse driveline, turn it so the engine ran fore-aft, and the right and left outputs woud run towards the front and back- Attach driveshafts instead of the half-shafts and a front and rear dif, and you'd end up with an AWD system- don't know about the offset of the shafts from the engine center- and how you'd get the shaft up forward thru/around/instead of the gas tank......
This may sound stupid but try this. Mount the engine and trans longitudinally, yes a transvers transmission longitudinally. Lock the differential to the transverse transmission and use what would be your left and right axles, provided they spin the right direction Edit i see someone beat me to it
[This message has been edited by Fadingaway (edited 01-23-2016).]
That's what I've been waiting to see - a computer controlled electric motor for each wheel to feed the appropriate power depending on traction and turn state. Electric motor brakes too. Wouldn't take much of an engine to generate the electricity for cruising along, and a small battery/capacitor system could hold some reserve for acceleration.
Longitudinally mount an engine with the transmission facing the towards the front of the car (Aventador or Bugatti). Add in a reverse rotation transfer box and a couple differentials and voila, AWD. The only problem would be the lack of a center differential. The fuel tank would need to be relocated too but it could be done.
Other more expensive option would be an AWD setup from an R8. Transmissions and front differentials can be had on Ebay for 12-15k.
When I'm ready to investigate the longitudinal install for my build, I'm going to give a close look at this. Hopefully I can source the tranny/diffs at a better price though. $12-15K might be a touch steep for my budget for just those parts.
I suppose, if you were stretching the back of the car, you could use a transverse driveline, turn it so the engine ran fore-aft, and the right and left outputs woud run towards the front and back- Attach driveshafts instead of the half-shafts and a front and rear dif, and you'd end up with an AWD system- don't know about the offset of the shafts from the engine center- and how you'd get the shaft up forward thru/around/instead of the gas tank......
Then the transverse and longitudinal final drive ratios would multiply. This would be good for a rock crawler, but not much else. The Getrag 5 speed has a 3.61 final drive ratio. Even if you picked up 2.35:1 diffs, the overall ratio would be 8.48:1
