Hey guys. I have a 2010 HHR SS that is getting an F40 transplant. I cannot justify not installing the Quaife LSD because this car will be tracked heavily(drag strip and rolls) while still being a weekend warrior. I am having no luck finding info on how to properly split the f40 trans case and all important steps needed to complete disassembly and assembly for the diff swap. I hear there are some parts needing replaced when the tranny is split. I was told by Tom at CED that you guys are the experts with the F40. I really need your help guys. Any help or direction would be very much appreciated. Thanks in advance.
And btw, the trans is out of a 2008 Saab 9-3 4-cylinder turbo. I believe the trans is near identical to the g6 f40 but the ratios are different.
Hey guys. I have a 2010 HHR SS that is getting an F40 transplant. I cannot justify not installing the Quaife LSD because this car will be tracked heavily(drag strip and rolls) while still being a weekend warrior. I am having no luck finding info on how to properly split the f40 trans case and all important steps needed to complete disassembly and assembly for the diff swap. I hear there are some parts needing replaced when the tranny is split. I was told by Tom at CED that you guys are the experts with the F40. I really need your help guys. Any help or direction would be very much appreciated. Thanks in advance.
And btw, the trans is out of a 2008 Saab 9-3 4-cylinder turbo. I believe the trans is near identical to the g6 f40 but the ratios are different.
I'm not sure how true that is as the case split fairly easily during a tear down to look at damaged parts. You'll have to look for the thread I posted on that, I believe I posted the name of a company that builds these transmissions that would be of help. My understanding is that the F40 is basically a "Fix it with a new one" transmission when it comes to repairs except for what the shop I'm referring to does. The tech's name is Nick Tallifero, the first name is right but the last probably just close. I don't recall the shop name but it is Saab specific.
I'm not sure how true that is as the case split fairly easily during a tear down to look at damaged parts. You'll have to look for the thread I posted on that, I believe I posted the name of a company that builds these transmissions that would be of help. My understanding is that the F40 is basically a "Fix it with a new one" transmission when it comes to repairs except for what the shop I'm referring to does. The tech's name is Nick Tallifero, the first name is right but the last probably just close. I don't recall the shop name but it is Saab specific.
I was just looking through his website and your right, it's taliaferra imports/genuine saab. Nick Posted some tutorials for f35 and f40 gearboxes on his website. Although they are not very specific to my exact trans, the info was very very helpful. He shows how to reinforce the diff housing which will probably be a good idea with the LSD. Their are also crush rings that need replaced when you assemble the trans or machine your own shims, which sounds like it's the better option for high hp builds except not easy and more time consuming.
Why don't you keep your F35 and install the Quaife 6 speed upgrade for that trans? While you have it torn apart you could also upgrade the LSD in that trans with a Quaife unit.
Why don't you keep your F35 and install the Quaife 6 speed upgrade for that trans? While you have it torn apart you could also upgrade the LSD in that trans with a Quaife unit.
My trans is the performance package version that already has a Quaife LSD from the factory with a 4.05 final drive. While my trans will handle more stress than the F35 cobalt variant (3.95 final drive) it still won't handle much more than ~400wtq, which is what my car currently sits at. This is also my second trans. The first one didn't grenade, it just lost 2nd gear synchronization, and that was when I was at ~350wtq. As far as I know, the F35 Quaife 6-speed gear conversion is unavailable at the moment. I spoke with Quaife and they said they can be made at anytime but their is a minimum order of 10 gear sets @ 3500$ each IIRC. The F40 is said to be able to handle well over 500wtq due to its 3-shaft design (F35 is 2-shaft). Not to mention, the f40 gears are almost twice the size of the f35. My goals for the car are 550-600whp/wtq. The 2007-08 saab 9-3 f40 trans also has awesome gearing. I'll be able to stay in first gear longer which is a big advantage over my current gearing.
My trans is the performance package version that already has a Quaife LSD from the factory with a 4.05 final drive. While my trans will handle more stress than the F35 cobalt variant (3.95 final drive) it still won't handle much more than ~400wtq, which is what my car currently sits at. This is also my second trans. The first one didn't grenade, it just lost 2nd gear synchronization, and that was when I was at ~350wtq. As far as I know, the F35 Quaife 6-speed gear conversion is unavailable at the moment. I spoke with Quaife and they said they can be made at anytime but their is a minimum order of 10 gear sets @ 3500$ each IIRC. The F40 is said to be able to handle well over 500wtq due to its 3-shaft design (F35 is 2-shaft). Not to mention, the f40 gears are almost twice the size of the f35. My goals for the car are 550-600whp/wtq. The 2007-08 saab 9-3 f40 trans also has awesome gearing. I'll be able to stay in first gear longer which is a big advantage over my current gearing.
I question the durability of the F40 at that level, it was torque that took my transmission out and I'm confident at the time my setup was putting down at least 400 lb/ft to the wheels, so far it dynoed about 330 lb/ft to the wheels but that was limited by spark blowout and limited boost, and that was with the rebuilt motor with a half point less compression and the cam degreed in instead of advanced the way it was before the tranny failed. The difference in launch between the two circumstances was night and day as the arrangement before the tranny failure had so much bottom end torque the car launched as if it were hit with a bat fit for a car. The wheels did not spin so if you can put that kind of torque to the ground you will definitely need to strengthen the tranny.
I question the durability of the F40 at that level, it was torque that took my transmission out and I'm confident at the time my setup was putting down at least 400 lb/ft to the wheels, so far it dynoed about 330 lb/ft to the wheels but that was limited by spark blowout and limited boost, and that was with the rebuilt motor with a half point less compression and the cam degreed in instead of advanced the way it was before the tranny failed. The difference in launch between the two circumstances was night and day as the arrangement before the tranny failure had so much bottom end torque the car launched as if it were hit with a bat fit for a car. The wheels did not spin so if you can put that kind of torque to the ground you will definitely need to strengthen the tranny.
Originally posted by XtremeSS: Which F40 variant did you have at that time?
2006 G6 version, I forgot to mention however that Nick suggested that the absence of a dual mass flywheel and or a light weight flywheel and possibly solid clutch hub (mine was near solid with tiny springs) were the likely cause of the kind of failure that I had meaning less dampening of the torque input. He made that statement before I described my clutch setup so he knows what he's talking about. I had to eliminate the dual mass because they are torque limited to about 10% above the engine application according to the manufacturer and I do recall an instance where I believe mine slipped before I removed it.
2006 G6 version, I forgot to mention however that Nick suggested that the absence of a dual mass flywheel and or a light weight flywheel and possibly solid clutch hub (mine was near solid with tiny springs) were the likely cause of the kind of failure that I had meaning less dampening of the torque input. He made that statement before I described my clutch setup so he knows what he's talking about. I had to eliminate the dual mass because they are torque limited to about 10% above the engine application according to the manufacturer and I do recall an instance where I believe mine slipped before I removed it.
Ahhh I see. On the cobalts ss network (cobalt SS and HHR SS have the same chassis and drivetrain) there are a handful of cobalts with the f40 swap making power up to 700 hp(most are in the 500-600 range) without failure so far. Almost all of their trans were all sourced from junkyards with less than 50k miles. The conversion comes with a dual mass flywheel to eliminate vibration and noise. Here is the link for the cobaltss/hhrss f40 swap conversion kit: http://shop.zzperformance.c...sion-Conversion.aspx
That's pretty interesting, my first trans was a junkyard buy, the replacement was new. All I know is the torque was pretty brutal and one day moderate acceleration resulted in a whining noise in third. Prior to that incident the transmission developed mildly troublesome 6th gear shifts where a slight scrape was sometimes heard. A sprung clutch is a wise investment and an aluminum flywheel is available for the 60 degree motors now, I just don't see paying $700 for it. The only thing I would have done different is get a fully sprung hub, I have a kevlar disc and because it has tiny springs designed for use with the dual mass, it makes a little scrubbing sound often when engaged that's tolerable. According to GM specs, second and fourth gear have the highest torque rating.
That's pretty interesting, my first trans was a junkyard buy, the replacement was new. All I know is the torque was pretty brutal and one day moderate acceleration resulted in a whining noise in third. Prior to that incident the transmission developed mildly troublesome 6th gear shifts where a slight scrape was sometimes heard. A sprung clutch is a wise investment and an aluminum flywheel is available for the 60 degree motors now, I just don't see paying $700 for it. The only thing I would have done different is get a fully sprung hub, I have a kevlar disc and because it has tiny springs designed for use with the dual mass, it makes a little scrubbing sound often when engaged that's tolerable. According to GM specs, second and fourth gear have the highest torque rating.
This is all great info Joseph, thank you. After digging even further into the archives, I found a thread named "inside the f40" by 1fatcat. He posted exploded parts views for the entire g6 f40 trans along with parts discriptions. He also includes a power flow schematic and torque specs. Pure awesomeness!
When you disassembled your f40, do you remember if there was any tricks or things I need to look for to split the case and pull the differential?
This is all great info Joseph, thank you. After digging even further into the archives, I found a thread named "inside the f40" by 1fatcat. He posted exploded parts views for the entire g6 f40 trans along with parts discriptions. He also includes a power flow schematic and torque specs. Pure awesomeness!
When you disassembled your f40, do you remember if there was any tricks or things I need to look for to split the case and pull the differential?
You will need to remove the gear selector from what I recall and set the tranny with the bellhousing face down, aside from that I don't recall any tricky stuff like pieces falling out other than what was broken in mine.
You will need to remove the gear selector from what I recall and set the tranny with the bellhousing face down, aside from that I don't recall any tricky stuff like pieces falling out other than what was broken in mine.
