Is there a secret to installing new brake hoses and new copper washers and getting a leak free connection? I just put a new front brake hose on my 85 GT with new washers and it never did stop leaking and I ended up stripping the caliper threads. Now I have to install a new brake caliper but I am worried about stripping the threads on it also. Thanks
------------------ Dr. Ian Malcolm: Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should. (Jurassic Park)
This is my take on the brake hose leaking problem. I had a similar issue and returned one caliper 2X before it was right. Things to look for - Check the length of the banjo bolt, both over all length and the length of the threaded section. Measure the thickness of the banjo (hose end) and compare the dimension with the portion of the bolt that is not threaded. It may be necessary to use two copper washers on the underside to insure that you have proper compression. Measure everything and inspect the spot facing on the caliper with a magnifying glass. One of my rebuilt calipers had a small groove from where the spot facing tool stopped at the end of the machining stroke. The concentric rings in the face should be smooth and without defect. Also make sure that the Cu washers are truly annealed and are soft enough. If in doubt, replace them. Make sure that the banjo is not interfering on the caliper and preventing the end from seating squarely on the caliper. I once had to shorten a banjo bolt because it hit the piston. Also make sure everything is clean and torque the bolt to 30 ftlbs. Try not to let the banjo rotate as you tighten it down. It can be frustrating but be patient and it will eventually come together.
The caliper was the existing one and wasn't leaking before I replaced the brake hose with an airtek from rock auto, so maybe its the new hose or the copper washers I got from the auto parts store. I don't want to ruin the new caliper I am getting today. Maybe the airtek hoses are junk, they had the heart by them on rock autos website so I thought that was what a lot of people used.
May have found the problem. The replacement copper washer was a loose fit around the collar of the banjo bolt, the original washer was a very tight fit. I will make sure I use the copper washers with the correct inside diameter today when I put the new caliper on. I will post the results.
Good advice on the banjos above. Some other tips based on many years of gas and hydraulic fitting banjos , all makes.
Do not attempt to dress or file the hose banjo (brass) female. Do not reuse copper washers because they work harden and cannot compress further. In a bind it is possible to anneal used copper washers with a torch. The H Frt plastic warehouse washers do work. The ribbed copper washers work best , but sources are unknown. I have filed IDs for fit but careful deburr is required. Do not clamp hard in vise or crush will be ruined.
Some caliper washer seats are flat, others counter bored. As noted check that washer ID is loose and will match banjo mating surface. Although it should not happen I have just replaced a defective NIssan caliper whose counterbore would not allow washer seating. The spot face (washer seat on caliper) was not perpindicular to the threaded bore. Further a ridge existed at the outer circumferenc of the spot face. Selection of too large OD washer caused the washer to ride the ridge and not seat. This washer would not seal, and required some head scratching before solution. (It was a rebuid which implies someone used it, how i do not know). The caliper was replaced.
I always start with workshop manual torque. This is typically very low-14 ft lbs, but this only seals about half the time. A typical situation is wiping a dry finger accross the installed banjo will show trace of fluid. Not to panic. It seems there is cold flow of the copper e.g. overnite. In cases where the initial finger wipe is heavy wet more torque is applied in small increments to judge if it is helping. I then test drive a couple miles and check . Typically the banjo will seal.
I treat gas joints differently...no weeping allowed. The German cars have been a real PIA over the years.
[This message has been edited by hobbywrench (edited 02-13-2014).]
Low quality crap brake components have been demanded by Americans wanting lowest price,, the poor quality brake rotors of a few years back being the Chinese Generals shining profit hour !! Most of the new brake hose is now made in China some are branded made in USA falsely ,, failure is common !! try to get Wagner, Bendix, Raybesto they are also made in China but there quality control is better ... pay the few extra sheckles for the above name products the Chinese copper washers do not have enough copper & leaks are common because they are to hard autozone dura last better quality brake rotors seem to be above average ,very few have disintegrated..
Picked up the rebuilt caliper today and put it on. It came with a new banjo bolt and copper washers. It required only normal tightening and it does not leak! Thanks for everyone's input
I found that the copper washer needs to fit snugly on the shaft of the banjo bolt or it will leak.
Wow I hope this works for me. I installed two new front calipers on my 88 the drivers side was fine but the passage side a whole other story. New brass washers, check for imperfections, torqued to 33 ft. lbs., even tried double washer up against the caliper. Still slow drip. But when I saw your advice, I remembered they do fit lose around the bolt even after being torqued down. It's a shame I am at work and it will have to wait until I get off. Don't you hate how work get in the way. ∇FIERO∇
Well I became an old retired fart last year so now work doesn't get in the way but I have less money, Lol. I ended up taking the banjo bolt to NAPA and they matched it up to a washer that fit snugly around the shaft. Good luck with it!
Sometimes the sandblasted surface of the rebuilt calipers is too rough and the copper washer won't seal properly. I will take some emery cloth and smooth the surface of the caliper.
Sometimes the sandblasted surface of the rebuilt calipers is too rough and the copper washer won't seal properly. I will take some emery cloth and smooth the surface of the caliper.
X2 - but I use a fine file to smooth the seal area.
Also, I like to gently snug the bango bolt but still allow the brake line fitting to rotate slighly. I rotate it back and forth a few times while snugging down the banjo bolt to help get the washer properly seated.
I stopped by O'Reilly Auto Parts on the way home from work and picked up a new banjo bolt and a mixed size packet of brass washers. I used the washers that fit the bolt the best and only torqued to 20 ft. lbs. at first and no more leak. I then tightened to about 25 ft. lbs. instead of the 33 that is suggested. As I tightened I could feel the brass washer smash out a little unlike the ones that came with the remand calipers from Auto Zone. I probably could have used the old banjo bolt with the new brass washers and that would have worked also. I guess the problem can be caused just by the washer material not being soft enough and possibly slight imperfections in the mating surface of the caliper.
I found the washer had to be a tight fit on the shaft of the banjo bolt to not leak. The washers that came with calipers were too loose.
I've found the opposite problem - some washers don't fit over the taper on the upper portion of the banjo bolts. On mine, I had to re-use one washer on each side for that reason. No leaks fortunately.
