I took about every suspension and brake component off at once from the car, including the rubber brake lines. I knew it would run the master cylinder dry, but since the car doesn't have ABS, it really didn't bother me and it made the rest of the work easier at the time.
My question is if on our Fiero's if the brake master cylinder has to be removed and bench bled, since all the fluid is gone. Or can I just fill the system up and gravity bleed everything at once, without the need for a bench bleed? I don't mind the gravity bleed either, since I have nothing but time with this car. Thanks!
If you initially fill the container, and slowly pump the brake pedal once, the master should prime. I good idea is a brake fluid bleeder gun you can get at most discount tool places.
If you initially fill the container, and slowly pump the brake pedal once, the master should prime. I good idea is a brake fluid bleeder gun you can get at most discount tool places.
Good luck
Arn
Okay, thanks. Just a quick follow up question to that, since these things can be sensitive to particular steps....do I pump the brake once while all the bleeders are closed...or can I have them all open at once (with each one have a bleed hose going into a container of fluid)?
You can "bench bleed" the master cylinder in the car, using a couple short pieces of hose looped back into the reservoir. Since the master cylinder ran dry, I would suggest doing that.
You can "bench bleed" the master cylinder in the car, using a couple short pieces of hose looped back into the reservoir. Since the master cylinder ran dry, I would suggest doing that.
Are you referring to simply taking off the brake lines at the master cylinder and looping the short hoses into those brake line holes and back into the top of the reservoir? Then fill it up and let it "bleed" on its own over the course of a few minutes, using the loops? Then reconnect the lines and gravity bleed (or pump bleed) the individual lines (obviously) ?
[This message has been edited by MacGyversMullet (edited 01-03-2014).]
Originally posted by Blacktree: You can "bench bleed" the master cylinder in the car, using a couple short pieces of hose looped back into the reservoir. Since the master cylinder ran dry, I would suggest doing that.
Maybe. You can try jacking rear so MC is close to level might help w/ MC bleeding in the car. Try just bleeding w/ car's lines on first. See my Cave, Bleeding MC notes
------------------ Dr. Ian Malcolm: Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should. (Jurassic Park)
Yes bleeding in the car can work. When using the looped lines, they have to stay submerged in the fluid. And you have to pump the pedal. Gravity won't work with the looped line method. They are also correct about getting the master cylinder as level as possible. It is possible to get air lodged in the top of bores. Another way. Takes two people and makes a little mess. One line at a time. Remove one line. Have someone step down. Use you finger over the MC hole when they let up. Then proceed to the other one. I normally use two fingers for both holes at a time and keep my fingers on the holes. Your fingers act as a one way check valve. The other person foot pressure forces the fluid past you fingers(tell them "slowly"). You will be able to feel any air. This tends to work faster than the loop. Always seems there is a little spirt, even after many times. If the master cylinder is new no problem, however if it has some age, do not push the Master cylinder all the way down. That will cause the seals to be pushed into any crap that has settled in the bottom/end of the bore. I tell the other person to put their other foot under the pedal. To keep it from bottoming out. No need to push hard. After that you can send them on their way. Leave the MC cap off. Turn a bottle of brake fluid upside down in the MC to keep it from running dry again. Open each bleeder until you get clear fluid with no bubbles. Furthest away first. Close all the bleeders. Pump it up. Crack each bleeder again to make sure. And you should be done. I don't like to use the pump it up(surge bleeding) method when bleeding a system with a lot of air. Mixes too much air into the fluid. When it doesn't gravity bleed or vacuum bleeder is not available. I use the let off, open bleeder, step down, close bleeder, let up method. Much less air is introduced into the fluid. I have converted many seasoned mechanics/techs on this method. At first they think I'm nuts, but use it now after seeing the results. They like how much faster it is and the pedal is right there. When surge bleeding, many times end up with a spongy pedal due to the introduced air. We use vacuum bleeding at work, except for the Master cylinder. For that bench, loop or fingers. If new and already off, bench.
Yes bleeding in the car can work. When using the looped lines, they have to stay submerged in the fluid. And you have to pump the pedal. Gravity won't work with the looped line method. They are also correct about getting the master cylinder as level as possible. It is possible to get air lodged in the top of bores. Another way. Takes two people and makes a little mess. One line at a time. Remove one line. Have someone step down. Use you finger over the MC hole when they let up. Then proceed to the other one. I normally use two fingers for both holes at a time and keep my fingers on the holes. Your fingers act as a one way check valve. The other person foot pressure forces the fluid past you fingers(tell them "slowly"). You will be able to feel any air. This tends to work faster than the loop. Always seems there is a little spirt, even after many times. If the master cylinder is new no problem, however if it has some age, do not push the Master cylinder all the way down. That will cause the seals to be pushed into any crap that has settled in the bottom/end of the bore. I tell the other person to put their other foot under the pedal. To keep it from bottoming out. No need to push hard. After that you can send them on their way. Leave the MC cap off. Turn a bottle of brake fluid upside down in the MC to keep it from running dry again. Open each bleeder until you get clear fluid with no bubbles. Furthest away first. Close all the bleeders. Pump it up. Crack each bleeder again to make sure. And you should be done. I don't like to use the pump it up(surge bleeding) method when bleeding a system with a lot of air. Mixes too much air into the fluid. When it doesn't gravity bleed or vacuum bleeder is not available. I use the let off, open bleeder, step down, close bleeder, let up method. Much less air is introduced into the fluid. I have converted many seasoned mechanics/techs on this method. At first they think I'm nuts, but use it now after seeing the results. They like how much faster it is and the pedal is right there. When surge bleeding, many times end up with a spongy pedal due to the introduced air. We use vacuum bleeding at work, except for the Master cylinder. For that bench, loop or fingers. If new and already off, bench.
Great advice, I appreciate it! I have seen the finger method used off the car, but that is nice that you can do it on the car with an assistant. If the gravity bleed for the lines doesn't work well enough, I will try your non-surge method
