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HP tuners by FIEROFLYER
Started on: 09-02-2013 04:59 PM
Replies: 5 (1425 views)
Last post by: darkhorizon on 09-03-2013 12:28 PM
FIEROFLYER
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Report this Post09-02-2013 04:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FIEROFLYERSend a Private Message to FIEROFLYEREdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Looking into getting HP tuners so I can do more then just the V6 engines I can do now with my power tuner but wanting to know if I can do the same things with HP tuners as I do with DHP especially things like shutting down VATS for engine swaps so there is no need for VAT's modules or body computers with newer engines on swaps like the 3900 or the eco techs. Any info and recommendations on where to buy from is appreciated. Thanks Dan

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Report this Post09-02-2013 06:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguruSend a Private Message to fieroguruEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
HPTuners is pretty decent and can do most normal changes that people will want in a tuned car. The best parts about HPTuners it is the built in scanner and the programmable histograms. For example, since I am running Open Loop 100% of the time and have my wideband connected to the fuel tank pressure input at the ECM. I programmed a few histograms to display the actual wideband A/F ratio average for every cell on the MAF as well as a VE table any time I log the data. It also has one that compares the actual wideband A/F ratio with the commanded from the ECM and logs the average error %. This error % can just be copied/pasted from the scanner screen to the editor screen to change your MAF calibration to dial the two in closer. It also has filters, so mine are setup to ignore any data where the engine is delivering less than 15 lb-ft (off throttle/decel). Like I said, the scanner/histograms are the best part about HPT.

HPTuners (and most current tuning packages) use credits or some other means of limiting the application of the tool to multiple cars without some exchange of additional $$$. HPT comes with 8 credits and will allow you to program 4 or more cars. The PCM/ECM/TCM is 1 credit per component, so the late model stuff with ECM/TCM combos = 2 credits per car = $100 (there are other options for more unlimited use, but those are not cheap either).

HPTuners does not have built in virtual VE tables so you have to use the 3rd party BlueCat conversion tool, or buy a custom OS from HPT to get a VE table with the Gen 4 ECM's. EFI Live has a built in Virtual VE tables. The V8's (and probably anything with variable valve timing) use what is called dynamic fueling where it runs both Speed Density and MAF up to 4000 rpm (or wherever you set it) and 100% MAF from 4000 to redline. The SD side controls the transient fueling, so you get the best overall performance when you tune both SD and MAF, but there are many guys who run 100% MAF and never touch the VE side of things, as well as those who run 100% SD - I prefer to tune both and keep both active.

HPTuners will allow you to do segment swaps (like mixing/matching transmission code and engine calibration), but you have to send your ECM into them to do it. EFI Live and TunerCat allow the end user to perform segment swaps.

On the E67 LS4 calibration, HPTuners does not have access to the vast majority of the transmission DTC. So if you do a manual swap with an E67 LS4 (and possibly some other applications), you will have to get someone with another tuning software to turn off the transmission DTC (I had Darth do this with Tuner Cat).

On the 58X ecms HP tuners is missing some O2 sensor transport delay features that other packages have. This becomes important with large overlap camshafts and moving the O2 sensor further from the engine (like with a header install). This is part of the reason I run 100% open loop. I had the STFT dialed in under 1% variation and could feel when the O2 sensor switched rich/lean - and subsequently adding/removing fuel - in town and on the interstate. The constant pulsing irritated me. The pulsing goes away open loop.

As you can see, I don't think HPTuners is the perfect tuning package. I am glad I have it, think it is worth the investment, and really like some of its features, but there are some that I now know it is lacking (but I also think that every tuning package is lacking something). I think for someone looking to get into tuning professionally across multiple platforms and including vehicles 2007+, you need access to multiple tuning packages.

Now about BCM's and late model ecms... The E67 ecm doesn't "need" the BCM to run the engine (at least with the V8's). All I did was disconnect it and turn off the DTC for it. However, there are some built in features within the E67 ECM that will only work with the BCM connected. The reason for this is the brake position sensor input goes to the BCM - its status is communicated through the CAN wires to the ECM, not the ECM. So without the BCM, the brake position sensor is "gone". Without the brake position sensor, you will not be able to perform a CASE learn (brake pedal must be pressed to initialize), electronic cruise will not work (must be able to turn off when brake is pressed), and DoD will not work (same reason as cruise), and there may be some other things.

[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 09-02-2013).]

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kikinz24
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Report this Post09-03-2013 11:42 AM Click Here to See the Profile for kikinz24Send a Private Message to kikinz24Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I personally have hp tuners and love it I've tuned 7-8 different cars with it and only had issues with the first time.. once I got the hang of it it was well worth it. Honestly I think you could benifit from it bc you could use the credits toward unlimited year tune and stock up on 98 3800 pcms. That you sell with your wiring kits.. I personally bought mine direct from the site. Hefty chunk of change up front but can eventually pay itself off.
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FIEROFLYER
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Report this Post09-03-2013 12:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FIEROFLYERSend a Private Message to FIEROFLYEREdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I still have my DHP power tuner for the 3800 PCM's it is a tuner that I can turn off the crap like VATS on other engines that I am looking for now. My biggest concern and a question I have yet to be answered from any one I ask including HP tuners is can HP tuners turn off the VATS so there is no needs for wiring it in or using a BCM to run an engine like a 3900 or an eco tech while retaining the electronic throttle or even running this engine with a manual tranny.
I have seen the way of using external triggers and cable throttle body and running it all with an older PCM but I really don't want to go that route. Dan
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kikinz24
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Report this Post09-03-2013 12:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for kikinz24Send a Private Message to kikinz24Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I know you can turn it off on 3800s 2.2 ecotec. And the 2.4 twin cam. I wouldnt see why it wouldn't alow you to turn it off on any other vehicle.
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darkhorizon
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Report this Post09-03-2013 12:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by FIEROFLYER:

I still have my DHP power tuner for the 3800 PCM's it is a tuner that I can turn off the crap like VATS on other engines that I am looking for now. My biggest concern and a question I have yet to be answered from any one I ask including HP tuners is can HP tuners turn off the VATS so there is no needs for wiring it in or using a BCM to run an engine like a 3900 or an eco tech while retaining the electronic throttle or even running this engine with a manual tranny.
I have seen the way of using external triggers and cable throttle body and running it all with an older PCM but I really don't want to go that route. Dan


I would say its hit or miss.. Even if you are able to in some platforms, others maybe not so much. Your best bet when doing a swap is to call up HPT and have them at least guess as to what PCM would be easiest to bypass security on. Retaining all functions without a BCM may prove impossible for stuff like cruise control, remote start, etc.
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