Pennock's Fiero Forum
  Technical Discussion & Questions
  1988 Fiero brake upgrade

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Email This Page to Someone! | Printable Version


next newest topic | next oldest topic
1988 Fiero brake upgrade by asealy007
Started on: 01-29-2013 09:28 AM
Replies: 20 (3488 views)
Last post by: Steven Snyder on 07-26-2013 03:40 PM
asealy007
Member
Posts: 59
From: South Florida, USA
Registered: Apr 2011


Feedback score: (1)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post01-29-2013 09:28 AM Click Here to See the Profile for asealy007Click Here to Email asealy007Send a Private Message to asealy007Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have a 1988 Fiero Formula 2.8, are there any brake upgrades that can be done to increase rotor size and dtopping force that willl fit behind the stock black lace wheels?
IP: Logged
PFF
System Bot
Gall757
Member
Posts: 10774
From: Holland, MI
Registered: Jun 2010


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 89
Rate this member

Report this Post01-29-2013 10:54 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Gall757Send a Private Message to Gall757Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have the same car.

Every time I read requests like this I wonder if the brakes are working properly, because 88 brakes are still impressive if everything is in good shape. Make sure the sliders are free and you have good quality pads. If you have a 200 hp swap, maybe you need bigger brakes, but the stock setup is pretty nice.
IP: Logged
arte444
Member
Posts: 1510
From: Mankato, MN
Registered: Sep 2002


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 151
Rate this member

Report this Post01-29-2013 11:04 AM Click Here to See the Profile for arte444Click Here to Email arte444Send a Private Message to arte444Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
If you autocross your car I think you will feel differently. Factory spec pads and rotors aren't very good. Although, I could have issues with mine.
IP: Logged
Justinbart
Member
Posts: 3259
From: Flint, MI
Registered: Sep 2009


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 119
Rate this member

Report this Post01-29-2013 11:42 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Race pads like EBC yellowstuff goes a long way if you can handle the dust.

------------------
Turbo 3800 E85 F23 5spd spec5
11.17@132.6

IP: Logged
wftb
Member
Posts: 3687
From: kincardine,ontario,canada
Registered: Jun 2005


Feedback score: (4)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post01-29-2013 11:10 PM Click Here to See the Profile for wftbClick Here to Email wftbSend a Private Message to wftbEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
look up the Lemons chump car build by donp .they are using stock 88 brakes on there racecar and they work really well .in the thread he mentions the pads they using .
IP: Logged
Fierobsessed
Member
Posts: 4782
From: Las Vegas, NV
Registered: Dec 2001


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 147
Rate this member

Report this Post01-31-2013 06:05 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FierobsessedClick Here to Email FierobsessedSend a Private Message to FierobsessedEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Cheap pads are the reason people think Fiero's brakes suck, especially in 88's. Cheap replacement pads are made of a material that is too tough. It's extremely durable, thus the heafty warranties offered on cheap pads. They have no coefficient of friction what so ever, and they eat the rotors. Get some good pads, EBC's Green/Yellow as Justinbart reccomended

I'd rather spend some more money on pads that will work great, and not damage the rotors, at the cost of having to replace them a bit more often.

Also, the S10 Brake booster mod is a must do in my opinion. The factory brake effort/response makes the brakes seem crappy, even though they are capable. Till you do the boster swap, then it feels like the brakes are of a modern vintage.
IP: Logged
DonP
Member
Posts: 336
From: Reno, NV
Registered: Jul 2011


Feedback score: (1)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post01-31-2013 06:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for DonPClick Here to visit DonP's HomePageSend a Private Message to DonPEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by wftb:

.they are using stock 88 brakes on there racecar and they work really well .in the thread he mentions the pads they using .


True. We are using the Wagner Thermoquiet P/N MX378 pads. Working extremely well for us. They aren't the cheapest pads, but seem to be good quality. I'm not even a little bit adverse to spending money on brakes if necessary. But not just for the gee-whizz factor. We ran these on a totally stock system with very good results. We did replace the hoses at all four corners and checked out the booster. I may go with the S-10 booster, as we step up our horsepower, but hate to mess with what working.

We have also autocrossed the same car. Don't know how you would get enough heat in racing pads in a 1 minute plus auto-x session. But we aren't as serious about it as some are.

Don
IP: Logged
2002z28ssconv
Member
Posts: 1435
From: Orlando, FL
Registered: Jun 2005


Feedback score:    (26)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 50
Rate this member

Report this Post01-31-2013 07:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2002z28ssconvClick Here to visit 2002z28ssconv's HomePageSend a Private Message to 2002z28ssconvEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
+1 for S-10 booster and fix what's worn out with quality parts. Don't forget the stainless brake hoses too.
IP: Logged
Joseph Upson
Member
Posts: 4938
From:
Registered: Jan 2002


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 88
Rate this member

Report this Post01-31-2013 08:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Joseph UpsonClick Here to Email Joseph UpsonSend a Private Message to Joseph UpsonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
High performance replacements for stock parts (hoses, pads, rotors) is all I would do also. I have an 86 and noticed an immediate improvement with a new rotor and pads plus proper lubrication of the slides and 88s have a better braking system. The "Big brake" swaps look nice behind the wheels especially if you have 17" wheels or greater but I'm over that. It'll take a lot more than 200 hp to require an upgrade also, it's really not that much, I'm there and haven't had any trouble stopping.
IP: Logged
07Hoffmannd
Member
Posts: 404
From: St. Louis, Mo. U.S.A
Registered: Apr 2008


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post07-24-2013 02:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 07HoffmanndClick Here to Email 07HoffmanndSend a Private Message to 07HoffmanndEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I agree with upgrading parts and making sure everything is working right. But I HATE the slider bar system. Is there any brakes calipers to swap in an that don't use that?
IP: Logged
uhlanstan
Member
Posts: 6446
From: orlando florida
Registered: Apr 2007


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 427
User Banned

Report this Post07-25-2013 04:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for uhlanstanClick Here to Email uhlanstanSend a Private Message to uhlanstanEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
the 88 brakes are outstanding for thier size, just use the thermoquiet pads ,or carbomet pads from the fiero store,make sure your rotors are not
grooved & there are no fluid leaks
replace brake fluid,flush old fluid
make sure all wheels turn equaly free,no one wheel has brake dragging
the S-10 brake booster is the only modification you need
just make sure your brakes are working as they should
install better pads on the front first so you can see improved stopping performance
never use cheap pads on a car you like to drive cheap pads are make cause you to
mate with another vehicle !!
IP: Logged
PFF
System Bot
zkhennings
Member
Posts: 1607
From: Massachusetts, USA
Registered: Oct 2010


Feedback score: (3)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post07-25-2013 09:51 AM Click Here to See the Profile for zkhenningsSend a Private Message to zkhenningsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by uhlanstan:

the 88 brakes are outstanding for thier size, just use the thermoquiet pads ,or carbomet pads from the fiero store,make sure your rotors are not
grooved & there are no fluid leaks
replace brake fluid,flush old fluid
make sure all wheels turn equaly free,no one wheel has brake dragging
the S-10 brake booster is the only modification you need
just make sure your brakes are working as they should
install better pads on the front first so you can see improved stopping performance
never use cheap pads on a car you like to drive cheap pads are make cause you to
mate with another vehicle !!


I know you always advocate for the wagner thermoquiets, and I have never used them, but when I did my brake upgrade I did a bunch of research to see which pads I should get and I read bad things about the thermoquiets. A significant amount of bad things. I opted to go for some performance friction brake pads after reading tons of good things about them.

http://www.performancefriction.com/
http://www.performancefrict...rket-brake-pads.aspx

And well I am really glad I went with them, I got them cheap on rockauto for around 25 bucks a set when they are usually close to 50 a set. They have great cold stopping power, around the same as nice stock pads, but then they heat up and grab even harder instead of fading. I really like them, and they truly are a racing bred pad and it is easy to tell. They make minimal dust and they are quiet. I have had them for around 1000 miles now and no problems. I do have grandam brakes, but I imagine they make them for the stock fiero brakes as well. They are carbon metallic pads and I think that combination is unique to them.
IP: Logged
Marvin McInnis
Member
Posts: 11597
From: ~ Kansas City, USA
Registered: Apr 2002


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 226
Rate this member

Report this Post07-25-2013 01:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Marvin McInnisClick Here to visit Marvin McInnis's HomePageSend a Private Message to Marvin McInnisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by asealy007:

I have a 1988 Fiero Formula 2.8, are there any brake upgrades that can be done ...



The '88 Fieros came from the factory with very good brakes. Before doing anything else I always recommend restoring your stock brakes to optimum condition before contemplating any "upgrades."


 
quote
Originally posted by zkhennings:

... I did a bunch of research to see which pads I should get and I read bad things about the thermoquiets. A significant amount of bad things.



I have lots of miles over many years on Thermoquiet pads, both on my '88 Fiero and on several other different vehicles, and that has not been my experience. They have become my pad of choice. (It's probably the only thing that uhlanstan and I will ever agree on. )

The only problems I have ever heard of were loose/delaminated damping shims, which you should be able to see as soon as you open the box, and that was many years ago. The last Thermoquiets I bought were still manufactured in the U.S. or Canada, but some of their manufacturing operations may have moved to Asia since then. Can you provide links or citations? (Please don't bother with any simple, unsubstantiated testimonials like, "Thermoquiets suck!")

[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 07-25-2013).]

IP: Logged
TONY_C
Member
Posts: 2747
From: North Bellmore, NY 11710
Registered: May 2001


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post07-25-2013 01:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TONY_CSend a Private Message to TONY_CEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I do a lot of work for people on their cars, a side business for me, and I do about 30 or so brake jobs a year and I always use Wagners and I have never had anyone complain or come back because of the pads. To me, Wagner Thermoquiet pads are the best brake pads available.
IP: Logged
zkhennings
Member
Posts: 1607
From: Massachusetts, USA
Registered: Oct 2010


Feedback score: (3)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post07-25-2013 01:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for zkhenningsSend a Private Message to zkhenningsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Wow when I bought my pads all I could find was bad reviews about the wagners! Now I can't find anything but good reviews? Anyways I just read that they fade with heavy braking, maybe I was searching for how good they are at the track. But that is why I went with the performance friction, I only read good things about them. They definitely outbrake the wagners but if you aren't in need of crazy fade resistance then I guess get the wagners.

This is crazy! I had been planning on buying wagners for so long because they are always being advocated for on every brake upgrade thread ever, and they were priced well so I was excited, and then when I searched for reviews I was let down and went for the more expensive performance friction pads. I cannot believe I can't find bad reviews now I feel like I am in the twilight zone or something!

My performance friction pads are awesome though, they brake BETTER stopping from 100 than from 60. And they stop way better than every other car my family owns at regular speeds (60). At 100 it is crazy how well they bite, and the pedal always stays very firm it gives a lot of braking confidence. They have a special bedding surface layer that coats your rotors so you have to make sure to bed them per the instructions.

[This message has been edited by zkhennings (edited 07-25-2013).]

IP: Logged
solotwo
Member
Posts: 5341
From: Grand Rapids, MI. USA
Registered: Jun 2002


Feedback score:    (9)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 62
Rate this member

Report this Post07-25-2013 02:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for solotwoSend a Private Message to solotwoEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I second what Gall757 said.
88's need to be serviced. What I am saying is most people don't take the time to ensure the big sliders are clean and free and lubed with the PROPER lube. I use Sil Glyde. Also that the boots are on properly. I have a rant thread about the boots. LOL And lastly the small slider pins that the pads rest on need to be clean and free and a very, very small amount of lube on them. Do you have the rears adjusted properly? Are you using your parking brake and are the cables adjusted properly? After owning an 88 for 12 years I learned how to adjust the rear cables, clean the sliders and pins etc.

Also buy better pads. For a while I bought the best NAPA pad.

OH get the best rotors you can. It is getting hard to find good quality rotors for the fronts, but you can but the best Napa rotor for the 93ish caviler fronts and install them on the rear of your Fiero. YES THEY WORK. I used them at least 6 if not more years on my 88. I drove daily and put about 10k per year on the car. You may have to address the dust shields if they are bent but they worked for me.

With this combo of best quality rotors and real good pads my brake wear was minimal. It got to the point that I could go many years with out replacing pads or rotors. But I did have to address servicing the sliders.

Just my .02

[This message has been edited by solotwo (edited 07-25-2013).]

IP: Logged
TONY_C
Member
Posts: 2747
From: North Bellmore, NY 11710
Registered: May 2001


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post07-25-2013 03:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TONY_CSend a Private Message to TONY_CEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have to agree with those that are saying the 88 brakes are fine if they are serviced correctly. I have the entire 88 brake system on my 84 notchback, from the master to the calipers and the stopping difference between the stock 84 system vs the 88 system is almost unbelievable it is so much better. BUT...everything on the 88 system has been cleaned and greased or it is new such as hoses etc. I also have 12" rotors on the front but I don't think that really helps much with the stopping, I just wanted bigger rotors to fill up my 17" wheels.
IP: Logged
zkhennings
Member
Posts: 1607
From: Massachusetts, USA
Registered: Oct 2010


Feedback score: (3)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post07-26-2013 09:19 AM Click Here to See the Profile for zkhenningsSend a Private Message to zkhenningsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Just out of curiosity, how do the 88 rotors compare to grand am rotors? Because they are the same OD I believe or within a half inch, are the grand am rotors significantly thicker? I imagine they are very similar. Well I have cooper Ts4's which grip pretty good and can lock my wheels up with ease using a blazer MC which means increased pedal effort on my part. I also don't experience brake fade anymore, so if the grand am rotors are very similar to the 88 rotors, and if you can lock your wheels up and you are running nice pads you won't need an upgrade. I bought AC delco heavy duty rotors when I did my brakes. They were like 5 bucks more expensive but boy are they heavy duty. I am not expecting them to warp any time soon.
IP: Logged
fieroguru
Member
Posts: 11618
From: Champaign, IL
Registered: Aug 2003


Feedback score:    (45)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 257
Rate this member

Report this Post07-26-2013 12:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguruSend a Private Message to fieroguruEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by zkhennings:

Just out of curiosity, how do the 88 rotors compare to grand am rotors? Because they are the same OD I believe or within a half inch, are the grand am rotors significantly thicker? I imagine they are very similar.


The Grand Am rotors have a smaller diameter "hat". The 88 rotor "hat" had to be enlarged so the rotor would fit over the 88 front wheel flange. The Grand Am rotor won't. It works on the rear because they use the same wheel bearing between the Grand Am and the Fiero... but not the same case with the 88 front wheel bearing.
IP: Logged
zkhennings
Member
Posts: 1607
From: Massachusetts, USA
Registered: Oct 2010


Feedback score: (3)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post07-26-2013 02:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for zkhenningsSend a Private Message to zkhenningsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Fieroguru I was wondering because of heat dissipation because what I was trying to say was that my car stops awesome with grand am brakes, so if the 88 brakes are pretty similar in size then I would expect them to perform similarly if they are in good working order with nice pads.
IP: Logged
Steven Snyder
Member
Posts: 3314
From: Los Angeles, CA
Registered: Mar 2004


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 106
Rate this member

Report this Post07-26-2013 03:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Steven SnyderClick Here to visit Steven Snyder's HomePageClick Here to Email Steven SnyderSend a Private Message to Steven SnyderEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Pads make a big difference... in fact going from crappy pads to good pads makes more of a difference than going from stock rotors to 12". I know this because I did each thing one at a time. First I replaced rubber hoses with stainless steel braided hoses. This had no noticeable effect. Next, I replaced the part-store pads with Porterfield R4-S pads. This resulted in an improved pedal feel, better control of stopping force, and way more stopping power -- I could much more easily induce lockup. Fade was still an issue with extended high-performance driving with 220 hp. Upgrading to 12" rotors eliminated fade.

Try the pads (I highly recommend the Porterfield R4-S pads), and clean/lube your calibers while you're in there.
IP: Logged
PFF
System Bot

next newest topic | next oldest topic

All times are ET (US)

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Hop to:

Contact Us | Back To Main Page

Advertizing on PFF | Fiero Parts Vendors
PFF Merchandise | Fiero Gallery | Ogre's Cave
Real-Time Chat | Fiero Related Auctions on eBay



Copyright (c) 1999, C. Pennock