I'm looking for plans for F23 mounts that use the stock axles, and a shifter setup that uses the Getrag cables. I'd really rather use both Getrag cables since I had to buy them.
So I've talked to 3 people: one never got back to me, one said they were a "trade secret" but that he had plans to make them (and then didn't), and the other is a Friend Of Someone's who is apparently.. not taking orders at this time.
I'd rather just buy a welder and make my own if I can get some proven plans somewhere. My car has been in pieces for months now, so I'd greatly appreciate it. Thanks in advance.
I'm confident in my ability to build and fit something with a rough plan, but I have no starting point. I could just wing it, but I know nothing about why the angles on the shift brackets are tough to get working, or measuring axle angles, etc.
So nobody really has any real diagrams with the actual measurements? That's too bad. It's unfortunate that we still have to buy from overpriced and/or shady vendors, or else reinvent the wheel.
So nobody really has any real diagrams with the actual measurements? That's too bad. It's unfortunate that we still have to buy from overpriced and/or shady vendors, or else reinvent the wheel.
Yeah, thanks. I've read that like 20x since the thread was started, and I don't see any measurements for mounts except a diagram for the shift cable bracket that requires a custom F23 shift cable...
[This message has been edited by FieroGT42 (edited 01-18-2013).]
Get some 1/4 inch plate steel and make some, what I have done is make an engine mount in most cases for the 3800 engine with a stock Fiero with stock mounts then replace the Fiero tranny with the F23 and make mounts for the F23 to match the engine mount I already made up. I have markings on the cradle of exactly where the engine sits so I am as accurate as I can be. One problem I have found on the 84 to 87 cradle is the one rib on the bottom of the F23 wants to hit the cradle when doing this so either the engine and tranny have to be mounted a little higher or mod the cradle to clear. On 88 cradles I have found it clears just fine. I like to weld in gussets where ever I feel it may be a weak point due to some of the ways the mounts are made to be able to bolt up to the F23 and use stock cradle mounting points. I can post some more photos of the next set I make hopefully this weekend or ask the person that bought the last set I made to post some if it will help. Dan
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Over 10 years of full 3800 swaps and harnesses and still going.
First, thanks for the replies. I don't mean to come off as ungrateful. It's just that I've already read every F23 & F40 thread several times and then some.
Secondly, I forgot to mention that I'm keeping the 2.8 v6 for now so I'd like to use its stock mounts.
Flyer, I don't want anyone to go out of their way, but photos would be great. So since you're making a an engine mount to match the stock tranny location, then transmission mounts to fit the F23 to that engine, it should theoretically be in the factory location? But you're saying there's interference with the F23 in that location?
Do you think I can still use the stock engine mounts and dog bone if I make my own F23 brackets? Do you know of a shift cable set up that doesn't require me to buy or make a new cable?
If you look at the bottom of the F23 there is a rib sticking down this is the problem for fairly low mounting. Using the stock Fiero engine you could easily use a piece of plate steel to lift the engine bracket slightly then make the tranny mounts to match. I have done four f23 swaps now and used the longer cable on all because it works nicely but once I get some time i want to play around with some kind of set up that uses the stock manual cables. Instead of some fancy pivot point I am thinking because the shifter mechanism can be removed from the F23 so easily to make some thing that all bolts up to it and use stock cables so it could just be sold as a replacement shifter mechanism with all the brackets that just gets bolted in place of the stock one then get the replaced one back as a core to make another. if you have ever pulled one of the F23s apart you would see what i am getting at. I have two more sets of mounts to make so will take photos and put them up. Dan
you don't have to use a custom cable, the setup I made uses stock Isuzu cables.
I made the shift lever out of a piece 1/2" steel pipe, and a little bit of plate steel, and the select arm out of a piece of 3/4 inch square tube(not pictured)
I'll see about getting more pics for you.
------------------ I'm not a nice person.
I know these lines Look crooked on paper, but I swear I've got them straight in my head.
I can measure out all the pieces and post them here. That'll just leave it to you to figure out the holes and weld 'em up. All the pieces I use are 3/8" so you'll need to put a chamfer on all the parts if you get a MIG from Harbor Freight or go with 1/4"
That would be awesome. I think I can see how to do everything now except getting the Getrag cables to work. That will probably be the most finicky part of this for me. Thanks guys.
you don't have to use a custom cable, the setup I made uses stock Isuzu cables.
I made the shift lever out of a piece 1/2" steel pipe, and a little bit of plate steel, and the select arm out of a piece of 3/4 inch square tube(not pictured)
I'll see about getting more pics for you.
Any chance we can get more pictures and/ or some specs on this setup. I get the general idea, but not getting a good picture of mounting points or function.
Obviously this thread has been quiet for a while but this is a pretty important topic. Did any one else manage to do this? Is there any chance of getting specs or more pics?
no diagrams or anything, but here are a couple more pictures. the design works ok, but the cable routing sucks.
------------------ "I am not what you so glibly call to be a civilized man. I have broken with society for reasons which I alone am able to appreciate. I am therefore not subject to it's stupid laws, and I ask you to never allude to them in my presence again."
I did a post on this subject a few days ago and didn't get a single reply that i saw for a while until I just stopped checking! Eric jon262 was the only person to PM and gave me a link to review this info he is offering now. So I say a plus for him!! I asked if anyone had accomplished this same swap with a 2.8. I know Therin Sales has a system that they recommend that they sell but in the end the only answer is to buy this cable setup that no one will even state the length of the shift cable. I guess it's some sort of secret.
[This message has been edited by CarolinaRigman (edited 10-19-2015).]
Yeah, that's pretty ridiculous. I guess they feel like they can do whatever they want because they have a captive market. It's almost enough to make me figure them out, post designs, and start selling kits myself.
EricJon, thanks for the photos. It looks too complicated for me to figure out without some diagrams to make sure the angles are correct, but if anyone out there is selling mounting brackets or a cable bracket, please let me know.
call me an ******* , but if someone designed something to work, they have every right to share it, or withhold it. it's their work.
My design really isn't that complex, I don't think I even used a ruler when I made it.
------------------ "I am not what you so glibly call to be a civilized man. I have broken with society for reasons which I alone am able to appreciate. I am therefore not subject to it's stupid laws, and I ask you to never allude to them in my presence again."
call me an ******* , but if someone designed something to work, they have every right to share it, or withhold it. it's their work.
This...
Everyone has a right to hold onto their intellectual property - just ask the movie/record/etc industry. Some people spend a lot of time to figure something out and who says that they have to share this for free? Maybe you can offer them some money for their "plans".
If they want to share it for free, more power to them. But I understand their point as I have had something that I shared suddenly pop up on eBay from someone selling it. They want it for free only to turn around and sell it for profit with out even so much as the courtesy of a "reach around"...
[This message has been edited by Mickey_Moose (edited 10-20-2015).]
I am working on a 3800/f23 swap right now. Th f23 I bought came with thelins kit (an older version I think)
Thelins kit was meant for the ecotech but the rear mount works if you tap the two holes on the diff housing.
The previous owner modified the front mount to work (it now looks very similar to the one earlier in this thread) and installed Thelins shift bracket. He never installed the trans onto the 3800, so he didn't realize that Thelins bracket points the shift cable right into the exhaust crossover pipe.
I am working on a design for a bracket based on Thelins kit that will re-orient the shift linkage and allow use of getrag cables with clearance for a 3.8 or 2.8 v6 crossover pipe.
I hope to have it done by the end of the week and I'll post about it then.
I guess I can see your point about saving info. But this is a forum, and I don't intend to sell anything. I share everything I know or have worked out the kinks in and share it, I never think about profiting from the info. I guess maybe I'm wrong.
Where's my manners? I'm sorry! Thank you Fiero Flyer and Eric262 and anyone else that shared information on this thread for this man to get his car back together! It's members like you who make this forum what it is! I hope when I get my 85 into the installing stages of the transmission I can have some info to share and if I can find a way to install a factory cable or any kind of stock cable for the shift cable, I will definitely share it! With collective thinking from this group, I think we can accomplish all of these setbacks. Again Thank you and I will add pluses for each of you that shared info on this thread. It seems like it's the same members always helping out anyway, and I've been a member for a while! I think anything else on this subject needs to go to Trash anyway.
My setup uses stock izuzu cables, the hardest part was probably making the cable clamps that held the cables. I will outline what I did, and how I did it later.
------------------ "I am not what you so glibly call to be a civilized man. I have broken with society for reasons which I alone am able to appreciate. I am therefore not subject to it's stupid laws, and I ask you to never allude to them in my presence again."
Here is a pic of my rear mount. This is an 87 cradle, f23, 4.3l v6, archie early sbc block and crank adapter and the trans location is unaltered from original. This is the earliest 4.3 install I know of.
I started putting in the f23 last week. I'm waiting on a new rear mount as mine was torn (see photo) and I didn't know it while making the mount so the angle of the foot is a few degrees off. The nice thing about this bracket is I have good access to the rear trans plug, the mount and bracket are easily removed without having to move the transaxle around, no new holes to drill, the attachment to the trans is at the original load point, the cradle mount pocket is not cut back, and the rubber mount is not altered or moved on cradle.
The bracket is 11ga 1x2 with a short piece of 1x3 at the bottom, with the tabs made from 1/8 strip and angle. I'll be gusseting the tabs when I correct the foot angle after I get the new mount. The bolts in the trans are from a 4 spd lower bracket. I would have made larger gussets on the foot but then I could not get the bracket in and out easily. Anyway, it is just to give ideas as this is a different method than any I have seen.
I tried at least three times to get a hold of a certain company to get their cables, so I stopped caring and bought some universal Steinjäger cables with 1/4-28" threaded ends. I used decent spherical rod ends at each end. I had to make a shifter bracket anyway, right?
Not quite 'finished', but it all works. Pretty well.
This is what I came up with for a rear mount:
I don't seem to have a decent picture of my front trans mount, but here's an idea of what I did. It bolts to one large [M12?] lateral boss into the side of the transmission and two smaller M8-M10 bosses vertically from the bottom side of the transmission. I'm heading back over tomorrow, hopefully to get my F23 reassembled. I can try to get better pictures.
Bottom line is; the best thing to do is to take a few measurements, sketch something up and make it out of cardboard. Tape it all together and see if it works. Make it out of steel if it does. I never really bothered to save my 'paperwork', though.
but that he had plans to make them (and then didn't), and the other is a Friend Of Someone's who is apparently.. not taking orders at this time. 
