@Rotrex... I think you have convinced me that trying to hop up a 2.8 is not the way to go. I guess if people were giving away the blocks, that should tell you something. I like the idea about using a 3800 SC, but I have a question for you... I've heard about people doing a swap with a 4.3. Do you think that would be better? I know they make some with a DOHC, but don't know if that's a better idea than the 3800SC. What's your opinion about doing a 4.3 swap?
Keep in mind that I want to keep the AC. How much difference does it make in hp? And is the 4.3 a lot of trouble to swap? I believe you are right when it comes to getting the best hp in the best way.
A 4.3 swap would be similar to a 350 v8 swap in difficulty. I haven't heard many people actually complete a swap. Sure it can be done. But why? As far as performance is concerned might as well do a 3.4 or a 3.8. Relatively easy swap that has been done many, many times. The easy term is relative.
@Rotrex... I think you have convinced me that trying to hop up a 2.8 is not the way to go. I guess if people were giving away the blocks, that should tell you something. I like the idea about using a 3800 SC, but I have a question for you... I've heard about people doing a swap with a 4.3. Do you think that would be better? I know they make some with a DOHC, but don't know if that's a better idea than the 3800SC. What's your opinion about doing a 4.3 swap?
Keep in mind that I want to keep the AC. How much difference does it make in hp? And is the 4.3 a lot of trouble to swap? I believe you are right when it comes to getting the best hp in the best way.
Unless you want to keep the engine bay stock looking, I would not spend any $$$ on the 2.8/3.1/3.4 when looking for improved performance. The 3800NA or SC is hard to beat, but they are way too common for me.
I did go the 4.3 CPI route and was quite happy with the swap, but didn't like the auto. Had I installed it with a 5 speed, I would probably still have it. I had a SBC fiero at the time as well and both cars served a different purpose. The 4.3 was a much easier/cheaper install because you could run factory exhaust manifolds, water pump and 4.3 4x4 oil relocation kit. The 190-195 stock hp and 265 lb-tq was enough to have fun when you wanted, but not too much to be worried about driving the car in the rain or in the snow. It was a great overall fun swap and pulled down 24-25 mpg on my daily commute and up to 32 mpg on the interstate (about the same as my last 2.8 5 speed fiero).
A 4.3 swap would be similar to a 350 v8 swap in difficulty. I haven't heard many people actually complete a swap. Sure it can be done. But why? As far as performance is concerned might as well do a 3.4 or a 3.8. Relatively easy swap that has been done many, many times. The easy term is relative.
Hi Jason. I was just wondering about the 4.3... I think my mind is made up about the 3800sc. I've been watching a lot of videos on Youtube and it seems like the 3800sc is the most popular swap.
Unless you want to keep the engine bay stock looking, I would not spend any $$$ on the 2.8/3.1/3.4 when looking for improved performance. The 3800NA or SC is hard to beat, but they are way too common for me.
I did go the 4.3 CPI route and was quite happy with the swap, but didn't like the auto. Had I installed it with a 5 speed, I would probably still have it. I had a SBC fiero at the time as well and both cars served a different purpose. The 4.3 was a much easier/cheaper install because you could run factory exhaust manifolds, water pump and 4.3 4x4 oil relocation kit. The 190-195 stock hp and 265 lb-tq was enough to have fun when you wanted, but not too much to be worried about driving the car in the rain or in the snow. It was a great overall fun swap and pulled down 24-25 mpg on my daily commute and up to 32 mpg on the interstate (about the same as my last 2.8 5 speed fiero).
When the LS based Ecotec 4.3's are more common I will likely swap one of those into one of my Fieros for a daily driver.
@Fieroguru... Thanks for the input. After looking at many videos on Youtube, The 3800sc engine is what everyone is going for (said that in last post). I like the looks of it too. It seems to fit in there nice.
Glad to hear that you got the 4.3 to work. I know you had fun with it. How did it die? (if I'm understanding what your saying). That's a shame. But the LS sounds great too. From what little I know, they're pretty darn quick. Have fun when you get a chance to do it.
I have something to ask about on a Fiero. The cheapest one I can find still running is about 1,700 dollars. I've found some that are not in the best of condition (they don't run) for around 800 dollars. I know I would save a lot of money with the 800 dollar one, but I'm not a good enough mechanic to know how bad it's broke. now that I have looked at what I've written it seems better to buy one for 1,700 dollars.
My lady and I are trying to buy a house now and I won't be able to get one until we do.
I am not a banned member this is just negative information .I knew a member who was banned !! he really help me with my car,uhlanstan spend almost 100 hours helping me,now because of association I have come under attack by the atheist hate mongers !! I post from the library do not have my own computer
Stan, you didn't fool us in This thread, and you're not fooling us now.
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 06-25-2014).]
I should have known better than to let people know I was a black man!! that is the only reason I can think for all the hate!! I have offended the old white boy click .I am not in OT, this is tech so go back to your silly atheist hate games there .I have done nothing to be banned for.. you do not like me because I am black & I take no crap from stupid posters ,not one of you would say any thing to my face just a bunch of racist!!
I should have known better than to let people know I was a black man!! that is the only reason I can think for all the hate!! I have offended the old white boy click .I am not in OT, this is tech so go back to your silly atheist hate games there .I have done nothing to be banned for.. you do not like me because I am black & I take no crap from stupid posters ,not one of you would say any thing to my face just a bunch of racist!!
..........KEEP IT ON TOPIC
???????? !!!!
[This message has been edited by jumper (edited 06-25-2014).]
I should have known better than to let people know I was a black man!! that is the only reason I can think for all the hate!! I have offended the old white boy click .I am not in OT, this is tech so go back to your silly atheist hate games there .I have done nothing to be banned for.. you do not like me because I am black & I take no crap from stupid posters ,not one of you would say any thing to my face just a bunch of racist!!
..........KEEP IT ON TOPIC
Stan, you were banned because PFF members have had enough of your hate filled rants. And now you're pretending to be a "black man" so as to play the race card. This is disgusting.
Apologies to the OP for your thread being interrupted like this.
Stan, you were banned because PFF members have had enough of your hate filled rants. And now you're pretending to be a "black man" so as to play the race card. This is disgusting.
Apologies to the OP for your thread being interrupted like this.
I should have known better than to let people know I was a black man!! that is the only reason I can think for all the hate!! I have offended the old white boy click .I am not in OT, this is tech so go back to your silly atheist hate games there .I have done nothing to be banned for.. you do not like me because I am black & I take no crap from stupid posters ,not one of you would say any thing to my face just a bunch of racist!!
..........KEEP IT ON TOPIC
Nigga please.
Back on topic, as others have stated, the 2.8/3.1/3.4 is not really worth investing in for any real performance. Standard maintenance and a few small things like exhaust if you need it, are worthwhile general investments if you want to keep it running nice while you save the money for a swap.
As for swapping, if you just want to make around 200-300 HP, there are plenty of good options.
3.4 DOHC is a relatively easy swap, and makes 200 HP stock, plus it gives you a nicer RPM range to rev through if you like the sound of an engine at 7000 RPM. 3.8 Series II NA or SC is also a well documented and relatively easy swap, with 200-240 HP stock, and a strong engine that can make a lot more if you wish. 4.9 Cadillac V8 is a relatively easy swap to get a V8 that makes 200 HP if you want the V8 sound and a bunch of low end torque for cheap.
If you want to drop down to a 4 cylinder for MPG and make a bunch of power, the modern Ecotec is a good choice but the swap can get costly depending on what you want to do, and it's quite a bit more difficult. If you want a relatively easy and cheap swap that makes less than 300 HP then those first three are your best choice. If you want to make more power later on, then all three of those engines can take a small to medium sized turbo and make well over 300 HP without too much trouble.
Back on topic, as others have stated, the 2.8/3.1/3.4 is not really worth investing in for any real performance. Standard maintenance and a few small things like exhaust if you need it, are worthwhile general investments if you want to keep it running nice while you save the money for a swap.
As for swapping, if you just want to make around 200-300 HP, there are plenty of good options.
3.4 DOHC is a relatively easy swap, and makes 200 HP stock, plus it gives you a nicer RPM range to rev through if you like the sound of an engine at 7000 RPM. 3.8 Series II NA or SC is also a well documented and relatively easy swap, with 200-240 HP stock, and a strong engine that can make a lot more if you wish. 4.9 Cadillac V8 is a relatively easy swap to get a V8 that makes 200 HP if you want the V8 sound and a bunch of low end torque for cheap.
If you want to drop down to a 4 cylinder for MPG and make a bunch of power, the modern Ecotec is a good choice but the swap can get costly depending on what you want to do, and it's quite a bit more difficult. If you want a relatively easy and cheap swap that makes less than 300 HP then those first three are your best choice. If you want to make more power later on, then all three of those engines can take a small to medium sized turbo and make well over 300 HP without too much trouble.
Yep Jumper, this is the way to go. 3.4, easier. 3.8 series 2 the best fit. Had one in my 2001 Monte Pace Car and wasn't too disappointed. But needed a little more. SC is the way to go if you can find one in budget. BUT...If you find a good N/A for a great price, 200HP will push these cars really nice. It all depends on what YOU want. And just to add, I have heard about some reliability issues with the 4.9. Me personally would stick with the 3800.
Back on topic, as others have stated, the 2.8/3.1/3.4 is not really worth investing in for any real performance. Standard maintenance and a few small things like exhaust if you need it, are worthwhile general investments if you want to keep it running nice while you save the money for a swap.
As for swapping, if you just want to make around 200-300 HP, there are plenty of good options.
3.4 DOHC is a relatively easy swap, and makes 200 HP stock, plus it gives you a nicer RPM range to rev through if you like the sound of an engine at 7000 RPM. 3.8 Series II NA or SC is also a well documented and relatively easy swap, with 200-240 HP stock, and a strong engine that can make a lot more if you wish. 4.9 Cadillac V8 is a relatively easy swap to get a V8 that makes 200 HP if you want the V8 sound and a bunch of low end torque for cheap.
If you want to drop down to a 4 cylinder for MPG and make a bunch of power, the modern Ecotec is a good choice but the swap can get costly depending on what you want to do, and it's quite a bit more difficult. If you want a relatively easy and cheap swap that makes less than 300 HP then those first three are your best choice. If you want to make more power later on, then all three of those engines can take a small to medium sized turbo and make well over 300 HP without too much trouble.
Hi Dobey... I like the sound of the 3.8/3800. I've checked them out on Youtube and there seem to be a lot of them out there. Plus, a bunch of the ones I saw really sounded good. About the 4 cylinder, I didn't know they could get over 300 hp. That's pretty awesome, but if it's that much more difficult and costly, that leaves me out. On the 3800 how much a difference does it make between the NA and the SC? I would guess the SC would be better?
I have to ask a dumb question... is a 3.8 the same as a 3800? I apologize if I asked this question before... I have the memory of a rock
I appreciate you sharing your knowledge about the different swaps. You've really covered a lot of ground, and I thank you for that!
Yep Jumper, this is the way to go. 3.4, easier. 3.8 series 2 the best fit. Had one in my 2001 Monte Pace Car and wasn't too disappointed. But needed a little more. SC is the way to go if you can find one in budget. BUT...If you find a good N/A for a great price, 200HP will push these cars really nice. It all depends on what YOU want. And just to add, I have heard about some reliability issues with the 4.9. Me personally would stick with the 3800.
Hi Jason, Yep. I've decided on the 3800 series II. And I will also try my best to get a SC one. I've been reading and watching (Youtube) everything I can to find out what's the best thing to do, and I think everyone agrees that the 3800 is the way to go.
I asked a question a second ago about which was better, the NA or the SC. Now I know the SC is better. Thanks about the 4.9 engines. I didn't know they have issues. Dobey just gave me some information that was great too. (thanks again Dobey)
What cars can you rob a 3800 from and is one better than the other?
thanks a lot.
[This message has been edited by jumper (edited 06-25-2014).]
I have to ask a dumb question... is a 3.8 the same as a 3800? I apologize if I asked this question before... I have the memory of a rock !
Hi
All 3800's are 3.8's as in 3.8 litre. The older 3.8 FWD Buicks ended 1987-1988; since- all FWD are 3800, 3800 series l, ll, ll, due to major changes in design. Camaro & Firebirds Gen 4 used a RWD 3800 ll version.
The old Grand National engines & 89 T/A Turbo's were 3.8's.
Originally posted by jumper: Glad to hear that you got the 4.3 to work. I know you had fun with it. How did it die? (if I'm understanding what your saying). That's a shame. But the LS sounds great too. From what little I know, they're pretty darn quick. Have fun when you get a chance to do it.
The 4.3 car didn't die, I just got tired of driving it with the auto and sold it to a guy in FL.
Have a link to the 4.3 Fiero that sold on ebay? I can't find it.
All 3800's are 3.8's as in 3.8 litre. The older 3.8 FWD Buicks ended 1987-1988; since- all FWD are 3800, 3800 series l, ll, ll, due to major changes in design. Camaro & Firebirds Gen 4 used a RWD 3800 ll version.
The old Grand National engines & 89 T/A Turbo's were 3.8's.
BR's,
Mark
Hi Mark, thanks for clearing the 3.8/3800 issue for me. So... if I'm understanding it right, the series II is everything past 1988. What car is gen II in? Is it still the Buick, or are they in other cars? And if so, is there a best choice for vehicle to rob?
Hi Mark, thanks for clearing the 3.8/3800 issue for me. So... if I'm understanding it right, the series II is everything past 1988. What car is gen II in? Is it still the Buick, or are they in other cars? And if so, is there a best choice for vehicle to rob?
john
Loosely, the plain old 3800 ran from 1988 to about 91, at which point the engine became a 3800 Series l which included some changes to the intake manifold but essentially the same basic engine as the 3800. 95 brought the Series ll, big design changes here. 2004 brought the Series 3, again similar to Series ll. Series ll engines are in a lot of GM cars, mid size to large sedans. I hate to guess how many of these engines GM made.
BR's,
Mark
------------------ 86 SE V6 4 speed 86 SE V6 Auto 2008 G6 GT "Street" Coupe 2005 Buick 3.6 Rendezvous 2001 Olds Silhouette (AKA The Band Van)
Loosely, the plain old 3800 ran from 1988 to about 91, at which point the engine became a 3800 Series l which included some changes to the intake manifold but essentially the same basic engine as the 3800. 95 brought the Series ll, big design changes here. 2004 brought the Series 3, again similar to Series ll. Series ll engines are in a lot of GM cars, mid size to large sedans. I hate to guess how many of these engines GM made.
BR's,
Mark
Thanks Mark. Guess I will search for some cars that have GM motors in them and see where they appear. This definitely gives me a path to find one. Thanks a bunch,
Originally posted by jumper: Hi Dobey... I like the sound of the 3.8/3800. I've checked them out on Youtube and there seem to be a lot of them out there. Plus, a bunch of the ones I saw really sounded good. About the 4 cylinder, I didn't know they could get over 300 hp. That's pretty awesome, but if it's that much more difficult and costly, that leaves me out. On the 3800 how much a difference does it make between the NA and the SC? I would guess the SC would be better?
The supercharged version of the 3800 is definitely better than the non-supercharged engine. It has a bit stronger bottom end, so if you are thinking of switching to a turbo later on, and want to go with a 3800, then a Series II or III 3800 SC is the engine to get. In stock form you won't get much power over the N/A 3800 though, only about 40 more HP for the SC. A little tuning and a cam and pulley can get you a bit more though. It's very easy to get 300 HP out of a 3800 SC. 400 HP is a bit harder without going turbo, but with a big turbo and the right tuning and fuel, it's not very hard to get 600-700 HP out of a 3800.
If you can get the motor mounts and the little bits one needs to swap in the 3800, it's a pretty easy swap, and can be done for less than $2000, including the engine (if you get lucky and find a good engine cheap). Some people have complained on the forum in the past about trying to get mounts from different vendors, as most of the vendors selling them were doing it as a part time second hand thing, and were not full on performance parts vendors. So they might disappear off the map for a while due to personal issues, life changes, and such. If you can get or make the mounts, the 3800 suits your needs for an engine swap, you like how it sounds, and you're looking to swap, it's definitely what you should go for.
Is it still the Buick, or are they in other cars? And if so, is there a best choice for vehicle to rob?
john
The 3800SC series 2, also known as the L67 came in the following:
-1996–2005 Buick Park Avenue Ultra -1997.5–2004 Buick Regal GS / GSE / GSX (SLP) -1996–1999 Buick Riviera (optional 1996-97, std. 1998-99) -2004–2005 Chevrolet Impala SS -2004–2005 Chevrolet Monte Carlo SS Supercharged/Intimidator SS -1996–1999 Oldsmobile Eighty-Eight LSS (limited) -1996–2003 Pontiac Bonneville SSEi -1997–2003 Pontiac Grand Prix GTP / GTX (SLP)
Im trying to find the Bonneville or the GTP version just because it's still the Pontiac. Not that any of the engine's were configured differently, I just prefer to keep it within the same family.
The Series 2 (L67-2) has the best documentation. The series 3 (L32) has similar power output (260HP) but for the amount of work it just isn't worth the swap.
The series 1 (L67) is kinda hard to find with low mileage but does produce decent horsepower. However, the documentation just isn't there and because it being older, the price goes up. You could probably buy a 3.8 N/A series 2 for the price of a series 1 L67.
[This message has been edited by zzzhuh (edited 06-25-2014).]
And just to add, I have heard about some reliability issues with the 4.9. Me personally would stick with the 3800.
The 3800SC is easily the best swap for the money. But the 4.9L V8 Cadillac Engine is one of the most bullet proof engines I've ever had. I have a 91 seville with this engine and it's got over 194,000 miles on it and it still get's up and goes. The 4.9 and the 4.6 Northstar seem to confuse people every now and again. People think the 4.9 blows the head gaskets when in reality it's got to be one of the best engines Cadillac ever made. If the car was maintained properly (like it should be) than this engine should be a great swap, plus the 275 LBS of torque is tempting .
The 4.6 Northstar on the other hand....Well it doesn't matter if it was maintained or not, the head gasket's blow right around 100,000 miles and as you would imagine cost's a fortune. If only those damn engineers had used better cylinder block head bolts. the Northstar would easily be considered one of the best engines ever.
------------------ The wetter the better
[This message has been edited by zzzhuh (edited 06-25-2014).]
I had a friend tell me if I did this: "followed by a ECM tune: stamped 1.6 rockers, 272-2 cam, headers, ported heads. You might peak 200hp."
Would some of you who know more than I do tell me if this is correct or not?
thanks
I have for sale some performance heads that have 1.6 rollers and a complete Vortech supercharger kit for the stock 2.8 V6 that will give an easy 220 - 250hp. The heads are complete, ready to plug and play. The valves are a 3 side grind at the local machine shop, the springs are good, but you'll need fresh gaskets.
The charger is a nearly new Vortech V9G centrifugal unit and has all the hardware; brackets, oil line, tubing and blow off valve for the Fiero included.
The supercharged version of the 3800 is definitely better than the non-supercharged engine. It has a bit stronger bottom end, so if you are thinking of switching to a turbo later on, and want to go with a 3800, then a Series II or III 3800 SC is the engine to get. In stock form you won't get much power over the N/A 3800 though, only about 40 more HP for the SC. A little tuning and a cam and pulley can get you a bit more though. It's very easy to get 300 HP out of a 3800 SC. 400 HP is a bit harder without going turbo, but with a big turbo and the right tuning and fuel, it's not very hard to get 600-700 HP out of a 3800.
If you can get the motor mounts and the little bits one needs to swap in the 3800, it's a pretty easy swap, and can be done for less than $2000, including the engine (if you get lucky and find a good engine cheap). Some people have complained on the forum in the past about trying to get mounts from different vendors, as most of the vendors selling them were doing it as a part time second hand thing, and were not full on performance parts vendors. So they might disappear off the map for a while due to personal issues, life changes, and such. If you can get or make the mounts, the 3800 suits your needs for an engine swap, you like how it sounds, and you're looking to swap, it's definitely what you should go for.
@dobey, thanks for confirming that the SC is the way to go. It's great that it has a stronger bottom end too. I don't intend to do high end driving, so that would be perfect. And getting just an extra 40 HP over the NA is a good start. I didn't know that you could have a SC AND a turbo. And getting 600-700 HP out of a 3800 puts it in the OMG category. I bet that's fun to drive!
I've heard about the motor mount thing too. I understand about people coming and going when it comes to motor mounts, so I'll probably have to go to a performance shop. That's also good about having a good sound. I love the sound of an engine at idle and with a cam it would sound even better. Now when it comes to swapping the engine, I know the cost you quoted was if I did it myself, that's out of my skill range. I would have to get someone to do it for me. Also, is it better to put the cam in while doing the swap? I'm looking for the right/cheapest way to go.
Have some question about transmissions. I would think a 5 speed getrag (don't know if I'm spelling that right) would be good. Let me know what you think about that.
The 3800SC series 2, also known as the L67 came in the following:
-1996–2005 Buick Park Avenue Ultra -1997.5–2004 Buick Regal GS / GSE / GSX (SLP) -1996–1999 Buick Riviera (optional 1996-97, std. 1998-99) -2004–2005 Chevrolet Impala SS -2004–2005 Chevrolet Monte Carlo SS Supercharged/Intimidator SS -1996–1999 Oldsmobile Eighty-Eight LSS (limited) -1996–2003 Pontiac Bonneville SSEi -1997–2003 Pontiac Grand Prix GTP / GTX (SLP)
Im trying to find the Bonneville or the GTP version just because it's still the Pontiac. Not that any of the engine's were configured differently, I just prefer to keep it within the same family.
The Series 2 (L67-2) has the best documentation. The series 3 (L32) has similar power output (260HP) but for the amount of work it just isn't worth the swap.
The series 1 (L67) is kinda hard to find with low mileage but does produce decent horsepower. However, the documentation just isn't there and because it being older, the price goes up. You could probably buy a 3.8 N/A series 2 for the price of a series 1 L67.
@zzzhuh, thanks for the list of cars, plus the dates. I've heard about people trying to get the GTP. So I figure that would be what I want. And thanks for the heads up about the series 3 not being worth the swap. I'll know that's one to stay away from. Have a question. How do you know if a gen II is a NA or a SC? What would I look for?
What is the issue with the Series III? I have asked this before and never got a response. I know it is DBW but so is my LS1 in my Fiero. Just had to remove the cable and mount new pedal. Is it something else?
Originally posted by jumper: @dobey, thanks for confirming that the SC is the way to go. It's great that it has a stronger bottom end too. I don't intend to do high end driving, so that would be perfect. And getting just an extra 40 HP over the NA is a good start. I didn't know that you could have a SC AND a turbo. And getting 600-700 HP out of a 3800 puts it in the OMG category. I bet that's fun to drive!
If you do go to a turbo, you'll want to get rid of the supercharger, and replace it with the N/A intake. The supercharger will plateau at some point. Unless you're going to get a huge turbo to make that much power though, it's not going to be much of an issue. Having both the turbo and supercharger together will make tuning more complex too, as you have to work more to balance their needs. If you're going to stay under 400 HP though, just stick with the supercharger.
For a transmission, you can use the stock Getrag, though a rebuild might be good while it's out and if it's got over 100K miles on it already. Another good option is the F23 transmission from the 2003 Cavalier non-Ecotec car, IIRC. It's not a direct bolt-in, but it's cheaper/easier than the F40. The F40 is what to look at if you want a 6 speed, but it's more complex and expensive to swap in.
What is the issue with the Series III? I have asked this before and never got a response. I know it is DBW but so is my LS1 in my Fiero. Just had to remove the cable and mount new pedal. Is it something else?
The Series II are more widely available, generally cheaper, and slightly easier to swap because they're not DBW. The ECM is a bit simpler too.
If you do go to a turbo, you'll want to get rid of the supercharger, and replace it with the N/A intake. The supercharger will plateau at some point. Unless you're going to get a huge turbo to make that much power though, it's not going to be much of an issue. Having both the turbo and supercharger together will make tuning more complex too, as you have to work more to balance their needs. If you're going to stay under 400 HP though, just stick with the supercharger.
For a transmission, you can use the stock Getrag, though a rebuild might be good while it's out and if it's got over 100K miles on it already. Another good option is the F23 transmission from the 2003 Cavalier non-Ecotec car, IIRC. It's not a direct bolt-in, but it's cheaper/easier than the F40. The F40 is what to look at if you want a 6 speed, but it's more complex and expensive to swap in.
I don't think I would go with the turbo after what you said about it. Since I would be just driving around town mostly, I don't think that it's plateau would make a difference? And I like the sound of getting a rebuilt Getrag. That would fit better in my budget And the 6 speed really sounds nice, but the price over a 5 speed makes the 5 speed the winner.
I really appreciate everyone's help. You all have taught me very much. So I thank everyone.
[This message has been edited by jumper (edited 06-26-2014).]
The 4.6 Northstar on the other hand....Well it doesn't matter if it was maintained or not, the head gasket's blow right around 100,000 miles and as you would imagine cost's a fortune. If only those damn engineers had used better cylinder block head bolts. the Northstar would easily be considered one of the best engines ever.
Some of the NorthStars had problems. Not nearly all of them. My 1995 STS has over 250,000 and still runs like new. No leaks, drips or fluid usage.
It is one of the best drivetrains produced by anyone, at any time in automotive history.
The series 3 (L32) has similar power output (260HP) but for the amount of work it just isn't worth the swap.
Uh, the Series III swap is no more difficult in any respect than the Series II.
It is a better engine and the Gen 5 supercharger is much better than the Gen 3 that is on the Series II. Mounts are the same, and the wiring is well documented.
If the drive-by-wire is intimidating, swap on a N* throttle body and wire it as a Series II......
[This message has been edited by olejoedad (edited 06-26-2014).]
Some of the NorthStars had problems. Not nearly all of them. My 1995 STS has over 250,000 and still runs like new. No leaks, drips or fluid usage.
It is one of the best drivetrains produced by anyone, at any time in automotive history.
That's great that your STS is still going strong. 250,000 miles and still running. That's cool. Being new to all this, I have to ask... what HP does your STS have?
Uh, the Series III swap is no more difficult in any respect than the Series II.
It is a better engine and the Gen 5 supercharger is much better than the Gen 3 that is on the Series II. Mounts are the same, and the wiring is well documented.
If the drive-by-wire is intimidating, swap on a N* throttle body and wire it as a Series II......
I have to ask... why is the Gen 5 supercharger better than the Gen 3?
. 
the Northstar would easily be considered one of the best engines ever. 
And the 6 speed really sounds nice, but the price over a 5 speed makes the 5 speed the winner.
