So I've seen different numbers posted for the T-Tops. I've even seen people say I've got 1 of 4 done in yellow GT with t-tops and the fleece seats. Is there an official list? Or are these estimates? Also, a follow up question, how many of each are left? I'm looking for opinions, I know nobody knows for sure. I would be willing to bet less than 10 percent of the base models still exist. Maybe 15 base models are drivable.
See when you ask how many TTop there are that is a loaded question.
There is one group that feel only the Factor 1988 Fieros count. But the also was the approved dealer installed tops that were done by Cars and Concepts from 1984-87.
The installed kits were the same accept for the very first few and the gasket seal and headliner trim gasket in the 88 was made one vs two piece.
These kits were 8,000 approximately. They were sold and installed and also used as warranty kits so all were not installed. A good estimate is over 7,000 T tops were made.
The break down no I’ve can say. Cars and Concepts installers did these and even the Michigan plant that did the factory cars did many of these early cars.
The truth is there are still a good number of t tops still around. They are not hard to find if you want one. Now one in good condition or parts are becoming very rare. Gaskets and ne glass tops are tough to find. Most used show wear.
So when you look at TTop you need to keep in mind this deal of the factory 88 cars and dealer installed models.
The 84-87 cars were approved to be modified by Cars And Concepts and be sold as new and not void the warranty. They were often sold by dealers with a side sticker much like the 88 with the top listed.
Sone were converted by owners who took their cars to Cars and Concepts. That was how mine was done in 1987.
So(m)e were converted by owners who took their cars to Cars and Concepts. That was how mine was done in 1987.
There have also been more than a few converted by their owners, or other entities like the Fiero Factory. I saw a complete T-top roof section, that had been removed from a car, for sale yesterday.
[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 02-20-2023).]
There have also been more than a few converted by their owners, or other entities like the Fiero Factory. I saw a complete T-top roof section, that had been removed from a car, for sale yesterday.
Yes but they are part of the original total. You can’t count them twice.
Some were installed in non Fiero kit cars as well others like the Mera from the C&C rep that filled me in.
True. Same story with the assemblies that were recycled from wrecked cars.
The waters are indeed muddy.
It is best to state near 8,000 kits made and from there just state the facts on how many 88 models and an asterisk about the dealer option to account for the recast.
Originally posted by hyperv6:There is one group that feel only the Factor 1988 Fieros count. But the also was the approved dealer installed tops that were done by Cars and Concepts from 1984-87.
Hahah... I remember those days. I love the 88s, but the same as I do the 84s. I suppose it would be different if say, we were talking about an ultra-rare 1969 Corvette Stingray Convertible with factory 427 and dual holley carbs, and factory sidepipes... but we're talking about Fieros. I love the cars, and I wouldn't trade my 87 Fiero SE / V6 for a 69 Stingray for any amount of money. But people definitely need to get off that "88s are the only ones that are important..." because at the end of the day, literally everyone else just sees it as a Fiero... or some Italian sports car from this weird Italian company named Pontiac that they've never heard of.
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Originally posted by hyperv6:Now one in good condition or parts are becoming very rare. Gaskets and ne glass tops are tough to find. Most used show wear.
Back in the 90s and early 2000s... I used to hit the junkyard almost every weekend. I probably saved at least 4 sets of T-Tops and whatever parts I could get off of them. I'd sell them as-is, and usually didn't make much money on it beyond what I paid... just wanted to save them for people who needed them.
Fun fact, I used to have a 1981 Pontiac TransAm that had the Hurst or Fischer T-Tops... it had the rare C&C T-Tops... which were significantly better.
[This message has been edited by 82-T/A [At Work] (edited 02-28-2023).]
Back in the 90s and early 2000s... I used to hit the junkyard almost every weekend. I probably saved at least 4 sets of T-Tops and whatever parts I could get off of them. I'd sell them as-is, and usually didn't make much money on it beyond what I paid... just wanted to save them for people who needed them.
Fun fact, I used to have a 1981 Pontiac TransAm that had the Hurst or Fischer T-Tops... it had the rare C&C T-Tops... which were significantly better.
Yes because there were not many Fieros that were that significantly different in a COPO kind of way some like to make out colors and some options as being more special than they really are. It just was not an era of special cars unless you got a pilot car with the 1990 dash in it or power steering.
I wish I had stocked up on T top parts. I did buy a second set of tops new just because if you drop one it is not easy to find a good quality set anymore. I figure if I have them I hope to never need them.
One thing I have noted is depending on who did the install on the 84-87 often they are done to a higher degree. They were a two day install and one guy would do it for the C&C installer. Things match up better on most of them but not all.
I can just say the more T tops the better as if they only had built the 88 parts would be even more difficult to find.
I used to laugh as they used to say the yellow Formula T top was the most rare I think. They are few but I had three of them right in my area. I looked at one to buy but it was a bit rough. Yellow was not my color either.
This just popped into my inbox, for those of you who are still on the Fiero List. I don't see it being advertised anywhere on here, so I thought I would share...
Black / Grey 1988 Fiero GT Automatic w/ C&C TTOPS... it's complete, a little faded, but otherwise seems to be in decent shape for it's age. It's in New Mexico currently, so there's no rust... just a bit dusty and the black paint is faded.
Guy basically wants $5,000 for it. Says it was running when parked 3 years ago... it's been sitting since then. He had intended to put a 4.9 Caddy V8 in it, but due to health issues, has decided he won't be able to do it.
Pictures at the link...
Hope someone can pick it up and save it, and not part it out.
Note, he didn't leave contact information, but if you're part of the Google Groups, you can respond. I've asked for his info.
This just popped into my inbox, for those of you who are still on the Fiero List. I don't see it being advertised anywhere on here, so I thought I would share...
Black / Grey 1988 Fiero GT Automatic w/ C&C TTOPS... it's complete, a little faded, but otherwise seems to be in decent shape for it's age. It's in New Mexico currently, so there's no rust... just a bit dusty and the black paint is faded.
Guy basically wants $5,000 for it. Says it was running when parked 3 years ago... it's been sitting since then. He had intended to put a 4.9 Caddy V8 in it, but due to health issues, has decided he won't be able to do it.
Pictures at the link...
Hope someone can pick it up and save it, and not part it out.
Note, he didn't leave contact information, but if you're part of the Google Groups, you can respond. I've asked for his info.
The wife is pissed. She said I don't need another Fiero. I told her I need a new wife, .
Everything has to go. I have to take a Cadillac 4.9 engine he bought, the parts he got to install it,(I think the wiring harness modified , computer, I don't know what all), and anything else related.
I told him I did not want to take it for free, yet he almost insisted.
He did say he wanted someone who is a Fiero enthusiast to have it. It would not have ever gone to the crusher.
My wife said I have to get rid of something. She is wrong again, .
The wife is pissed. She said I don't need another Fiero. I told her I need a new wife, .
Everything has to go. I have to take a Cadillac 4.9 engine he bought, the parts he got to install it,(I think the wiring harness modified , computer, I don't know what all), and anything else related.
I told him I did not want to take it for free, yet he almost insisted.
He did say he wanted someone who is a Fiero enthusiast to have it. It would not have ever gone to the crusher.
My wife said I have to get rid of something. She is wrong again, .
It couldn't have gone to a better person Cliff... this guy fell on hard times, and it seems like he made a lot of effort getting all the right parts.
Somewhat related but I purchased one of the last C&C t tops kits back around 1990. I read an article in Hot Rod? magazine that C&C located in Brighton, MI (about an hour from our home) was getting rid of all their Fiero t top inventory. Since I knew that C&C was the subcontractor that installed the 88 Fiero t tops, I called them up and I think they told me they had around 10 complete t tops kits available. I immediately made an appointment to drop my 85 GT car off. About a week later I picked up my car with the new t top installed. I can't remember how much I paid, but I know it wasn't a bad price.
[This message has been edited by ChopTop (edited 04-02-2023).]
See when you ask how many TTop there are that is a loaded question.
There is one group that feel only the Factor 1988 Fieros count. But the also was the approved dealer installed tops that were done by Cars and Concepts from 1984-87.
The kits were also installed on 88's of course. I've got an 88 that had the Ts installed in 88 from a C&C distributor. Invoice was I want to say about $1400 parts + labor. Think that was comparable to the CBJ price if I'm not mistaken.
They did a good job except they didn't cut the headliner backing enough by the dome light, so when I redid the headliner I cut the material back slightly and it looks perfect now.
Thankfully I was able to get a spare set of glass for them from a junkyard 20 years ago just in case anything ever happens. Pretty much anything else could be fabricated or repaired other than the glass if need be. I had to epoxy repair one of the bolt holes for one of the plastic pieces of trim for instance.
The kits were also installed on 88's of course. I've got an 88 that had the Ts installed in 88 from a C&C distributor. Invoice was I want to say about $1400 parts + labor. Think that was comparable to the CBJ price if I'm not mistaken.
They did a good job except they didn't cut the headliner backing enough by the dome light, so when I redid the headliner I cut the material back slightly and it looks perfect now.
Thankfully I was able to get a spare set of glass for them from a junkyard 20 years ago just in case anything ever happens. Pretty much anything else could be fabricated or repaired other than the glass if need be. I had to epoxy repair one of the bolt holes for one of the plastic pieces of trim for instance.
C&C installed tops right up to the early 90’s. The last install was done the week of one of the Fiero meets. The owner went early and had it install and showed the car that Saturday.
There just was no exact accounting of every kit.
When mine was done in 87 it was done by a C&C installer and it was written up under the dealer I purchased it from to make it a dealer installed option not to void the warranty.
I think I was around $1200.
I got the NOS tops as insurance. I thought if I need them I have em and I should be able to sell them for more than I paid if I ever need to sell.
C&C installed tops right up to the early 90’s. The last install was done the week of one of the Fiero meets. The owner went early and had it install and showed the car that Saturday.
There just was no exact accounting of every kit.
When mine was done in 87 it was done by a C&C installer and it was written up under the dealer I purchased it from to make it a dealer installed option not to void the warranty.
I think I was around $1200.
I got the NOS tops as insurance. I thought if I need them I have em and I should be able to sell them for more than I paid if I ever need to sell.
I was mainly trying to point out that non-CJB kits weren't just installed on 84-87, which was what had been stated/implied earlier in the thread by you and others. CJB was 88 only but the 8000? C&C dealer installs were any and all years including 88s.
Also people like to say there were 1252 or whatever 88 Fieros with T-tops but that is just the CJB number not the actual number including the non-CJB kits. Probably more like 2000+ 88s had T-tops.
I just yesterday saw that one of the wreckers here in Sweden have parts from a 1988 GT T-top taken into traffic in 1989. Considering the year of the car Id assume it was a factory T-top. Now disassembled and being sold as parts. The car wasnt even crashed or anything so it makes you wonder why it got sent to be wrecked. For sure it would have been easy to fix it.
I was wondering if itd be a good idea to buy the glass panels, are there any worth in them?
[This message has been edited by Kraniet (edited 08-20-2025).]
I just yesterday saw that one of the wreckers here in Sweden have parts from a 1988 GT T-top taken into traffic in 1989. Considering the year of the car Id assume it was a factory T-top. Now disassembled and being sold as parts. The car wasnt even crashed or anything so it makes you wonder why it got sent to be wrecked. For sure it would have been easy to fix it.
I was wondering if itd be a good idea to buy the glass panels, are there any worth in them?
They'd be worth some money over here, but over there I highly doubt it.
I just yesterday saw that one of the wreckers here in Sweden have parts from a 1988 GT T-top taken into traffic in 1989. Considering the year of the car Id assume it was a factory T-top. Now disassembled and being sold as parts. The car wasnt even crashed or anything so it makes you wonder why it got sent to be wrecked. For sure it would have been easy to fix it.
I was wondering if itd be a good idea to buy the glass panels, are there any worth in them?
Yes worth saving the glass and gaskets. To be honest with saving any parts.
Car may be rusted under the body and not with repair or a bad engine not worth the cost to whole owned it to fix in Europe.
Either way the parts if in goid shape are worth money including plastic parts.
There have also been more than a few converted by their owners, or other entities like the Fiero Factory. I saw a complete T-top roof section, that had been removed from a car, for sale yesterday.
Radar,
My 88 Mera (based on a GT Frame) is one of the cars converted from a hard top to a t-top.
My 88 Mera (based on a GT Frame) is one of the cars converted from a hard top to a t-top.
Nelson
Technically every Fiero t top, cjb or not was "converted" from a hard top (or sometimes sunroof), it's just whether Pontiac themselves shipped the cars to the conversion factory before the dealers, or whether the dealers shipped the cars independently or a person had it done independently.
So here's my t top story, but it's been so long and my memory has become fuzzy. Sometime in the early 90s Hot Rod or Car Craft Magazine? ran a short paragraph stating the C&C was liquidating their Fiero t-top kits. Since I lived so close I called them up and drove to the C&C factory in Brighton MI, and had them installed a set on my 85GT. I also seem to remember them telling me that since the magazine article came out that I had bought one of their last t-top sets. I think it only took a day for C&C to install it. Like I said it was a long time ago and I can't remember the price, but I do remember that was it was cheaper than aftermarket kits. Plus I seem to remember they did have the C&C logo etched into the t-top glass.
So here's my t top story, but it's been so long and my memory has become fuzzy. Sometime in the early 90s Hot Rod or Car Craft Magazine? ran a short paragraph stating the C&C was liquidating their Fiero t-top kits. Since I lived so close I called them up and drove to the C&C factory in Brighton MI, and had them installed a set on my 85GT. I also seem to remember them telling me that since the magazine article came out that I had bought one of their last t-top sets. I think it only took a day for C&C to install it. Like I said it was a long time ago and I can't remember the price, but I do remember that was it was cheaper than aftermarket kits. Plus I seem to remember they did have the C&C logo etched into the t-top glass.
Yes the last kit to be installed was like 1992. The top was done by Skylite Sunroofs the new name for Cars and Concepts.
The car owner came to the Fiero event at the Pontiac headquarters and Silverdome and had the top installed that week in time for the car show. It was a one day install.
I had hung out at the show with the owner of of the company and former head of the program at C&C. He still has the second 88 T top the last I saw him. He is a rep for performance companies now and may be retired by now. I also had dinner with him that night. He was able to fill in much on the T tops as to how many and how it was operated.
He used a pilot car in 1983 to make the first T top. The engineers at GM said it could not be done. He said in a couple weeks they had the car really. He took it to Pontiac and they were shocked it could be done.
He went back every year asking to be a factory installed top but never coupe ge the deal done till 1988.
But he did get it secured to where they could make the tops a dealer installed item. Dealers could send the cars to C&C or even a C&C shop around the country and have the tops installed and then sell it as a new car with full warranty. They added a small side sticker like the 88.
In many cases the early cars were installed better as they were done by the one trained top guy at the shop and often took two days to install it as it was not a rush. Prices were about what the 88 price was.
Mine was done in 1987 on my 1985. They did it under the name of my dealer who was selling T tops they converted. This way my warranties were safe.
Much Is made about the 88 cars but all of them are nearly alike and the 88 really holds little special over any other t top. It is just good to have a good t top car period.
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