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Two Tone 1988 GT by Mythrondir
Started on: 04-29-2021 08:15 PM
Replies: 31 (560 views)
Last post by: Mythrondir on 05-05-2021 12:32 AM
Mythrondir
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Report this Post04-29-2021 08:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MythrondirSend a Private Message to MythrondirEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Just bought a 1988 GT and it's red with silver lower accent. In a matrix I found online, it indicated that the '88 GT didn't come with the two tone (lower accent) option. However, the previous owner had all of the paperwork back to the beginning of life for the car and we can't find anything indicating that it was painted that way. If it was aftermarket painted, they did an amazing job. Does anyone have any definitive knowledge of the production paint job of the '88 GT's?
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Report this Post04-29-2021 08:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for skywurzClick Here to visit skywurz's HomePageSend a Private Message to skywurzEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
If the 10th digit on the vin is J its probably been painted or panels swapped. Does it have the vin tags on all the body panels?

See this chart from 88 database guy


As found here https://www.fiero.nl/forum/.../HTML/074587-18.html
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Mythrondir
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Report this Post04-29-2021 08:58 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MythrondirSend a Private Message to MythrondirEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Sky, thank you for the response. That's a great idea to check the VIN's and I'll do that, it may clear this up. Thanks again.
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Report this Post04-29-2021 10:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierofoolClick Here to visit fierofool's HomePageClick Here to Email fierofoolSend a Private Message to fierofoolEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The paint code will also be on the RPO tag on the left front fender wall, near the master cylinder. It will have an upper and lower color that should match for an 88. If there are two colors indicated, and the VIN says 88 then you have a rare one.
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Mythrondir
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Report this Post04-30-2021 12:05 AM Click Here to See the Profile for MythrondirSend a Private Message to MythrondirEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thank you Fiero, another great path to solving the question. I'll post what I find tomorrow.
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css9450
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Report this Post04-30-2021 08:04 AM Click Here to See the Profile for css9450Click Here to Email css9450Send a Private Message to css9450Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I bet the original owner who bought the car was disappointed when GM did away with the silver on the lower body and thought it looked cheap. "Have you seen the new Fieros for 1988? All one color! Stupid penny pinching GM!" So they took it to the body shop and had them paint the lower body in silver to match the '86 and '87 GTs. Of course, 30+ years later the '88s are highly desireable and no one thinks they look cheap or weird.

[This message has been edited by css9450 (edited 04-30-2021).]

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cam-a-lot
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Report this Post04-30-2021 09:21 AM Click Here to See the Profile for cam-a-lotSend a Private Message to cam-a-lotEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by css9450:

I bet the original owner who bought the car was disappointed when GM did away with the silver on the lower body and thought it looked cheap. "Have you seen the new Fieros for 1988? All one color! Stupid penny pinching GM!" So they took it to the body shop and had them paint the lower body in silver to match the '86 and '87 GTs. Of course, 30+ years later the '88s are highly desireable and no one thinks they look cheap or weird.



Two tone cars were stylish in the 70's and 80's, but tastes change. It doesn't make the car look "cheap" that is has one color instead of two. Just personal preference, or a design decision based on what they assumed was changing customer tastes Trans-AM , Mustang, etc of that area also started moving to a single color by late 80's

[This message has been edited by cam-a-lot (edited 04-30-2021).]

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Report this Post04-30-2021 10:07 AM Click Here to See the Profile for css9450Click Here to Email css9450Send a Private Message to css9450Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by cam-a-lot:

Two tone cars were stylish in the 70's and 80's, but tastes change. It doesn't make the car look "cheap" that is has one color instead of two. Just personal preference, or a design decision based on what they assumed was changing customer tastes Trans-AM , Mustang, etc of that area also started moving to a single color by late 80's



I was merely speculating. It is possible the original owner preferred the two-tone GTs; hence why he might have had it painted. That is all.

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Report this Post04-30-2021 02:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RaydarClick Here to Email RaydarSend a Private Message to RaydarEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by css9450:
I was merely speculating. It is possible the original owner preferred the two-tone GTs; hence why he might have had it painted. That is all.


Probably the most likely scenario. I had a white 85 GT with silver, and really considered having the aero pieces painted monotone. Just to be different.
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Mythrondir
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Report this Post04-30-2021 05:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MythrondirSend a Private Message to MythrondirEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Ok, on FieroFool's advice, and very "non-foolish" advice if I may, I checked the RPO codes and found that the paint is listed as 81U but no 18L is listed, thus effectively telling me that no lower code was present. However, that's a bit confusing since there is no reason to include the "U" if there is no upper AND lower codes to consider. Also, the Fisher code is WA-8774, again the Bright Red, but no lower code. Lastly, beside the Fisher code is another 81U with that confusing "U" thrown in there.

Can anyone confirm that a two tone RPO tag would clearly show something different. I'm 99% sure that it was repainted, but since I'm working on keeping the car as original as possible, I want to know for it's provenance sake. Thank you to everyone who has posted so far!

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RAREW66
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Report this Post05-01-2021 02:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RAREW66Click Here to visit RAREW66's HomePageClick Here to Email RAREW66Send a Private Message to RAREW66Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The U81U at the bottom of the SPI tag is the primary body paint code. The 81U RPO Code is the build option code. In MY1988, Monochrome paint was specified by the manufacturer as the paint option for GT's.

86 and 87 GT's were specified to have the silver lower accent as part of the GT option package. The 86/87 GT would have the RPO code 18L included in the build options for Medium Gray Metallic Lower Accent Color.

The absence of the 18L RPO code on your pictured Spi tag would be the indicator that the car was not equipped from the factory with the lower accent painted silver.

Fred

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Report this Post05-01-2021 05:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by cam-a-lot:

Two tone cars were stylish in the 70's and 80's, but tastes change. It doesn't make the car look "cheap" that is has one color instead of two. Just personal preference...


I've always preferred the two-tone Fiero GTs. The single-tone '88 GTs always remind me of a home garage or cheap Maaco paint job where everything (except for the tires!) is painted the same color.
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Report this Post05-03-2021 02:14 AM Click Here to See the Profile for MythrondirSend a Private Message to MythrondirEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thank you all for the assistance in confirming what I have and the opinions regarding the same. For the record, even though it isn't the "correct" paint job for the '88, I like the two tone and they did do an amazing job on it. All of the VIN's match, so at least that's still intact.

Again, thank you!
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Report this Post05-03-2021 02:34 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Mythrondir:

For the record, even though it isn't the "correct" paint job for the '88, I like the two tone and they did do an amazing job on it.


Come on now... you've got to at least post a picture or two!
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Mythrondir
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Report this Post05-03-2021 10:20 AM Click Here to See the Profile for MythrondirSend a Private Message to MythrondirEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
This has been a 37 year journey for me, getting my Fiero, and as such you would think I would have more pictures already. Have just had her a week, so just have the pic of her on the trailer coming home and one right after a bath, but plan on a many more. Thanks for asking!



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Report this Post05-03-2021 11:42 AM Click Here to See the Profile for skywurzClick Here to visit skywurz's HomePageSend a Private Message to skywurzEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Im actually Wondering if the vin sticker under the rear license plate is there. Good shops will replace them or at least mask them
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Report this Post05-03-2021 11:48 AM Click Here to See the Profile for css9450Click Here to Email css9450Send a Private Message to css9450Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Interesting to see the '88 staggered wheels painted up in silver to look like the earlier ones. We've seen plenty of '86-87s painted to look like '88s (including painting the wheels) but this is the first time I remember seeing one go the other way.

Reminds me of when I was a kid and my dad had a VW Bug. We had a Warshawsky catalog at home and I wanted to order new taillights, bumpers, headlights and whatever else I could find to "backdate" it to look like an earlier one.
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Mythrondir
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Report this Post05-03-2021 12:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MythrondirSend a Private Message to MythrondirEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Sky, there isn't a VIN under the rear plate, or even any evidence of one. Sounds like more evidence of a repaint.

CSS, I checked the wheels and they don't appear to be painted, they look and feel like regular solid wheels (picture below). Is it not possible that, if this was a backdating, that the previous owner didn't go out and buy '87 Fiero wheels?

Anyone else want to weigh in on the wheel issue? We just keep going further down the rabbit hole here.

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Report this Post05-03-2021 01:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for css9450Click Here to Email css9450Send a Private Message to css9450Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Mythrondir:

CSS, I checked the wheels and they don't appear to be painted, they look and feel like regular solid wheels (picture below). Is it not possible that, if this was a backdating, that the previous owner didn't go out and buy '87 Fiero wheels?



On the '88s, the front wheels were narrower than the rears (the difference is easy to see by comparing the outer lip between the two).

Yours does look like it has the correct narrow '88 wheel in the front, unless I'm just not seeing it correctly due to the camera angle.
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Mythrondir
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Report this Post05-03-2021 01:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MythrondirSend a Private Message to MythrondirEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Wow! I was all over that car this weekend cleaning and wiping (and, yes, a bit of drool was involved) and I didn't even notice that the fronts were narrower. You have some kind of optic superpower to notice that from that pic. So, yes, the fronts are more narrow. If the wheels were not actually painted, and I'm not a painter and don't play one on TV, but they really look factory with the sealer on them and all, what does that mean. Were there no '88 silver staggered honeycomb wheels? I thought I knew a lot about Fieros, but what I don't know could fill the Library of Congress apparently. Thank you for all the feedback!
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Report this Post05-03-2021 01:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for skywurzClick Here to visit skywurz's HomePageSend a Private Message to skywurzEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by css9450:


On the '88s, the front wheels were narrower than the rears (the difference is easy to see by comparing the outer lip between the two).

Yours does look like it has the correct narrow '88 wheel in the front, unless I'm just not seeing it correctly due to the camera angle.


Im seeing the same. Looks like the correct narrow in the front. What I also see is the Fiero badge on the center cap. This another non 88 item.
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Report this Post05-03-2021 02:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Mythrondir:

Were there no '88 silver staggered honeycomb wheels? I thought I knew a lot about Fieros, but what I don't know could fill the Library of Congress apparently.


The super Fiero braniacs will be able to chime in and determine the year of the wheels by the relative location of the valve stems on them. Seriously!

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 05-03-2021).]

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Mythrondir
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Report this Post05-03-2021 02:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MythrondirSend a Private Message to MythrondirEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
That's equal parts impressive, scary, and magic....

I'll yield the floor to the brainiacs, there still is mystery surrounding the '88 Fiero cleverly disguised as an '87.

Thank you Patrick!
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Report this Post05-03-2021 03:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I found a very informative thread (with lots of pictures) about Fiero wheels - Is this a wheel off an 88 GT?
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Mythrondir
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Report this Post05-03-2021 04:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MythrondirSend a Private Message to MythrondirEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The rabbit hole just opened up further and I thought I saw some small guys with picks coming toward me. I have three wheels with the logo cap and valve stems in the middle of the spoke and one wheel with the logo cap and valve stem on the point (rear passenger). I have the PH0 code in my RPO's, indicating the staggered honeycomb wheel but no color indicated. I'm going to put new belts on this weekend and will get a closer look at the wheel while I have it off (for signs of it being painted), but for now I still have questions. I feel like I may have the Johnny Cash Cadillac....

By the way, great post you found there and thank you for the direction. I'll let you know when I find out more.
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Report this Post05-03-2021 09:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguruSend a Private Message to fieroguruEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The mirrors should be black, not body color, so just another data point down the repaint path.

Still a very nice looking car.
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Report this Post05-03-2021 09:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for skywurzClick Here to visit skywurz's HomePageSend a Private Message to skywurzEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fieroguru:
Still a very nice looking car.


Oh yes. I doubt anyone is saying otherwise.

This is just a really interesting case. Kind of like when we found that one 87 that was a revinned 88... except less nefarious.

The mirrors could have been pulled and painted. Until this was pointed out I was thinking someone may have pulled the trim and the bumpers and had them painted . nearly all of the repainted cars I have had contact with have overspray between the fender and door. There is also the section under the windshield wipers that typically does not get touched in a respray.

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Report this Post05-03-2021 10:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MythrondirSend a Private Message to MythrondirEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Guru and Sky, greatly appreciate the kind words about the car. I've never felt that anyone was being uncomplimentary, just helping me figure out her provenance, but thank you again for the boost.

Guru, that is one thing that I did find out, the mirrors WERE black. There is small ding on the passenger one that shows black underneath, so great catch and further background info.

Sky, since the VINs all match, and the RPO says Bright Red, I think you're probably on the money with your hypothesis. While I haven't noticed any overspray, I'll check a bit closer this weekend and confirm if this was a full repaint or just the trim and, now, mirrors. That will be a final solve on the body and maybe someone else will wander in here with a bit more insight into the wheels.

All in all, she has the exact two tone look I wanted with the MY1988 improvements, so a win for me no matter what.

Thank you all again for the great education.
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Report this Post05-04-2021 12:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RaydarClick Here to Email RaydarSend a Private Message to RaydarEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Mythrondir:
...
So, yes, the fronts are more narrow. If the wheels were not actually painted, and I'm not a painter and don't play one on TV, but they really look factory with the sealer on them and all, what does that mean.



I would say that if they seem to be sealed, they were probably powder coated, instead of painted. That tells me that whoever wanted the change was willing to pay whatever was required to do it right

 
quote


Were there no '88 silver staggered honeycomb wheels?


None that I have ever seen. Most were black. Some were gold (available as an option on certain GTs.)
I have seen a few painted bright red, but I'm not sure about the back story on those. Maybe a dealer option, or done by the owners.
Never a silver or gray on an 88.

Somebody went to a great deal of trouble to make yours look like it came that way, and appears to have done a nice job of it.

Edit - It also looks to have been lowered a bit. At least in the front. (IMHO, most 88s seem to sit a bit too high in the front, anyway.)


------------------
Raydar
88 Formula IMSA Fastback. 4.9, NVG T550

Praise the Lowered!

[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 05-04-2021).]

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Report this Post05-04-2021 12:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pmbrunelleClick Here to Email pmbrunelleSend a Private Message to pmbrunelleEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Mythrondir:
I'll yield the floor to the brainiacs, there still is mystery surrounding the '88 Fiero cleverly disguised as an '87.


It's more of an 86 disguise, not an 87 disguise.

87 Fieros didn't come in that red colour.
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Report this Post05-04-2021 01:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for css9450Click Here to Email css9450Send a Private Message to css9450Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Raydar:

I have seen a few painted bright red, but I'm not sure about the back story on those. Maybe a dealer option, or done by the owners.




My car had Medium Red wheels when I bought it, which I assume was done by Twin Lakes Fiero as they (he?) had been a previous owner. The rears however were pretty beat up along the rim and when I got a chance to get a much-nicer set of black wheels, I jumped on them.



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Report this Post05-05-2021 12:32 AM Click Here to See the Profile for MythrondirSend a Private Message to MythrondirEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Raydar, I rechecked the RPO's on the car and found, again, the PHO indicating staggered wheels but I also found 19P, which identifies "wheel color, black", so you were spot on with that thought that they started out black. To your point, someone went to a great deal of trouble getting them silver and you absolutely can't tell they were painted. Again, I'll have that rear passenger off this weekend to change the belts and I'll see if they went to the same detail on the back of the wheel. Great call though! As to the lowering, any quick way to tell if that was done?

BTW, I'm generally not a fan of blue (long backstory that I won't bore you with) but I have to say that your signature car looks amazing. Thanks for sharing it.

PMBrunelle, thanks for clearing up the "disguise year", I would hate to look any more ignorant standing around telling a bunch of Fierofiles that I liked the '87 colors and getting that "he is lost as last year's Easter Egg" look.

CSS, once more appreciate the input and education. I'm confident that this is far from the last time I get schooled on this car.
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