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Turbocharging the 2.8 by Junkbox12
Started on: 05-09-2017 11:06 PM
Replies: 34 (1758 views)
Last post by: hnthomps on 09-26-2020 08:13 AM
Junkbox12
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Report this Post05-09-2017 11:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Junkbox12Click Here to Email Junkbox12Send a Private Message to Junkbox12Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Hey guys, I'm picking up my old project with my 85 gt that has a 2.8 bored to a 3.1. I have a t3/t4 turbocharger and most of the necessary components however I am looking for some advice. I plan on pushing around 10 psi of boost with the stock fuel regulator but I have an aftermarket regulator that I was considering using on the return line to help with the boost pushing back on the fuel lines. Besides this I also have the Ford 25lbs injectors as well as the 17lbs injectors from the fiero store.

I am trying to figure out the best and most simple configuration for the fuel to work with the boost.

Does anyone have any thoughts on the regulators or which injectors would be best?
Thanks in advance.

[This message has been edited by Junkbox12 (edited 05-09-2017).]

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Report this Post05-09-2017 11:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for shemdoggSend a Private Message to shemdoggEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Sounds cool throw up some pics! Id go with an adjustable regulator and try the 17lb injectors first till u get it dialed in. No ford parts on a cheby meng!

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Report this Post05-10-2017 10:18 AM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Before anyone comes in here and says "Why? V8 r better!" or "Why not 3800SC?", just do what you want to do, and photo document the journey for us.
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Report this Post05-10-2017 11:23 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Junkbox12Click Here to Email Junkbox12Send a Private Message to Junkbox12Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks for the replies, I did more research and found that others were experiencing too much fuel with the 19lbs injectors so the 17lbs seem to be the right fit for the moment along with the adjustable fuel pressure regulator on the return line so I think I'll take your advice there shem.

Truth be told I already have a pretty clean 86 gt with the 3800sc conversion but this project I'm on now is the fiero I had since high school and I happened to come across a full turbo kit for rather cheap so I figured it would be fun to do. Lol

I will post some pictures but keep in mind that this is a limited budget build and will be as simple as possible (so it probably won't look fantastic lol)

BTW the Ford injectors i have are 19lbs instead of 25 like I thought, so I have access to the 15, 17, and 19 injectors.

[This message has been edited by Junkbox12 (edited 05-10-2017).]

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Report this Post05-10-2017 07:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pmbrunelleClick Here to Email pmbrunelleSend a Private Message to pmbrunelleEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The stock regulator already has a manifold pressure reference line; it's already set up from the factory to balance each psi of boost pressure with one psi of additional fuel pressure.

So I would just keep the stock regulator; one less adjustment to mess around with (and potentially screw up).

I would use the biggest injectors among your set. The tune should be reducing the pulse widths to avoid over-fueling at low loads.

If 15 lb/hr was good enough for a 140 hp engine, 17 lb/hr isn't much of a step up... With a turbo, you'll be flowing more air, but if you can't deliver more fuel to match the increased airflow, then you won't gain power.

I'm currently in the midst of a turbo Fiero engine project!
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Report this Post05-10-2017 08:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hnthompsClick Here to Email hnthompsSend a Private Message to hnthompsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I had a turbo 2.8 engine in a car when I purchased it. The engine had around 60 k miles on it and was rapidly failing with around a 7 psi boost. I took a quick look when the engine was pulled for a 3800 SC swap and the bearings were shot. Oiling on the 2.8 is not so good. That being said, I do also have a turbo 3.4 (push rod type) that is doing rather well. I have had a turbo failure but that is all. BTW, I used 19# Ford injectors in this engine and it ran way rich prior to custom reprograming of the ECU. Do not be surprised if your project runs rather rich at first.

Nelson
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Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post05-12-2017 10:54 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
If you turbo the 2.8L the reprogramming of the timing tables for boost and vacuum in the ECM prom and the use of a 2 BAR MAP sensor is mandatory. A knock sensor is also recommended but you will need the 85 Fiero V6 ECM, an ESC module and a knock sensor. There is a switch in the 85 V6 program for turning on the knock sensor. You might be able to get close on the fueling with injector and fuel pressure adjustments but spark timing is very critical. With boost, excessive advance that you will get in the stock V6 timing table program will blow the engine up in a short while.
If you do the job right, the increase in performance will be significant.

------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
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Report this Post09-21-2020 02:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jjd2296Send a Private Message to jjd2296Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I know this post is a few years old but i do have a question. I will be boosting (SC to be exact) my 3.4 PR build. I have done a tone of work to this engine (well not really all me) to get it to around 185-190hp (estimate) which puts me at the limit for the 17lb injectors before SC.

Im going with 8lbs of boost so that should mean that I need 28lb injectors so that I have some room to play with.
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Report this Post09-21-2020 02:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jjd2296Send a Private Message to jjd2296Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

jjd2296

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quote
Originally posted by hnthomps:

I had a turbo 2.8 engine in a car when I purchased it. The engine had around 60 k miles on it and was rapidly failing with around a 7 psi boost. I took a quick look when the engine was pulled for a 3800 SC swap and the bearings were shot. Oiling on the 2.8 is not so good. That being said, I do also have a turbo 3.4 (push rod type) that is doing rather well. I have had a turbo failure but that is all. BTW, I used 19# Ford injectors in this engine and it ran way rich prior to custom reprograming of the ECU. Do not be surprised if your project runs rather rich at first.

Nelson


how much boost you running on that 3.4? i take it all you did was swap the block no other performance work?
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Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post09-21-2020 07:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jjd2296:


how much boost you running on that 3.4? i take it all you did was swap the block no other performance work?


If you run Ross Forged pistons they can handle high boost like 10-12 psi but you will still be limited by the rods. I've run constant 12 psi boost in my 3.4L P/R engine, with a turbo program 2 bar map, knock sensor and an adjustable FP regulator and all has run fine. I also use the Bosch 69225 fuel pump that can supply even a V8's needs.

------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, P-log Manifold, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, Champion Radiator, S10 Brake Booster, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

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Report this Post09-21-2020 09:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pmbrunelleClick Here to Email pmbrunelleSend a Private Message to pmbrunelleEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua:
If you run Ross Forged pistons they can handle high boost like 10-12 psi but you will still be limited by the rods.


I've gone there with hypereutectic pistons sucessfully... no long term experience though.

Lets say the equivalent of 20 quarter-mile passes.
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Report this Post09-21-2020 09:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Thunderstruck GTSend a Private Message to Thunderstruck GTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Hmmmm…….

Factory




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Report this Post09-21-2020 10:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hyperv6Send a Private Message to hyperv6Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My past experience of watching people try to turbo a 2.8 have been interesting.

The engine is known to have a shorter life due to bearing issues under boost. The other thing I saw was blown head gaskets unless O rings were added to the heads.

There was a guy in PA that did a lot of work on this and broke a number of engines till he had a stable combo. But even then the power was not up to other cheaper easier options.

Then you hav3 the heat issues to deal with too.

I have seen a couple of good turbo set up’s but they have been few and far in between. Often at the high cost to achieve them.

If I were to do a turbocharge a Fiero it would be the LNF 2.0 like what I had in my HHR SS. It was a great engine and very durable.

I was running the GM Tune with 21-23 psi of boost on pump gas for 10 years as a daily driver. It was fantastic and 300 HP and 315 ft lbs of torque. You would have to deal with some install changes for the DI and engine but it would be an engine built to take boost.
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Report this Post09-22-2020 07:14 AM Click Here to See the Profile for hnthompsClick Here to Email hnthompsSend a Private Message to hnthompsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jjd2296:


how much boost you running on that 3.4? i take it all you did was swap the block no other performance work?


I am running about 7 psi of boost with a very conservative tune. It does have 19 pound Ford injectors, 272 cam, custom fuel tables, and a Trueleo intake coupled with somewhat unique cold air intake piping.



Nelson

[This message has been edited by hnthomps (edited 09-22-2020).]

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Report this Post09-22-2020 09:49 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Honest DonSend a Private Message to Honest DonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I’m an advocate of running more pump and injector than what you think you actually need. The internet is full of stories of people being limited by fuel system. In my experience, the worst part of oversized injectors is that the cranking pulse is a bit more finicky to get right, but I don’t have a stock ecm.


[This message has been edited by Honest Don (edited 09-22-2020).]

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Report this Post09-22-2020 10:16 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jjd2296Send a Private Message to jjd2296Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
do you have an inter-cooler set up? and is this a 2.8 or 3.4 block?

 
quote
Originally posted by hnthomps:


I am running about 7 psi of boost with a very conservative tune. It does have 19 pound Ford injectors, 272 cam, custom fuel tables, and a Trueleo intake coupled with somewhat unique cold air intake piping.



Nelson

[This message has been edited by jjd2296 (edited 09-22-2020).]

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Report this Post09-22-2020 10:44 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Thunderstruck GTSend a Private Message to Thunderstruck GTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
There once was a guy I knew by the name of Fran Passsute (sp?). Fran was the original owner of an Indy Pace Car that he customized with a ton of firsts. Fran was the first to convert a notchback into a fastback, the first to use 16" wheels, the first to do an engine swap (2.8L-V6) and the first to install a turbo on a 2.8L in a Fiero.

It was a highly publicized vehicle with articles in just about every car magazine. I'm sure people here remember the car as there was ever only one like it.

Sadly, I have not seen Fran in several years and his beloved IPC seems to have disappeared off the face of the earth. But I can tell you that Fran never had an issue with that turbocharged 2.8L-V6 and loved spanking Mustang GT's and Corvettes.
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Report this Post09-22-2020 12:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pmbrunelleClick Here to Email pmbrunelleSend a Private Message to pmbrunelleEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Honest Don:

I’m an advocate of running more pump and injector than what you think you actually need. The internet is full of stories of people being limited by fuel system. In my experience, the worst part of oversized injectors is that the cranking pulse is a bit more finicky to get right, but I don’t have a stock ecm.






That's really fast to 60 mph compared to my (standard transmission) Fiero, which does it in about 7 seconds. The two gearchanges take a bunch of time, as well as respooling the turbo after the gearchanges.

In MS2/Extra, there is a option you can select to inject on alternate cranking events, so the same fuel is delivered to the engine, but using half the number of squirts. The injectors therefore work at greater pulse widths.

Also, there is some "injector quality" parameter that I can't pinpoint. When I had 30 lb/hr Accel injectors, I had a very hard time finding the line between flooding the engine and underfueling the engine during cranking. With the Bosch 42 lb/hr injectors I have now, there was a wide enough range of pulse widths that worked. I settled on a cranking pulse width centered in the range of workable values.

Yes, I committed the mistake you speak of. I initially undersized my fuel system

[This message has been edited by pmbrunelle (edited 09-22-2020).]

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Report this Post09-22-2020 02:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Honest DonSend a Private Message to Honest DonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by pmbrunelle:


That's really fast to 60 mph compared to my (standard transmission) Fiero, which does it in about 7 seconds. The two gearchanges take a bunch of time, as well as respooling the turbo after the gearchanges.

In MS2/Extra, there is a option you can select to inject on alternate cranking events, so the same fuel is delivered to the engine, but using half the number of squirts. The injectors therefore work at greater pulse widths.

Also, there is some "injector quality" parameter that I can't pinpoint. When I had 30 lb/hr Accel injectors, I had a very hard time finding the line between flooding the engine and underfueling the engine during cranking. With the Bosch 42 lb/hr injectors I have now, there was a wide enough range of pulse widths that worked. I settled on a cranking pulse width centered in the range of workable values.

Yes, I committed the mistake you speak of. I initially undersized my fuel system



Not falling out of boost is one of several merits of an auto; it could probably use a different converter though. I think an extra 500-1000rpm of stall would work wonders.

I'll definitely give the alternate squirts a try. I've got it pretty liveable right now, but a hot restart on the wrong day still gives me trouble on occasion.

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Report this Post09-22-2020 02:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hyperv6Send a Private Message to hyperv6Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Thunderstruck GT:

There once was a guy I knew by the name of Fran Passsute (sp?). Fran was the original owner of an Indy Pace Car that he customized with a ton of firsts. Fran was the first to convert a notchback into a fastback, the first to use 16" wheels, the first to do an engine swap (2.8L-V6) and the first to install a turbo on a 2.8L in a Fiero.

It was a highly publicized vehicle with articles in just about every car magazine. I'm sure people here remember the car as there was ever only one like it.

Sadly, I have not seen Fran in several years and his beloved IPC seems to have disappeared off the face of the earth. But I can tell you that Fran never had an issue with that turbocharged 2.8L-V6 and loved spanking Mustang GT's and Corvettes.


Frans car was the standard Miller Wood set up as I recalled. It was great car. But the miller woods set up also was hard on the engine and often they saw issues after 80,000 miles back in the day.

Fran Passuite is still around as I see photos he has taken of sports events. He was an even better photographer than Fiero builder.

I know he is getting older and may not be getting out like he used to with the car as they used to travel a lot.

https://manualzz.com/doc/32...nd-fiero-association

[This message has been edited by hyperv6 (edited 09-22-2020).]

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Report this Post09-22-2020 05:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Thunderstruck GTSend a Private Message to Thunderstruck GTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by hyperv6:


Frans car was the standard Miller Wood set up as I recalled. It was great car. But the miller woods set up also was hard on the engine and often they saw issues after 80,000 miles back in the day.

Fran Passuite is still around as I see photos he has taken of sports events. He was an even better photographer than Fiero builder.

I know he is getting older and may not be getting out like he used to with the car as they used to travel a lot.

https://manualzz.com/doc/32...nd-fiero-association



Yes, Fran took a lot of photos for the Buffalo Bills football team. I wonder if he still lives out by me?

I am fairly certain that I was the first one that coaxed him into entering his Fiero in his first car show where I believe he won best of show or dealer's choice award.

He showed up to an All Pontiac show as a spectator and left his Fiero in the parking lot. I told him he needed to enter it in the show. He said it wasn't a show car. I told him "bull" and that he needed to enter it. The rest was history.

Fran's a good guy with very interesting stories about him with that Fiero.

[This message has been edited by Thunderstruck GT (edited 09-22-2020).]

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Report this Post09-22-2020 07:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hyperv6Send a Private Message to hyperv6Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Thunderstruck GT:


Yes, Fran took a lot of photos for the Buffalo Bills football team. I wonder if he still lives out by me?

I am fairly certain that I was the first one that coaxed him into entering his Fiero in his first car show where I believe he won best of show or dealer's choice award.

He showed up to an All Pontiac show as a spectator and left his Fiero in the parking lot. I told him he needed to enter it in the show. He said it wasn't a show car. I told him "bull" and that he needed to enter it. The rest was history.

Fran's a good guy with very interesting stories about him with that Fiero.



We use to see each other yearly at shows but I am not traveling as far nor I assume he.

I always wanted to see his photos of Watkins Glen F1. Races from the 60’s and 70’s.

He hand his wife were a lot of fun.

We use to see each other at shows in Ohio, Michigan and Indianapolis. I am running 35 year old hoses and no trailer so I don’t venture out as far as I once did. I have new hoses but my car is a survivor with under 50k miles so I hate to change anything till I need to. My engine is original accept for the plugs.

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Report this Post09-22-2020 07:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by hyperv6:

My past experience of watching people try to turbo a 2.8 have been interesting.

The engine is known to have a shorter life due to bearing issues under boost.


There may be a remedy there, but these days of massive engine choice options maybe it's not even worth modding the 2.8. Although there is the 3.4 option so maybe there is a benefit here. Anyway the thought I had was you're probably talking about the crank bearings. The 428 and 455 crank bearings have a problem with oil starvation (correct term?) in that the angular speed is higher than ideal on the 2.25" (from memory) journal size and he smaller 400 crank bearing is better. Some people make a groove on the 428/455 exiting the oil delivery hole to increase the volume of oil delivered to the bearing surface. Just a thought in the situation of having poorer oiling properties.
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Report this Post09-22-2020 07:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Thunderstruck GTSend a Private Message to Thunderstruck GTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by hyperv6:


We use to see each other yearly at shows but I am not traveling as far nor I assume he.

I always wanted to see his photos of Watkins Glen F1. Races from the 60’s and 70’s.

He hand his wife were a lot of fun.

We use to see each other at shows in Ohio, Michigan and Indianapolis. I am running 35 year old hoses and no trailer so I don’t venture out as far as I once did. I have new hoses but my car is a survivor with under 50k miles so I hate to change anything till I need to. My engine is original accept for the plugs.


A bunch of us (Fran included) went to Adrian, MI for one of Harold Hooten's shows. Fran was a riot at dinner.

There is a huge car show every year (except this one) over here that is only a few miles from Fran's house and I haven't seen him there in years. I sure hope he is okay and still has the car. After all, that car was like his left nut to him.
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Report this Post09-23-2020 06:46 AM Click Here to See the Profile for hyperv6Send a Private Message to hyperv6Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Thunderstruck GT:


A bunch of us (Fran included) went to Adrian, MI for one of Harold Hooten's shows. Fran was a riot at dinner.

There is a huge car show every year (except this one) over here that is only a few miles from Fran's house and I haven't seen him there in years. I sure hope he is okay and still has the car. After all, that car was like his left nut to him.


I may have been there. I went one year and Fran and I were in the same class. It was at the Pontiac dealer. I think it was the first time we met.

He appears to be taking photos of girls softball for a paper so he must still be well. He must be near 80 years old. Sorry Fran if I am too old on my est.
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Report this Post09-23-2020 06:58 AM Click Here to See the Profile for hyperv6Send a Private Message to hyperv6Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by sourmash:


There may be a remedy there, but these days of massive engine choice options maybe it's not even worth modding the 2.8. Although there is the 3.4 option so maybe there is a benefit here. Anyway the thought I had was you're probably talking about the crank bearings. The 428 and 455 crank bearings have a problem with oil starvation (correct term?) in that the angular speed is higher than ideal on the 2.25" (from memory) journal size and he smaller 400 crank bearing is better. Some people make a groove on the 428/455 exiting the oil delivery hole to increase the volume of oil delivered to the bearing surface. Just a thought in the situation of having poorer oiling properties.


We raced 428’s and to fix the oil you just put the heavy spring in the oil pump. My buddies father was from the old Tin Indian Knafel Pontiac dealer. It was an old Arlen Vanke trick. We just had to watch in cold weather start up you could blow a filter off..

The problem with the 2.8 is it was never designed for a lot of power. They did have some racing parts back in the day but they are rare to non existent today and way too expensive if you find them.

Broken cranks and head gasket issues along with heat issues in the Fiero were the prime issues. Also turbo engines back then were nothing like today. Low boost small gains, lag and bearing issues in the turbo itself.

It is just best to start with a modern engine built to be turbocharged from the start. Cheaper and less painful in the long run. Just my take on it.

My buddy had a GLHS Shelby that ran 11’s. When it was not broken. I also worked with another with a similar set up and again most of the time broke. Both knew what they were doing but the lack of good parts w as a problem.
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sourmash
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Report this Post09-23-2020 07:49 AM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
So the addendum to the discussion on the 2.8 would be the 3.4 since it's basically the drop-in same/physical layout. I'm assuming there were no oiling improvements made for the 3.4 and none of the issues were addressed for the larger engine?

The spring in the oil pump was definitely prior to what a couple of today's engine builders were doing with the oil hole/grooving to feed the bearings. Ken something (Kaufman?) the Pontiac builder in Florida was doing this mod last I followed him 10 years ago. There are still a couple of 428/455s around here so I was interested in what he was doing. He also recommended hard block filler up to the freeze plugs not only for strength but to increase coolant velocity.

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Report this Post09-23-2020 08:54 AM Click Here to See the Profile for pmbrunelleClick Here to Email pmbrunelleSend a Private Message to pmbrunelleEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
If I had a clean-sheet project, I probably wouldn't choose a 2.8 Fiero engine to begin with.

However, considering that the 2.8 come stock in the Fiero, with sensors, wiring, mounts, coolant lines, fuel lines, throttle cable, vacuum lines for evap, compatibility with the stock transmission, accessory drive on the front end, it's a big time-saver to have those items already completed... and not only completed, but with a large supply of spare parts available from stock Fieros for future needs.

My 3-year 2.8 rebuild/soup-up project would have turned into 4 had I also done an engine swap!

[This message has been edited by pmbrunelle (edited 09-23-2020).]

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Thunderstruck GT
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Report this Post09-23-2020 08:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Thunderstruck GTSend a Private Message to Thunderstruck GTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by hyperv6:


I may have been there. I went one year and Fran and I were in the same class. It was at the Pontiac dealer. I think it was the first time we met.

He appears to be taking photos of girls softball for a paper so he must still be well. He must be near 80 years old. Sorry Fran if I am too old on my est.


The show was at Cliff Pontiac. Hoot had his own "Fiero Nationals" as part of an all Pontiac show. I didn't take my Fiero at the time, I took my '87 Formula Firebird.

Good to hear Fran is still out there. I will have to dig through some old paperwork and newsletters and see if I can find his contact info. Be nice to touch base with him again.

[This message has been edited by Thunderstruck GT (edited 09-23-2020).]

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Honest Don
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Report this Post09-23-2020 12:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Honest DonSend a Private Message to Honest DonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by pmbrunelle:

If I had a clean-sheet project, I probably wouldn't choose a 2.8 Fiero engine to begin with.

However, considering that the 2.8 come stock in the Fiero, with sensors, wiring, mounts, coolant lines, fuel lines, throttle cable, vacuum lines for evap, compatibility with the stock transmission, accessory drive on the front end, it's a big time-saver to have those items already completed... and not only completed, but with a large supply of spare parts available from stock Fieros for future needs.

My 3-year 2.8 rebuild/soup-up project would have turned into 4 had I also done an engine swap!




And that’s the thing, the 2.8 is already there. In a turbo build, most of the high effort stuff is external to the engine *and* can move on over to the next one if and when things go wrong. Maybe some additional cutting/welding/splicing involved, but you’d be doing that anyway.

Not to mention that tuning is a learning curve and mistakes can be unforgiving. I’d rather burn up a stocker and get educated before getting aggressive with something I have real money in.

[This message has been edited by Honest Don (edited 09-23-2020).]

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Report this Post09-23-2020 01:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Honest DonSend a Private Message to Honest DonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have a suspicion that at least some of the 2.8 oiling problems begin with timing chain particulate extrude-honing the aluminum pump case. It’s potentially telling that later 660 examples went to an iron pump.

[This message has been edited by Honest Don (edited 09-23-2020).]

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hyperv6
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Report this Post09-23-2020 05:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hyperv6Send a Private Message to hyperv6Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Thunderstruck GT:


The show was at Cliff Pontiac. Hoot had his own "Fiero Nationals" as part of an all Pontiac show. I didn't take my Fiero at the time, I took my '87 Formula Firebird.

Good to hear Fran is still out there. I will have to dig through some old paperwork and newsletters and see if I can find his contact info. Be nice to touch base with him again.



That was the place. I still have the trophy someplace.

Adrian is an odd place way out in the middle of no where but I ended Up there twice in the Fiero.

Once for the Cliff show and once coming home from the FOCOA Fiero nationals I went to the NASCR race on the way home.
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Report this Post09-23-2020 08:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for sourmashClick Here to Email sourmashSend a Private Message to sourmashEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Honest Don:

I have a suspicion that at least some of the 2.8 oiling problems begin with timing chain particulate extrude-honing the aluminum pump case. It’s potentially telling that later 660 examples went to an iron pump.



Not familiar with the 660 reference. Is it a casting number?
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G-Man
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Report this Post09-23-2020 09:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for G-ManSend a Private Message to G-ManEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
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Not familiar with the 660 reference. Is it a casting number?


It's a reference to the v6 - 60 degree design of the 2.8 and similar engines.

Gary

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Report this Post09-26-2020 08:13 AM Click Here to See the Profile for hnthompsClick Here to Email hnthompsSend a Private Message to hnthompsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jjd2296:

do you have an inter-cooler set up? and is this a 2.8 or 3.4 block?





It is a 3.4 push rod block acquired directly from GM and does not have an intercooler. I added an intercooler to my 3800 SC Series III setup and am quite pleased. If I did the 3.4 L turbo again, it is likely that I would also add some sort of an intercooler.

Nelso
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