quote Originally posted by TK: https://support.google.com/adsense/answer/1348688 I think this is their content rules. Not a chance of OT meeting the standard.

According to that policy, uploading a pic of your wrecked Fiero, may be a violation.

quote Originally posted by TK: https://support.google.com/adsense/answer/1348688 I think this is their content rules. Not a chance of OT meeting the standard.

I agree, including the 'copyright' part. Nor the bullying part, or the offensive image/text part, but (for now anyway) they are using the images as a basis for their decision.

[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 04-22-2016).]

Once or twice, I posted a picture of Dawn Wells, Gilligan's Mary Ann eating a popsicle. It is a wonderful picture but could be considered a violation. The problem is, I don't remember the thread(s) in which I posted. I will continue to search, but if someone else remembers, please let me know and I will delete the pic.

quote Originally posted by maryjane: Cliff, The following archived thread would probably fit the criteria for total deletion. //www.fiero.nl/forum/A...110502-6-067934.html

I Agree

Advanced Google search (fiero.nl) for
common words associate with child preditors returns 1 link
to a single thread.

Pennock's Fiero Forum - Well, i feel that this needs to get out .
(PFF doesn't like havily encoded links - you'd have to copy and past)
Thread deleted : Link removed

The link is to the same thread identified by maryjane
//www.fiero.nl/forum/A...110502-6-067934.html

However a PFF search using the same words returns
Bill Clinton and the PALM BEACH P* :
likely not a true violation but then again that depends on how google profiles content.

Child :
2 pages of links :

Kid :
20 pages of links :

I am certain that the content of PFF is of no use to
preditors. However, if google is merely weighing
words, phrases and images, it would not be hard to
to reach a judgement without proper context. I can
not imagine such content getting past PFF members.
There are keywords that if use will quickly get met by
Rolled up sleeves, raised eyebrows and a thorough
expulsion system. When a member uses language
that is obviously unacceptable, it does take long for this
community to disassociate them from PFF. Even when
they return under a new ID, they either come back with
changed behavior or quickly start picking out another
new name.

[This message has been edited by jmclemore (edited 04-23-2016).]

jmclemore:
Posting links with some of the taboo words in them is not helpful to the current problem. Bots will key right on to that word.

[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 04-22-2016).]

Another vote to remove O/T. This place was becoming an O/T forum with a Fiero section.

I vote we get rid of OT as well. There are plenty of other places on the web for people to do whatever it is goes on in there. I think that would help a lot towards cleaning up the content. This forum is worth a great deal to me, I would be happy to make a donation as well. Thanks Cliff, I'm sorry we are such a pain in the butt!

quote Originally posted by maryjane: jmclemore: Posting links with some of the taboo words in them is not helpful to the current problem. Bots will key right on to that word.

I see your point....
Those links are search terms used in the PFF search page.
those words show up in all those threads. I'll will edit out the links
in my post. But likewise, the words existing in numerous threads
are more harmful than it's usage in this post.


Added
BTW the only word I needed to remove is used in the title of the topic
of that thread. There were no other taboo words used in my post.

[This message has been edited by jmclemore (edited 04-22-2016).]

quote Originally posted by MidEngineManiac: Not a chance in HELL of me ever meeting that standard....I think I have just about everything besides the drugs covered.

It is about as convoluted as the Federal Tax Code. Assuming Cliff can get back in their good graces, he might want to consider some moderators to stop threads and content before they go too far. I wonder if their list would be shorter if they told us what we could talk about. I don't get if we can't discuss a topic or advertise for some restricted topic.

But free speech will suffer. But if you think back ...

[This message has been edited by TK (edited 04-22-2016).]

quote Originally posted by TK: It is about as convoluted as the Federal Tax Code. Assuming Cliff can get back in their good graces, he might want to consider some moderators to stop threads and content before they go to far. I wonder if their list would be shorter if they told us what we could talk about. I don't get if we can't discuss a topic or advertise for some restricted topic. But free speech will suffer. But if you think back ...

just wait and see how much cliff had to remove to satisfy google.
I am hoping that it is small insignificant amount of content. If so,
the forum is fine and members already do a great job of weeding out
such content and it's contributors.

I would warn against suggestions to remove OT as it does manage to
keep such conversations out of the other, topic based, forums. It also
allows members to be more than just a fiero owner. But, if the issue is
advertising revenue to support the forums operation, Suggesting that
member take their conversation elsewhere is literally tell them to go
generate ad revenue for another site/forum. In this case, it appears that
it would affect Cliff.

quote Not only do they pay the bills for Pennock's Fiero Forum, they actually put some food in the mouths of my family.

Bought ya a beer. It's high time I pitch in around here. I hope it helps, I think the google thing is a personal rights violation but I guess it's the world we live in now.....

The funny pictures thread in off topic has some mildly offensive images.
I apologize if already been said. I haven't read all the replies.

I just noticed the thread about the 12 year old girl is still active and its had a ton of views. Maybe this is what the spy eye found?

I'm new, but count me in as a supporter of nuking the off topic - I'd fully support getting rid of it completely, but I think a periodic purge is fair too. I own lots of cars and am on lots of forums and I don't know many that have such a, um, colorful OT section or one that goes back forever.

For those uncertain about Google's request, understand Google is not censoring content. You can post whatever you'd like on the internet as far as Google is concerned and they will happily include it in search results. However, they will not advertise with you if your site contains certain content. That's what's at stake here. You don't see a lot of ads for Disneyland in Hustler or Guns & Ammo, and that's the advertisers right to choose their medium. Google doesn't advertise on sites that have objectionable content. That's completely fair.

That said, there are less particular advertising brokers - while I fully support scrubbing the OT, if it's desirable to keep it perhaps looking at another broker would be a good approach.

Another vote here for getting rid of the Off Topic area, if that is where the problems lie.

I'm willing to bet that O/T generates more page views than the other sections combined, and thus most of Cliff's revenue from Google ad clicks. Eliminating it would pretty much kill ad revenue, as would making it member-only.

The Google image search "site:fiero.nl girl" reveals a few that might be considered 'iffy' - mostly in the Girls Without Fieros thread. If Google is going to be fussy about pc speech, then there would have to be a ban on conversation of any political topics, guns, global warming, etc.

I sent a donation to help out, since I run AdBlock anyway and realized I may have been freeloading this whole time.

quote Originally posted by edfiero: Another vote here for getting rid of the Off Topic area, if that is where the problems lie.

But OT is all some people have and I mean that literally. If they weren't the cause it would seem wrong to punish them.

quote Originally posted by TK: But OT is all some people have and I mean that literally. If they weren't the cause it would seem wrong to punish them.

It's part of the ad revenue, get rid of OT, get rid of revenue.

quote Originally posted by jmbishop: It's part of the ad revenue, get rid of OT, get rid of revenue.

I never considered that, good point.
Since my Fiero is essentially done, I spend my time in OT. There are some great people there and some miserable SOB's, but that's what makes the world go around even if it is a bit off balance. It gets a weird vibration around 45-50 mph. (the world, not my Fiero)

If you get rid of OT expect GFC to explode with off topic posts.
Happened before and it will continue.

I am not suggesting we get rid of OT just delete all of the current content and make threads expire and delete themselves.
Or just make it registered users only.

Problem is even if the old treads are gone how long will google cache the old content?

Just disable pictures in OT. Problem solved.

[This message has been edited by Jake_Dragon (edited 04-22-2016).]

Even though I no longer post in O/T (as I got SO tired of being subjected to the endless political bickering), I wouldn't want to see that section of the forum eliminated. Creating O/T was a good idea as it helps to keep most of the non-tech discussion out of the tech threads. I don't think many of the non-original members realize that there was no O/T when PFF first started.

O/T was fun for quite awhile before it got almost completely taken over by political zealots. Kind of a shame actually. I'd like to see O/T cleaned up, but then I'd also like to see cancer eradicated.

I agree that the Google parameters rules are all offended in OT .....

[This message has been edited by Danyel (edited 04-22-2016).]

quote Originally posted by williegoat:

Off topic... When I get my car repainted, I was planning on changing from the "bright red" to "Medium Red Metallic", but wow that color can look good when it is clean.

I never go in O/T and wouldn't mind seeing it deleted.

I also wouldn't mind a LITTLE O/T discussion with respect to cars in GFC. You know Corvette, Solstice and Camaro. Any political thread can be deleted in my opinion.

quote Originally posted by jscott1: I also wouldn't mind a LITTLE O/T discussion with respect to cars in GFC. You know Corvette, Solstice and Camaro.

There's a whole section of the forum already dedicated to that... Other Cars

Nuke OT and people will just post in the other sections.

I also think a "reset" of OT is in order. It would be quicker and easier than playing the "hunt down threads and hope Google approves the forum this time" game.

I bet the guys at RFT are jizzing all over themselves about this.

Or... create a separate O/T sub-section. Politics (or whatever you choose.) Make it "members only". Then police O/T strictly. Posts that deviate from "G rated" - for whatever reason - get moved there, before anyone can blink.

That should satisfy most of the folks who want O/T gone due to "adult" content or political reasons.

You might even specify one or two mods to take care of just that task. (An unpopular choice, I'm sure. But maybe worth a look.)

quote Originally posted by Raydar: Or... create a separate O/T sub-section. Politics (or whatever you choose.) Make it "members only". Then police O/T strictly. Posts that deviate from "G rated" - for whatever reason - get moved there, before anyone can blink. That should satisfy most of the folks who want O/T gone due to "adult" content or political reasons. You might even specify one or two mods to take care of just that task. (An unpopular choice, I'm sure. But maybe worth a look.)

What would you do if the moderator gets banned by a thread full of resentful members.....

Cliff if you are reading this please check your PM's.
If I may also add a suggestion; add a check box on each post at the bottom right hand corner that says "report this post" and have it directed to your email or inbox.

[This message has been edited by Dennis LaGrua (edited 04-22-2016).]

quote Originally posted by Blacktree: I also think a "reset" of OT is in order. It would be quicker and easier than playing the "hunt down threads and hope Google approves the forum this time" game. I bet the guys at RFT are jizzing all over themselves about this.

I agree that a reset would be of no harm. What will be lost isn't worth keeping if it wrecks the forum.

quote Originally posted by TK: I agree that a reset would be of no harm.

What exactly is a "reset"? If that means deleting everything that was ever posted in O/T... Hell no!

Many of us have shared important personal events of our lives in O/T... births, deaths, relationships, pets, jobs, misfortunes, holidays, music, photographs, laughter, sorrow, etc. I've often searched through the archives to find posts (my own as well as other member's) from years ago.

Yes, a lot of useless political nonsense has been posted (and I despise it), but there's no need (hopefully) to throw out the baby with the bath water.

It would be an absolute shame to lose over 16 years worth of irreplaceable PFF member history.

Someone will be along later to make new OT history of their own Patrick. Truth is, the world will little care nor long remember we were even there.
(You're just worried an OT mass extinction event will make sumpthin bad happen to your toadfrog)

quote Originally posted by maryjane: Someone will be along later to make new OT history of their own Patrick.

Since I'm no longer posting in O/T, the new yet-to-be-created history isn't nearly as relevant to me.

quote Originally posted by maryjane: Truth is, the world will little care nor long remember we were even there.

True, which is why IMO it's worthwhile trying to retain the history we have... at least while someone's still around who's the least bit interested.

quote Originally posted by maryjane: You're just worried an OT mass extinction event will make sumpthin bad happen to your toadfrog.

Okay Don, you nailed it.

By the way, I stumbled across this fine specimen last week while walking the hound. Isn't he beautiful...

quote Originally posted by TK: https://support.google.com/adsense/answer/1348688 I think this is their content rules. Not a chance of OT meeting the standard.

Many Other Forums often Do Not allow most things posted in PFF TOT.
Moderators deleted post(s) and warn once or twice then ban you. This stops allot of problems but needs more people to keep up.

Cliff,
I am sorry and will help what I can...
You told me that you created PFF because you hated moderators on other bbs/forums and never allowing sub moderators but this is part of your problem now.

Worse, Google can/will give more reasons when everyone helps to clean up "Adult Content." Some have guessed correctly many threads are "Full" of "Hate Speech."

Removing TOT and its archive maybe the only way to restore ads.
At minimum removes all Politics and Religion threads, marks as such or not to reduce number of threads to clean.

Remove Trash Can, Girls with and without Fiero too.
likely need to keep a local copy so you can remove PIP posted pictures too.

------------------
Dr. Ian Malcolm: Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.
(Jurassic Park)

The Ogre's Fiero Cave

[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 04-23-2016).]

I'm against removing the T/OT section. There are a few of us who no longer own Fieros (I currently have one but it's for sale) who come here for the comeraterie camarodery kumerodary friendly faces. I'm fine with deleting the Trash Can completely. If you feel a thread is getting out of hand, just delete it. I think most of us who have been here a while trust your judgement 100%.

I also agree with Mr. Ogre about deleting the Girls with/without Fieros threads. As much as I like looking at cute chicks, I can think of a more than a few pics in those threads that probably make Giggle Google jump. I'm also in sync with Ogre about involving others as sub-moderators. Pick one or 2 that can watch T/OT.

In the mean time, I'll buy ya a beer.

[This message has been edited by Monkeyman (edited 04-23-2016).]

It is extremely rare that I go to OT and I don't think I have ever been in the Trashcan (I don't see the point) but I am worried about our forum and willing to do whatever I can to help. I do buy a six pack for Cliff once or twice a year. I get a lot of good advice and ideas here. I'm sorry this is happening. I can't imagine trying to survive with just the fluff on Fb.

Thanks again Cliff.

Dwayne

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