Corvettes totaled 185,806 units over the same time span during fieros production run with the low being 1988 sales at 22,789. Yet there is a large number of parts suppliers still producing resto and performance mods for the c4 corvette.
Corvettes don't have a reputation for catching on fire, and have been in production for over 60 years. They also had V8s, where a long standing performance parts market already existed.
There's not an abundance of performance parts for the 4 cylinder or V6 Camaros, S-10s, etc… either, which used the same engine platforms as the Fiero. Swap in a drivetrain which has such a performance parts market, and you'll see how much more is available.
Every Corvette owner I ever knew said he was going to maintain the car or sell it.
Lot's of Fiero owners put them out behind the barn or gave them to a relative.
With that said, notice how close the prices are between 88 corvettes and 88 Fieros.
exactly. I've only seen 1 84-88 corvette I'd buy. The guy was parts Mgr for the largest gm parts warehouse in 12 states. I did invetory there for their irs audit just because I'm a parts junkie every year. There were parts on the list for fiero with the part listed for 0.00. But the corvette he had was the best of every thing. Gm performance ram jet small block. Cowl hood, everything was brand new and he was asking $10000 for it.
Corvettes don't have a reputation for catching on fire, and have been in production for over 60 years. They also had V8s, where a long standing performance parts market already existed.
There's not an abundance of performance parts for the 4 cylinder or V6 Camaros, S-10s, etc… either, which used the same engine platforms as the Fiero. Swap in a drivetrain which has such a performance parts market, and you'll see how much more is available.
There's more to a car than the engine. I'm talking legitimate suspension upgrades, brakes, exhaust that don't require rube goldberg standards that seem to be the norm.
Originally posted by Silvertown: There's more to a car than the engine. I'm talking legitimate suspension upgrades, brakes, exhaust that don't require rube goldberg standards that seem to be the norm.
When manufacturers make parts for some car, and then they don't make any money for 10 years because nobody buys them, then they stop making those parts. The suspension on the 88 is also different from the 84-87 cars, so then anything made for an 88 only limits your market to less than 10% of the Fiero market, which was already small.
There are some vendors that are selling suspension parts, but no, it's not like a Corvette where you have lots of different options to build out the suspension. The fact is though, most manufacturers aren't going to make products for a market where they will lose money.
When manufacturers make parts for some car, and then they don't make any money for 10 years because nobody buys them, then they stop making those parts. The suspension on the 88 is also different from the 84-87 cars, so then anything made for an 88 only limits your market to less than 10% of the Fiero market, which was already small.
There are some vendors that are selling suspension parts, but no, it's not like a Corvette where you have lots of different options to build out the suspension. The fact is though, most manufacturers aren't going to make products for a market where they will lose money.
The original auto maker has to supply parts for 10 years by law.
Originally posted by Silvertown: Just a fact I wanted to make clear. Or are facts bad.
Facts are fine, but irrelevant ones are still irrelevant. Both the Fiero and the C4 Corvette are well beyond the time limit of any law requiring OEMs to provide replacement parts for maintenance.
You were whining about no performance parts being available for the Fiero, now you're bringing up something about stock parts, which is totally unrelated to anything older than 10 years. Are you complaining about the lack of stock parts, or performance parts? Both? What?
Facts are fine, but irrelevant ones are still irrelevant. Both the Fiero and the C4 Corvette are well beyond the time limit of any law requiring OEMs to provide replacement parts for maintenance.
You were whining about no performance parts being available for the Fiero, now you're bringing up something about stock parts, which is totally unrelated to anything older than 10 years. Are you complaining about the lack of stock parts, or performance parts? Both? What?
Seriously don't you have an old pontiac motor you could be working on. The op says resto which gm still authorizes on parts. Resto as in o-r-i-g-i-n-a-l.
Margins are higher on Corvettes. As Mr. Wonderful says on Shark Tank, "It's all about the money".
You gotta love that guy. And your right it's all about the money. But to get that money you gotta have a plan. If you can sell mrw your a damn good salesmen. But you still gotta have a plan.
Corvette owners generally have a higher willingness to spend money on their cars, whereas the Fiero market tends to be dominated by guys trying to spend as little as possible. Like was previously said-- it's all about the money. We'd have a lot bigger aftermarket support for the Fiero if guys were more willing to open the wallet to pay for it.
Corvette owners generally have a higher willingness to spend money on their cars, whereas the Fiero market tends to be dominated by guys trying to spend as little as possible. Like was previously said-- it's all about the money. We'd have a lot bigger aftermarket support for the Fiero if guys were more willing to open the wallet to pay for it.
Originally posted by Silvertown: Seriously don't you have an old pontiac motor you could be working on. The op says resto which gm still authorizes on parts. Resto as in o-r-i-g-i-n-a-l.
Seriously, don't you have some new thread to start about some new thing you're going to offer for sale to save us from the dearth of parts. The Fiero Store makes plenty of reproduction parts, authorized by GM. If you don't like their offering then well, too bad I guess. The Fiero is an extremely small market. If manufacturers don't want to spend money on supporting that market, don't get your panties all in a twist and attack me. I'm just telling you why the parts aren't made.
It's a small market that very few people actually care about, and for which any chance of profit is incredibly small. The fact that The Fiero Store and Rodney Dickman even exist and are getting reproduction stock replacement parts made by any manufacturer is already a small miracle.
Yep. Ive never seen a Corvette owner that didnt WANT to spend $4000 on a paintjob. A majority of Fiero owners want to use a roller or spray can for their paint job.
Seriously, don't you have some new thread to start about some new thing you're going to offer for sale to save us from the dearth of parts. The Fiero Store makes plenty of reproduction parts, authorized by GM. If you don't like their offering then well, too bad I guess. The Fiero is an extremely small market. If manufacturers don't want to spend money on supporting that market, don't get your panties all in a twist and attack me. I'm just telling you why the parts aren't made.
It's a small market that very few people actually care about, and for which any chance of profit is incredibly small. The fact that The Fiero Store and Rodney Dickman even exist and are getting reproduction stock replacement parts made by any manufacturer is already a small miracle.
Fiero store has some nice stuff. But my question is it truly oem. I need a sail panel but I'm not going to put something on that isn't correct or better. I would prefer a glass sail panel. Guess I'm going to have to make that too with your permission of couse.
Yep. Ive never seen a Corvette owner that didnt WANT to spend $4000 on a paintjob. A majority of Fiero owners want to use a roller or spray can for their paint job.
If you go to downtown detroit you will see some of the most incredible spray can art. And they do it for free. Of couse vandalism is the reason why. But hey they can practice their art on my car anytime.
Originally posted by Silvertown: Fiero store has some nice stuff. But my question is it truly oem. I need a sail panel but I'm not going to put something on that isn't correct or better. I would prefer a glass sail panel. Guess I'm going to have to make that too with your permission of couse.
When GM sold off various tooling, they didn't sell it all to one person. I'm not sure where the OE sail panel tooling resides these days, but The Fiero Store doesn't have it. I'm not sure if pokeyfiero had them, but he was at one point attempting to make some OE quality sail panels, if I recall correctly.
That said, The Fiero Store has acquired and licensed some of the tooling for some pieces, from GM, and they were making reproductions with that tooling. They also had a lot of NOS parts at one point, but I'm not sure what their stock is like these days.
And I don't care what you do or don't make. So don't be a jerk.
When GM sold off various tooling, they didn't sell it all to one person. I'm not sure where the OE sail panel tooling resides these days, but The Fiero Store doesn't have it. I'm not sure if pokeyfiero had them, but he was at one point attempting to make some OE quality sail panels, if I recall correctly.
That said, The Fiero Store has acquired and licensed some of the tooling for some pieces, from GM, and they were making reproductions with that tooling. They also had a lot of NOS parts at one point, but I'm not sure what their stock is like these days.
And I don't care what you do or don't make. So don't be a jerk.
OK, I'll be the pot calling the kettle black. Silvertown, dobey, you guys done?
Dobey is knowledgeable about a lot of car stuff. Silvertown, I can't recommend bucking the established members, regardless of who is right or wrong. I just read another thread like this, and I think it was you two there, also.
OK, I'll be the pot calling the kettle black. Silvertown, dobey, you guys done?
Dobey is knowledgeable about a lot of car stuff. Silvertown, I can't recommend bucking the established members, regardless of who is right or wrong. I just read another thread like this, and I think it was you two there, also.
Yeah I think we hashed it out. I may not know a lot about fieros but I've been around auto manufacturing long enough to not be a noob or a Corvette dork.
The 80's was not a good decade for performance. The EPA stranglehold on emissions gave way to a host of de-tuned engines during this time period. The Corvettes made during this time period were under-performing cars, still nice for a 2 seater but many owners were disappointed in the throttle response and power. They also don't have the best reputation for any kind of fuel economy. This is all reflected in the resale prices. It is common to see Corvettes in the late 80's selling in the $4.000-$7,000 range. A few Fiero owners have been asking a lot more for their cars. They may be nice but is it realistic and have they sold? A Pontiac Fiero is a fun vehicle that enjoys a reputation as a low value commuter car that is not worth much. With all the suspension and powertrain enhancements, I love driving mine but at the end of the day, its still a Fiero; the poor mans performance car.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
Corvettes totaled 185,806 units over the same time span during fieros production run with the low being 1988 sales at 22,789. Yet there is a large number of parts suppliers still producing resto and performance mods for the c4 corvette.
Besides what Dobey said, here is another fact. "The Chevrolet Corvette (C4) is a sports car that was produced by Chevrolet for the 1984 through 1996 model years."
I think if the 88 Fiero was sold through 1996 it would also be a contributing factor to more current parts suppliers.
Prince wrote a song about the Corvette, Haul & Oats performed one about the Fiero.
The Prince song came out in 1983, the only year since 1953 where no Corvettes were available new. Also, that song was about having sex, not about cars.
Silvertown, glass sail panels were only used in 1984. Look for a double border molding around the triangle area. Later years were polycarbonate and had no double border molding.
It comes down to the money... nothing more. Would someone pay $1000 for sail panels? Very few. So... if you are manufacturing these, you would lose money. People with corvettes spend money, no doubt about it. Fiero owners, very few.
There is nothing to stop someone from making official reproduction parts. I am sure GM would be happy to license them. BUT.... if you can't sell them....
As a Corvette owner (C5) I can tell you that ultimately it all comes to what was said a ways above; willingness to spend money. There's always going to be a very large market for Corvette parts, both GM resto and aftermarket. While you have pointed out a production era of the Corvette that may at the moment be the absolute least desirable, it's not always going to be that way. As well, an 1984 C4 is not that far different from a 1996 C4 other than advances made in options and equipment. It would make sense that parts and upgrades made for later C4s would see a market for very early C4s.
If you haven't owned a Corvette or been a part of the Corvette buying community it's one of the most loyal markets I think I have ever seen; almost to the point of ridiculousness. I came across a discussion recently where the topic was horn replacement, and while the horn replacement in question crossed to various GM models forum members were adamant about purchasing the "Corvette parts" even with said part being subjected to the all infamous "Corvette tax" and selling at a higher price. It is really insane the amount of money some owners spend on their Corvettes outside of it's purchase price.
Production numbers also don't mean a whole lot. For every one nice, driveable Fiero on the road, there are ten torn down in someone's shop "in restoration" mine included, and of those 10, I bet may 2 ever see the road again. Moving down from there, for every 1 Fiero on the road there are another 100 in junk yards or rotting on someone's property, never to see the road again. I'm pulling these numbers out of my ass, but I'd bet there are less than 10% of Fieros produced that are still driveable.
It comes down to the money... nothing more. Would someone pay $1000 for sail panels? Very few. So... if you are manufacturing these, you would lose money. People with corvettes spend money, no doubt about it. Fiero owners, very few.
There is nothing to stop someone from making official reproduction parts. I am sure GM would be happy to license them. BUT.... if you can't sell them....
If the sail panels were a high grade tempered glass I'd pay $1000. Harley riders spend more on their clothes in one day than the majority of fiero owners spend in one year on their fiero.
If the sail panels were a high grade tempered glass I'd pay $1000. Harley riders spend more on their clothes in one day than the majority of fiero owners spend in one year on their fiero.
I am talking restoration pieces, not modified. $500 a side for GT sail panels is not bad if they were the same as OEM. $200,000 investment to make it happen, but only sell maybe 50 a year.. and every year, that number will decrease. 10 years to break even, if lucky.
Want tail lights... same thing. Fieros are not Harleys or Corvettes, you will never see the aftermarket support. Plus, how many harley owners are there vs Fiero owners?
As a Corvette owner (C5) I can tell you that ultimately it all comes to what was said a ways above; willingness to spend money. There's always going to be a very large market for Corvette parts, both GM resto and aftermarket. While you have pointed out a production era of the Corvette that may at the moment be the absolute least desirable, it's not always going to be that way. As well, an 1984 C4 is not that far different from a 1996 C4 other than advances made in options and equipment. It would make sense that parts and upgrades made for later C4s would see a market for very early C4s.
If you haven't owned a Corvette or been a part of the Corvette buying community it's one of the most loyal markets I think I have ever seen; almost to the point of ridiculousness. I came across a discussion recently where the topic was horn replacement, and while the horn replacement in question crossed to various GM models forum members were adamant about purchasing the "Corvette parts" even with said part being subjected to the all infamous "Corvette tax" and selling at a higher price. It is really insane the amount of money some owners spend on their Corvettes outside of it's purchase price.
Having installed interiors on just about every gen corvette and don't get me wrong when I say this but corvette owners are loons when it comes to their car, but in my opinion they ain't got nothing on fiero owners.
