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Any other HVAC Control Panels? by GODFATHER
Started on: 12-06-2014 09:55 PM
Replies: 52 (2816 views)
Last post by: E.Furgal on 08-20-2016 10:58 AM
dobey
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Report this Post02-27-2016 09:52 AM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jscott1:
I would love to get away from the cable controlling the temperature control door and have an all electrical system. But to control a servo requires a PWM controller and my brain hurts just thinking about that. Learning how to program microcontrollers is on my to do list, but it's not something that is easy to me.


Unfortunately, I think you'll find that this will be required for anything beyond simply swinging the door completely to either end point. Even with just a simple 12VDC motor, you will need to know how long to apply voltage, in which direction, to be able to get to 50% blend or the various points in between. At that point, you are basically implementing PWM and a stepper control.

A stepper linear actuator would probably be the simplest to adapt, mechanically, to a Fiero's HVAC. There are plenty of very simple stepper motor control examples for Arduino floating around, and many of the starter kit options include a stepper motor example.
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jscott1
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Report this Post02-27-2016 06:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jscott1Send a Private Message to jscott1Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by dobey:


Unfortunately, I think you'll find that this will be required for anything beyond simply swinging the door completely to either end point. Even with just a simple 12VDC motor, you will need to know how long to apply voltage, in which direction, to be able to get to 50% blend or the various points in between. At that point, you are basically implementing PWM and a stepper control.

A stepper linear actuator would probably be the simplest to adapt, mechanically, to a Fiero's HVAC. There are plenty of very simple stepper motor control examples for Arduino floating around, and many of the starter kit options include a stepper motor example.


Exactly... but for a mechanical/aerospace engineer my brain hurts when I think about Arduino programming. The learning curve is steep. I guess like anything it's easy once you know how, but I need to get Arduinos for dummies and start from scratch. It's a lot of work for just to have an electrically controlled temperature control. Until then I'm stuck with the cable.
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Report this Post02-28-2016 03:51 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jmbishopClick Here to Email jmbishopSend a Private Message to jmbishopEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by dobey:

A stepper linear actuator would probably be the simplest to adapt, mechanically, to a Fiero's HVAC.


That's probably the best way to have more than enough torque and travel.
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Report this Post02-28-2016 02:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jscott1Send a Private Message to jscott1Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jmbishop:


That's probably the best way to have more than enough torque and travel.


I could replace the temperature control knob with a toggle switch that simply moves the temperature between hot and cold. That would not need any electronics. That way the human is the control... too hot then just hold it until you feel cool air. In general I hate those kind of controls, like having volume up and down instead of a knob. But they are definitely easier to implement.
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Report this Post02-28-2016 09:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jmbishopClick Here to Email jmbishopSend a Private Message to jmbishopEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
If you're replacing the knob then you could do it with the servo tester posted earlier and a RC servo. if you didn't have room for the whole board it would be easy to break out the pot and mount the board wherever you had room. One without the different test modes would be ideal but you could get away with it as long as the default mode is controlled by the knob.

[This message has been edited by jmbishop (edited 02-29-2016).]

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jscott1
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Report this Post03-03-2016 10:54 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jscott1Send a Private Message to jscott1Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Anyone have a clue which size servo is needed? I could buy a fish scale and pull on the cable but I imagine there is a lot of variation in cable stiffness out there. I don't want a wimpy servo but I don't want one that will break the cable either.
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ltlfrari
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Report this Post03-03-2016 11:23 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ltlfrariClick Here to visit ltlfrari's HomePageClick Here to Email ltlfrariSend a Private Message to ltlfrariEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
No idea on servo size but the cable is Bowden cable, it not only pulls but also pushes which is why it is so stiff.

You might want to look at servos used by robotics hobbyist rather than model makers. I suspect you can get them in higher torque ratings for robotics applications. Also they may well have metal gears rather than plastic ones that may strip if the door sticks.

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[This message has been edited by ltlfrari (edited 03-03-2016).]

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dobey
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Report this Post03-03-2016 12:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'd get rid of the cable entirely and attach the actuator directly to the lever at the box.
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jscott1
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Report this Post03-04-2016 10:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jscott1Send a Private Message to jscott1Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Yeah my initial search led to robotics sites. I'm sure there are lots of high torque motors. Mounting the actuator directly to the door is cleaner, but has drawbacks as well. It means you have to remove the dash, which on a stock dash is no big deal. But if you have a custom dash that you spent a great amount of time to get just right, you might not be so inclined to remove it for an HVAC panel swap. Also the actuator might interfere with a custom dash setup. I know I don't want to remove my dash just to do this. I would rather a upgrade where you can mount to the cable. I know it's stiff, but the question is how much force? It depends on the curve of the cable which depends on where you mount the actuator, which varies in a custom setup. So another reason why I'm hesitant to build a setup for anyone else's car.
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Report this Post03-14-2016 04:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jmbishopClick Here to Email jmbishopSend a Private Message to jmbishopEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post


So I've been playing with the arduino, This took no knowledge of code whatsoever(although i've been learning it) and the only reason I'm not controlling the servo with a pot is because I don't have one but it would take no coding as well. The arduino software comes with the code ready to send to the board as a demo. The servo shown is a 9g but it uses the same signal and power supply as the high torque metal geared servo I ordered.

I'm not really interested in retrofitting hvac panels but if anyone was interested and scared of arduino, I'd throw the parts together to make a servo, arduino and potentiometer actuate the cable and flash the necessary code.
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kovacp1
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Report this Post08-20-2016 12:02 AM Click Here to See the Profile for kovacp1Click Here to Email kovacp1Send a Private Message to kovacp1Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have a new riceburner unit and a perfect original Lamborghini HVAC controller

Let me know if you are interested
Thanks
pjkovach@comcast.net

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Peter Kovach

[This message has been edited by kovacp1 (edited 08-20-2016).]

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Report this Post08-20-2016 10:05 AM Click Here to See the Profile for dobie1Click Here to Email dobie1Send a Private Message to dobie1Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
JBishop.....
I would be interested in a couple HVAC units if you and your Dad develop a working unit for my 288 build projects.

[This message has been edited by dobie1 (edited 08-20-2016).]

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E.Furgal
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Report this Post08-20-2016 10:58 AM Click Here to See the Profile for E.FurgalSend a Private Message to E.FurgalEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
IIRC When we did a motor controlled flap door in a tiny brit car.. We used a cheap capstan motor out of boom boxes, a lever and 2 relays and a 2 way momentary switch.. and a digital temp display and sensor to tell what the mixing door was allowing out the vent. very basic but it worked and no cable as there was no room to run one without looping it, and that causes it's own issues.
mini switches did the limiting on travel as it got to the end the switch would break the circuit . the brackets were basic.. made out of tin.. most of the mini switches came from the same cassette deck out of a boombox..
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