Well my '87 GT has served me well, it's been an absolute beast, always ran and drove no matter what problem it had. It's now currently in perfect condition minus the cosmetics. If you think this post is leading to a sale, part out, or thinking I crashed it, you're wrong. It's my DD, not a single problem, and will never sell it But I want to get a second car now that I can afford some stuff. Everyone has been telling me to go get an E36 M3. They look awesome, and seem to fit in perfectly with the car scene around me with all that "stance." BUT... My first choice would be an '88 GT manual with a 3800 SC series 2. Don't want to do it to mine, because it's an auto ughh... SOOO... This is where my post is leading too... I have zero knowledge on how to do the swap. I have no friends with shops to do the work in. No one to fab up parts. Nothing. the most I can do is remove the engine in my driveway if I get a new Fiero. The ONLY way to get the swap done, would be to hire someone who I have no idea who they are, or drop my car off to a shop that would agree to do it if that's even possible. Also, I forgot to mention that the previous owner of my car, said he can give me an old motor that has laying around (yes its running and works good) so that's a plus. NOW... This whole post leads up to my question... Is it even worth doing if I have to pay the most likely extreme labor fees for this? And hope that they don't take a year to complete it?
Here's another take. You already have a running, driving car. Keep it that way for a while. 3800 swaps are very popular and therefore swap kits are readily available. Look in "the mall" and find yourself 3800 mounts. There are several vendors that make nice mounts. You'll need the engine mount and both transmission mounts. Specify manual or automatic when ordering. Now, you have the car intact, and you just bought the three mounts. Excellent. Get that engine and put it on an engine stand. If you wish, take the time and clean it up. Perhaps new gaskets, timing chain, etc for peace-of-mind. Then paint the engine. You'll need a transmission too. So, take a look in the mall, or classifieds, or take a trip to the salvage yard. If you find a donor Fiero, that would be ideal. That way, you can obtain all the necessary components. Clutch pedal, shifter, cables, etc. Now you're getting there. You'll still need wiring. Contact Dan. He goes by Fiero Flyer or DARN Cars now. He can make you a plug and play harness. What's left? Exhaust and labour. Again, there are vendors that can help with the exhaust. As for labour, I'm certain you can find another member, in your area, that might lend a hand. It's not that difficult nor are any "special tools" required. If you had all the parts, before you begin, you could do this in a weekend. I've done many swaps but I work at a fab shop and have access to very cool stuff. Like CNC laser, CNC brake, etc.
Yes labour is one of those things that's difficult to measure. Perhaps another member on here will assist you. That's what you want! Someone with experience that has the answers. Then you could negotiate some terms and amounts. That's how I would do it. -Keep the car running. -Gather "all" parts before hand. -Do the swap with someone who's already done it if possible. -Enjoy your new swap and your new friendship.
Save your money, and buy a car that is already swapped. Between running around, learning, dealing with flaky vendors who regularly disappear, wishful vendors who think they have products to sell but actually don't, and all the little bits and pieces that are needed... Way too much hassle
Swapped cars that are running already come up for sale regularly for the same or less money than what it cost to do the swap. This would likely save you money, a lot of hassle, and a few hundred hours of your time, not to mention the cost of all the equipment that you will need to buy and probably never use again. The new timing chain won't just attach itself. The engine needs a stand. Torque wrench. Gear puller. Scanner. Welder. How will you lift the car? Who will make your exhaust? Can you drive the car to an exhaust shop without an exhaust?
If you sell your car for a couple of thousand, save up another $5-7k, you can buy a nicely swapped car that you can test drive, evaluate, before buying. After going through a half assed butcher for a swap myself, chasing parts and trying to find help, and still being stuck with a car that I don't have the skills or time to properly finish myself, I truly regret not just buying a properly swapped car in the first place. If i could go back, I would gladly pay $10-12k for a swapped car with working AC, proper wiring, belts, hoses, mounts, etc, and drive it home. Nicely swapped 3800, Northstar and SBC cars do come up regularly in the $7-$10k range.
It all depends on whether you enjoy the challenge of doing the work and learning how to do it yourself, or you (like me) just want to enjoy the car and do other things with your spare time. I think that is where the real decision lies.... For a lot of guys who have the tools and skills, half the fun is figuring our how to do things themselves and they are willing to invest hundreds of hours into that part of the hobby. For others, they just want to turn the key, have a reliable weekend toy for Sunday afternoons, and pat themselves on the back if they change the oil or swap rotors once in a while
Good luck
Pete
[This message has been edited by cam-a-lot (edited 11-03-2014).]
Ya I'm not trying to be negative, but judging from how your post sounds, you're not in a position to do an engine swap.
You can plan and buy parts for months, accumulate everything you thing you could ever need, and you'd still have half of what you need, and months of work ahead of you.
My swap was a but more intense than most, but even with pre ordering thousands in every part in could imagine, it still took 3 me months of 4-12 hour days. I wouldn't have traded it for anything, there's not a car on this forum I'd rather have, because like any true engineer at heart believes, I can do everything swap related better than everyone here.
Ok maybe Skiitime's old car, but that's it. And even then I'd redo the engine swap with a different engine.
[This message has been edited by JohnSmith (edited 11-03-2014).]
Ya I'm not trying to be negative, but judging from how your post sounds, you're not in a position to do an engine swap.
You can plan and buy parts for months, accumulate everything you thing you could ever need, and you'd still have half of what you need, and months of work ahead of you.
My swap was a but more intense than most, but even with pre ordering thousands in every part in could imagine, it still took 3 me months of 4-12 hour days. I wouldn't have traded it for anything, there's not a car on this forum I'd rather have, because like any true engineer at heart believes, I can do everything swap related better than everyone here.
Ok maybe Skiitime's old car, but that's it. And even then I'd redo the engine swap with a different engine.
Believe me, I understand. As much as I want to do it (who doesn't) I'm just not the right person. everyone is right about finding a swap that's already done.
Hi Huracan, The car is working great (nock on wood - I use my head). Great to hear your fiero is running so well. I too am in the same boat as you when it comes to a swap. Would love to do it myself but time, money and expertise not to mention the garage couldn't handle it. The wife would also freak out. The swap is awesome just opening the hood, not to mention the power. You can always put your energy into restoring the cosmetics of the fiero you have until you make the big leap with getting another fiero with the swap completed.
Cam-a-lot explained it well - "all depends on whether you enjoy the challenge of doing the work and learning how to do it yourself, or you (like me) just want to enjoy the car and do other things with your spare time. I think that is where the real decision lies.... For a lot of guys who have the tools and skills, half the fun is figuring our how to do things themselves and they are willing to invest hundreds of hours into that part of the hobby. For others, they just want to turn the key, have a reliable weekend toy for Sunday afternoons, and pat themselves on the back if they change the oil or swap rotors once in a while.
Not having a shop is a tough one. But remember, you are young and there is nothing like looking back and accomplishing something really difficult no matter hard it is to push the limit of what you are capable no matter what it takes to make it happen. I guess you probably have made the right decision and its all good but I threw my two cents in anyway. Have your address got to take a drive out to fiero chat someday - YAHOO. Good to hear from you.
While some brave souls drive their 26-30 yr old automobile daily; I view cars this old as classics or hobby cars. Say you do an engine swap. Does that restore the car to like new condition? What about the suspension, rubber bushings, wheel bearings and overall condition of the body, brakes, interior and frame? I own a few low mileage Fieros and they are still all project cars. IMO, I would keep the Fiero as a fun project and buy a newer car as a daily driver.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Powerlog manifold, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Flotech Afterburner Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
That is exactly right. The fiero I have is very low mileage and I am slowly replacing everything over the last three years - suspension, rubber bushings, wheel bearings and overall condition of the body, brakes, hoses, frame, AC etc. I can't wait for something to break or wear out to fix it. It will always be a project car to me and that is great. I am an old fart taking it to the grave with me, watching all the new lookalikes drive down the highway. I'm somewhat of a fanatic when it comes to things operating as best as possible by design and being original. The help I have received from members is incredible. Wish it were an 88 but man this car is awesome anyway and getting newer by the day. LOL Thanks everybody had way too much coffee this morning and am looking forward to another POLAR VORTEX!
It's always great to see aq car that someone put thousands into, a show car, a fast car, etc... Hopefully that will be me someday. it was my first car, and hopefully will still be with me for the rest of my life. Too bad it's an auto...
But I want to get a second car now that I can afford some stuff. Everyone has been telling me to go get an E36 M3. They look awesome, and seem to fit in perfectly with the car scene around me with all that "stance." BUT... My first choice would be an '88 GT manual with a 3800 SC series 2. Don't want to do it to mine, because it's an auto ughh... SOOO... This is where my post is leading too... I have zero knowledge on how to do the swap. I have no friends with shops to do the work in. No one to fab up parts. Nothing. the most I can do is remove the engine in my driveway if I get a new Fiero. The ONLY way to get the swap done, would be to hire someone who I have no idea who they are, or drop my car off to a shop that would agree to do it if that's even possible. Also, I forgot to mention that the previous owner of my car, said he can give me an old motor that has laying around (yes its running and works good) so that's a plus. NOW... This whole post leads up to my question... Is it even worth doing if I have to pay the most likely extreme labor fees for this? And hope that they don't take a year to complete it?
