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And you thought the Fiero was a pain to work on by oldbikeracer
Started on: 06-27-2014 12:17 PM
Replies: 22 (530 views)
Last post by: Rick 88 on 06-28-2014 09:11 PM
oldbikeracer
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Report this Post06-27-2014 12:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for oldbikeracerClick Here to visit oldbikeracer's HomePageClick Here to Email oldbikeracerSend a Private Message to oldbikeracerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I also have a 1992 Corvette with LT1 engine. It has a warped head due to ruptured radiator hose . Try digging your way to the heads on this car !!! The Fiero is a pleasure to work on compared to this beasty. The Fiero has become the support vehicle for the Corvette. Just complaining a little while taking a break, the dogs do not seem to care and mu wife said "Gee, that's to bad. "
Mike

[This message has been edited by oldbikeracer (edited 06-27-2014).]

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Csjag
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Report this Post06-27-2014 12:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for CsjagClick Here to Email CsjagSend a Private Message to CsjagEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Good luck with the Vette, its hot now too, that makes it even harder
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oldbikeracer
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Report this Post06-27-2014 12:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for oldbikeracerClick Here to visit oldbikeracer's HomePageClick Here to Email oldbikeracerSend a Private Message to oldbikeracerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I am blessed on the heat I have a small garage attached to the house with a small window AC unit. The real problem is that I am 73 and have to take breaks often. I am off to crawl under it and disconnect exhaust from the manifolds. Just a bunch of stuff to remove to get to the heads. Hopefully I can have them off by Monday for their trip to the machine shop and put it back together next weekend. Come on up and help, I will be grilling chickens, hamburgers and hot dogs on Saturday and can probably find a cold beverage. Thanks for the good luck wish.
MIKE
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pavo_roddy
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Report this Post06-27-2014 07:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pavo_roddySend a Private Message to pavo_roddyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
HI all

Sorry for highjacking, but FYI.

Holy coincidence batman. My nephew just turned 16 in March and his mom and stepdad got him a 90's Ford Ranger. Ok, but whaaa? Just to get to one of the set of three sparkplugs you had to take the wheel off, the wheel well liner, plus my stepfather had such a hard time just getting to the sparkplug he actually tore a boot on the wire. I wasn't out to witness said events, but after the torn boot, my stepfather called it quits, said you will probably have to take it in. Getting to it from the top or bottom was also impossible.

Ford Ranger with a six cyl. And what little I did see, the Fieros engine compartment has much, much more room. lol...

Ear-ick

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Csjag
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Report this Post06-27-2014 08:00 PM Click Here to See the Profile for CsjagClick Here to Email CsjagSend a Private Message to CsjagEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Glad u got the A/C, I just turned 63 so you got me beat,
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motoracer838
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Report this Post06-27-2014 08:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for motoracer838Click Here to Email motoracer838Send a Private Message to motoracer838Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I hear what your saying, my current project has been a total pain in my azz, some of the pain is of my own making but there also is some really bad engineering in the S10 platform as well. my project the V8 S10 Blazer, the Indy Hauler //www.fiero.nl/forum/F...2/HTML/068185-4.html

Cheers Beers n Gearz. Joe
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oldbikeracer
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Report this Post06-27-2014 09:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for oldbikeracerClick Here to visit oldbikeracer's HomePageClick Here to Email oldbikeracerSend a Private Message to oldbikeracerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
This darn Corvette has a bracket on the drivers side that mounts the alternator, power steering pump, AC compressor, belt tensioner and belt idler pulley. They are intertwined and it has brackets from it to the exhaust manifold bolts. You have to figure what comes off first and hopefully what goes back on first. Then there is the reactive stability control hanging in the way that is a nightmare of throttle cables and stuff in the way. Then is there is all the wiring harnesses, EGR stuff and a zillion vacuum hoses and emission tubes running everywhere. I know I will get it apart, putting back together will be the test. I have been taking pictures as I take it apart to hopefully help with component placement on assembly. And I complained about the Fiero water pump replacement, piece of cake compared to the thing. There I have vented for the day. Thanks for the good luck wishes and sympathy.
MIKE
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fieroguru
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Report this Post06-28-2014 07:35 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguruSend a Private Message to fieroguruEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My 86 Vette wasn't as complicated in the engine bay and I really liked that I could sit on the front tires while I worked on it.

4x4 S10's are a major pain to work on.
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motoracer838
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Report this Post06-28-2014 09:36 AM Click Here to See the Profile for motoracer838Click Here to Email motoracer838Send a Private Message to motoracer838Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fieroguru:


4x4 S10's are a major pain to work on.


I had to rebuild the engine in a former bosses Syclone, even worse than the "Hauler" to work on, there is a very specific order to the assembly of the right side exhaust manifold, turbo, etc, etc, ect. If you've never done it, don't. If you have, you won't do it again.

Joe
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oldbikeracer
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Report this Post06-28-2014 09:42 AM Click Here to See the Profile for oldbikeracerClick Here to visit oldbikeracer's HomePageClick Here to Email oldbikeracerSend a Private Message to oldbikeracerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have owned 2 other Corvettes and 89 Coupe, six speed and an 89 convertible, six speed. They were both L98 engines and a little simpler to work on. Sitting on the tire works good and it is easy to reach things under the tilt front end, but Chevrolet packed so many items together in a limited space that it is a real pain to work on. I enjoy both cars, Fiero and Corvette but actually prefer the Fiero. I just look good in it. Well back to the Garage and my wrenches.
MIKE
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California Kid
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Report this Post06-28-2014 10:43 AM Click Here to See the Profile for California KidSend a Private Message to California KidEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Best one that I've heard of from Shop that does some work for me, Ford made quite a few Vans over the years (? year and model). It was easier and cost less for Mechanics to remove entire body from chassis to change spark plugs, or fuel injectors.
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oldbikeracer
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Report this Post06-28-2014 11:02 AM Click Here to See the Profile for oldbikeracerClick Here to visit oldbikeracer's HomePageClick Here to Email oldbikeracerSend a Private Message to oldbikeracerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
They should make the engineers that design this stuff work on them, bet things would get easier to get to. Spark plugs on the Corvette are a pain but not horrible to change, injectors are very easy to change. I have changed the plugs on several V6 Fiero engines and it is not a bad job. I just get in the trunk and lean over the engine to reach the back side plugs, still by feel but quick and simple. Fiero water pump was a pain due to weird bolts but I replaced them with stainless hex head bolts. OK break is over back to the Vette, I am removing the intake now and sprayed all the exhaust bolts with PB blaster last night. Hopefully I will get at least one had off today. I really like this forum because I can complain and vent and someone always comes back with a Good Luck or I know what you mean. Makes me feel less alone I my quests. Old guys need love and understanding too, again Wife just says "Gee that's to bad." and goes about her business.
MIKE
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California Kid
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Report this Post06-28-2014 11:16 AM Click Here to See the Profile for California KidSend a Private Message to California KidEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by oldbikeracer:

They should make the engineers that design this stuff work on them, bet things would get easier to get to.....snip
MIKE


Engineers don't have a say in it, that's driven by Management. Most times those service issues are pointed out by Engineers to Program Management. Service Engineers and Design Release Engineers always work together to address these issues. When a issue/s is found, both of those Engineers can be over-ruled by Management if there is cost impact and/or change to styling.
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oldbikeracer
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Report this Post06-28-2014 11:30 AM Click Here to See the Profile for oldbikeracerClick Here to visit oldbikeracer's HomePageClick Here to Email oldbikeracerSend a Private Message to oldbikeracerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have met and worked with engineers in the past and they are all a bit bonkers. One example, electrical engineer spoke up at a lunch meeting that he had a great idea for the company to manufacture. He suggested a solar powered flash light, not solar charged but solar powered. I was the only non engineer at the table and when I asked him how you could use it in the dark with no sun light, he said shin a light on it. There was still no responses from the other four engineers at the table, you could see that were analyzing the idea. I dropped the subject because I could see that logic was not present at the meeting. Perhaps one of them decided later that solar powered stuff does not work in the dark.
MIKE

PS. What is the California Kid doing in Michigan? Are you perhaps and engineer, LOL?

[This message has been edited by oldbikeracer (edited 06-28-2014).]

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California Kid
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Report this Post06-28-2014 11:53 AM Click Here to See the Profile for California KidSend a Private Message to California KidEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by oldbikeracer:

PS. What is the California Kid doing in Michigan? Are you perhaps and engineer, LOL?



Hey, I'm not saying all Engineers are good. Just saying that Automobile Manufacturers Engineers are held to many PEER Reviews in the design process, they don't make all the decisions.

California Kid is the name I gave my car, it had it roots in California on initial modifications. I've always lived in Metro Detroit area. I've worked in Automotive Engineering Groups with Chrysler, VW-Audi, General Motors since 1972 (40 years experience), and yes I was a Senior Engineer (retired).

[This message has been edited by California Kid (edited 06-28-2014).]

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css9450
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Report this Post06-28-2014 12:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for css9450Click Here to Email css9450Send a Private Message to css9450Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by oldbikeracer:

Sitting on the tire works good and it is easy to reach things under the tilt front end...


I always wondered about those huge clamshell hoods on the C4 Corvette. I'd imagine banging my head on it about every three seconds!

Overall, I think the Fiero is pretty easy to work on. OK, the water pump and alternator are no fun on the 2.8 but I have seen worse. The water pump on, say, a 2.8 Citation or Chevy Celebrity is much tighter against the strut tower. And the earlier carb'd versions of the 2.8 have miles of vacuum lines and hard lines for the A.I.R. injection which always get in the way of everything. However, the later DIS version of the 2.8 has the world's easiest water pump and alternator. I enjoyed working on that engine when I had one.

I miss my old 2.8 S-10 pickup. Much easier to work on than the 4.3. On the other hand... Mine was coming due for ball joints and probably many other parts in the front suspension. The rust down there was horrible. That was not going to be fun.

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oldbikeracer
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Report this Post06-28-2014 01:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for oldbikeracerClick Here to visit oldbikeracer's HomePageClick Here to Email oldbikeracerSend a Private Message to oldbikeracerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Actually the clamshell hood clears my head with no problems if I was taller perhaps it would be a different story.

California Kid,
I had no intention to hurt any feelings, sorry if I did. So that is the cars name, strange how we name our favorite cars. My Fiero is RED due to the color and my preference for red headed women, I have married two of them. The Corvette is named WHITE B*&%H at this time but will probably be changed if I get it running good again.

[This message has been edited by oldbikeracer (edited 06-28-2014).]

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California Kid
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Report this Post06-28-2014 01:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for California KidSend a Private Message to California KidEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by oldbikeracer:

Actually the clamshell hood clears my head with no problems if I was taller perhaps it would be a different story.

California Kid,
I had no intention to hurt any feelings, sorry if I did. So that is the cars name, strange how we name our favorite cars. My Fiero is RED due to the color and my preference for red headed women, I have married two of them. The Corvette is named WHITE B*&%H at this time but will probably be changed if I get it running good again.



No feelings hurt on this end, I realize a lot of people are quick to blame the Engineers, just like to get my 2 cents in once in a while, to point out most of the time it's not the Engineers fault things turn out the way they did. You'd be amazed at how many good ideas are squashed by the Bean Counters, case in point - all the latest GM Recalls.
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Report this Post06-28-2014 04:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for CsjagClick Here to Email CsjagSend a Private Message to CsjagEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I've always heard that the Mercedes up until about 1990 were over engineered, their philosophy was why use 3 bolts when you can use 9. I know I could feel the difference in a 70's Mercedes diesel I used to own. It felt like one solid piece of steel when I was driving it over bumps and potholes.
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Report this Post06-28-2014 04:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for KitskaboodleClick Here to Email KitskaboodleSend a Private Message to KitskaboodleEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My buddy has the same car as you. I have worked on it for him and yes, everything is crammed in there tight. He had factory plug & wires installed at a local shop and they charged him about $450. The distributor was replaced twice and was mostly caused by heat damage & water pump coolant leaks. (The distributor is directly under the water pump...a serious design flaw in my opinion). Is yours an auto? If so, it is unlikely tou are on the original unless you have very low miles on it. My buddy's 92 is on auto tranny number 3 but the engine is original and still going strong at 305K+ miles. Oh, and yes we have had to rebuild the headlight motors with Rodney's kits.
Kit
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Rick 88
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Report this Post06-28-2014 05:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Rick 88Send a Private Message to Rick 88Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by California Kid:

Best one that I've heard of from Shop that does some work for me, Ford made quite a few Vans over the years (? year and model). It was easier and cost less for Mechanics to remove entire body from chassis to change spark plugs, or fuel injectors.



The same thing is true for heavy maintainence on the Ford Power Stroke diesel trucks. If you ever look under the hood on one you will know why.
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oldbikeracer
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Report this Post06-28-2014 08:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for oldbikeracerClick Here to visit oldbikeracer's HomePageClick Here to Email oldbikeracerSend a Private Message to oldbikeracerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Yes I know about water pumps leaking onto the optispark distributor. I am replacing the water pump while doing the heads. I have replaced plug wires and distributor on an LT1 before and after you do it once it is not so horrible. The heads on the pother hand is a really bad experience, to many bolts hard to get to remove, and they will be hard to get to toque during assembly. My car has 53,000 miles and is an automatic. But this is a Fiero forum and I should stop discussing my Corvette here. I do have the heads off now.
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Rick 88
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Report this Post06-28-2014 09:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Rick 88Send a Private Message to Rick 88Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
You might check out the C4 section on Corvette Forum for tips that might help. A buddy of mine said he learned alot from there when he was working on his C4.
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