So you are saying it is not possible that aliens came and brought the seeds of life to Earth? I'm glad that is finally settled.
Of course it's not settled. People believe what they want to believe. I'm just going by facts and the speed of light is a solid fact as far as I know. These theories of folding space etc. while interesting and worth studying are not accepted fact are they? We discover new things all the time so maybe these theories will prove out. I'm pretty convinced of evolution because the preponderance of evidence so far supports it as the most reasonable explanation but it is after all a theory
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08:54 AM
2.5 Member
Posts: 43235 From: Southern MN Registered: May 2007
THE SPEED OF LIGHT1 Unless they found a way around that barrier no one has ever come here. At 58,000 miles an hour it takes 8 months to get to the nearest uninhabitable planet. Much as I admire Elon Musk, I can't understand his obsession with going to mars. I'm all for robotic explorrers, but it is millions of times easier to not destroy this planet than to migrate to anywhere else in the universe.
chances are it Advanced races would travel using matter manipulation and bending space to bring two points together. Our scientists are already talking about such methods
Of course it's not settled. People believe what they want to believe. I'm just going by facts and the speed of light is a solid fact as far as I know. These theories of folding space etc. while interesting and worth studying are not accepted fact are they? We discover new things all the time so maybe these theories will prove out. I'm pretty convinced of evolution because the preponderance of evidence so far supports it as the most reasonable explanation but it is after all a theory
wormhole Theory and bending space between two points together is pretty much accepted as fact and possible. It's just a matter of making it happen.
wormhole Theory and bending space between two points together is pretty much accepted as fact and possible. It's just a matter of making it happen.
No it's not. Please. It's speculation at best. The math implies these *might* be possible under some specific conditions but probably not practical in any sense. They are not in any shape or form "accepted fact." And Star Trek's "warp engines" are not real nor is the science. It's made up. The science-speculation shows are fun but they are for entertainment, not real science.
On a scale of 0-100 our ability or future ability to cross the vast distances between even stars let alone to a star with a planet with intelligent life in a single life-time is at .001 at best. Someday? Maybe, but there is currently nothing even remotely implying we can do it in the next 200 years if ever. Over several generations? Yeah if we can build something big enough to be self-sustaining but we need to be absolutely sure where we are going.
Put me at the top of the list for wishing this was true but we need to keep fantasy - fantasy while we work on it.
[This message has been edited by TK (edited 01-09-2014).]
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11:26 AM
rogergarrison Member
Posts: 49601 From: A Western Caribbean Island/ Columbus, Ohio Registered: Apr 99
WE dont think anything is faster than the speed of light. Someone a million years more advanced may not buy into that. Ive seen lately on some science shows, they really believe the speed of light is variable and not a constant anymore. Some physist on the other nite says hes isolated particals smaller than the nucleus and electrons of an atom that move faster.
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12:52 PM
84fiero123 Member
Posts: 29950 From: farmington, maine usa Registered: Oct 2004
Don't government officials in Canada like to smoke crack and get into drunken stupors?
I don't think any more or less than American ones do, we do have our larger than fair share of druggy politicians.
I think it is ironic that anyone believes we are the only intelligent life forms, especially seeing just how many stupid people we have on this planet, most of whom are our political idiots in charge. It would be stupid on our part to think we are the only intelligent life form in all the galaxies of the universe. There have got to be many more intelligent than us, hell we are still trying to kill each other off.
quote
Originally posted by TK: No it's not. Please. It's speculation at best. The math implies these *might* be possible under some specific conditions but probably not practical in any sense. They are not in any shape or form "accepted fact." And Star Trek's "warp engines" are not real nor is the science. It's made up. The science-speculation shows are fun but they are for entertainment, not real science.
On a scale of 0-100 our ability or future ability to cross the vast distances between even stars let alone to a star with a planet with intelligent life in a single life-time is at .001 at best. Someday? Maybe, but there is currently nothing even remotely implying we can do it in the next 200 years if ever. Over several generations? Yeah if we can build something big enough to be self-sustaining but we need to be absolutely sure where we are going.
Put me at the top of the list for wishing this was true but we need to keep fantasy - fantasy while we work on it.
think of how far we have come in the last hundred years, from people who thought that the horse and carriage was the limit of our transportation to going to other planets, then think about how many galaxy's there are in the universe that we have found and how many we haven't. when I first came back to Maine I worked with a college boy who said that we would never have flash drives that could hold as much info as in a DVD, now we have even larger ones. never say never when it comes to technological limits or you will eventually be proven wrong.
Steve
[This message has been edited by 84fiero123 (edited 01-09-2014).]
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01:15 PM
dratts Member
Posts: 8373 From: Coeur d' alene Idaho USA Registered: Apr 2001
I think that the odds of there being life in the universe besides our own is overwhelming. The chances of us discovering each other, not so much. Way, way not so much.
[This message has been edited by dratts (edited 01-09-2014).]
No it's not. Please. It's speculation at best. The math implies these *might* be possible under some specific conditions but probably not practical in any sense. They are not in any shape or form "accepted fact." And Star Trek's "warp engines" are not real nor is the science. It's made up. The science-speculation shows are fun but they are for entertainment, not real science.
On a scale of 0-100 our ability or future ability to cross the vast distances between even stars let alone to a star with a planet with intelligent life in a single life-time is at .001 at best. Someday? Maybe, but there is currently nothing even remotely implying we can do it in the next 200 years if ever. Over several generations? Yeah if we can build something big enough to be self-sustaining but we need to be absolutely sure where we are going.
Put me at the top of the list for wishing this was true but we need to keep fantasy - fantasy while we work on it.
you sound like the "presiding wisdom" among scientist who stated that man would never travel to the moon in the 1940's, and those who did speak about lunar travel were accosted as junk scientist rooted in speculative fantasy. Seeing how we went from the wright brothers to space travel in just over half a century, and where we are today, you have a pretty a shallow outlook for the future. There will be things that come about you have never even fathomed.
many leading scientists in quantum physics agree, the theory is sound backed by the math. Just because we haven't the means does not means its not something that would be easily achievable in a hundred years etc. Just a hundred and fifty years later and people today are flying over terrain at 40,000 feet and 600 miles per hour making 3 hour trips that before took months on a covered wagon. If you were to have asked the most brilliant of minds back then about such travel, they would have laughed at you, as many stated man would never fly.
\As far as Star Trek....who would of thought teleportation would be possible,but we in fact have successfully achieved teleportation with light waves and is a huge breakthrough. You should not be so quick to dismiss such concepts. Its a bit presumptuous and arrogant.
You two guys are just way cool. I'm so glad to know you both here. Total respect for you both and I don't know which post I like the best. I really liked both of them. edited to add: I looked it up and I found out that I hadn't given one of you a + yet. Fixed that.
[This message has been edited by dratts (edited 01-09-2014).]
You two guys are just way cool. I'm so glad to know you both here. Total respect for you both and I don't know which post I like the best. I really liked both of them. edited to add: I looked it up and I found out that I hadn't given one of you a + yet. Fixed that.
Who?
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05:49 PM
Neils88 Member
Posts: 4063 From: Jeddore,Nova Scotia Registered: Aug 2013
I never really allow science to class anything as "definitive" any more. We have had to rewrite the text book so many times because of breakthroughs, that I simply leave it open....It was only 60 years ago they thought the Atom was the smallest thing, until they split one open and saw its contents.
"People once thought grains of sand were the building blocks of what we see around us. Then the atom was discovered, and it was thought indivisible, until it was split to reveal protons, neutrons and electrons inside. These too, seemed like fundamental particles, before scientists discovered that protons and neutrons are made of three quarks each."
So...anyone going about how faster then light travel is impossible, and intergalactic space travel is unlikely...Please read 20,000 leagues under the sea and think about when it was written, now look at a U.S. Ohio class Nuclear Submarine.....nuff said.
[This message has been edited by NickD3.4 (edited 01-09-2014).]
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06:46 PM
PFF
System Bot
Neils88 Member
Posts: 4063 From: Jeddore,Nova Scotia Registered: Aug 2013
I never really allow science to class anything as "definitive" any more. We have had to rewrite the text book so many times because of breakthroughs, that I simply leave it open....It was only 60 years ago they thought the Atom was the smallest thing, until they split one open and saw its contents.
"People once thought grains of sand were the building blocks of what we see around us. Then the atom was discovered, and it was thought indivisible, until it was split to reveal protons, neutrons and electrons inside. These too, seemed like fundamental particles, before scientists discovered that protons and neutrons are made of three quarks each."
So...anyone going about how faster then light travel is impossible, and intergalactic space travel is unlikely...Please read 20,000 leagues under the sea and think about when it was written, now look at a U.S. Ohio class Nuclear Submarine.....nuff said.
Agreed. The "laws of physics" only apply to our current understanding. Our understanding is always evolving. A good scientist will always keep an open mind. "It is..." should be changed to "It is...until we change it later."
[This message has been edited by Neils88 (edited 01-09-2014).]
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06:54 PM
dratts Member
Posts: 8373 From: Coeur d' alene Idaho USA Registered: Apr 2001
you sound like the "presiding wisdom" among scientist who stated that man would never travel to the moon in the 1940's, and those who did speak about lunar travel were accosted as junk scientist rooted in speculative fantasy. Seeing how we went from the wright brothers to space travel in just over half a century, and where we are today, you have a pretty a shallow outlook for the future. There will be things that come about you have never even fathomed.
many leading scientists in quantum physics agree, the theory is sound backed by the math. Just because we haven't the means does not means its not something that would be easily achievable in a hundred years etc. Just a hundred and fifty years later and people today are flying over terrain at 40,000 feet and 600 miles per hour making 3 hour trips that before took months on a covered wagon. If you were to have asked the most brilliant of minds back then about such travel, they would have laughed at you, as many stated man would never fly.
\As far as Star Trek....who would of thought teleportation would be possible,but we in fact have successfully achieved teleportation with light waves and is a huge breakthrough. You should not be so quick to dismiss such concepts. Its a bit presumptuous and arrogant.
Just a tad different there. We aren't talking about going to the moon or DVD players. We need to violate the laws of physics several times over, not work out some details within the laws of physics.
[This message has been edited by TK (edited 01-09-2014).]
Just a tad different there. We aren't talking about going to the moon or DVD players. We need to violate the laws of physics several times over, not work out some details within the laws of physics.
I get what your sayin, I'm just very cautious to talk in absolutes when it comes to this department because we are constantly being proven wrong time and time again scientifically speaking.
like Neils pointed out, its physics as we understand It, however our understanding changes often in what we think Are set in stone laws aren't necessarily the case.
if you research UFOs seriously, there is a mountain of compelling scientific Data out there, specifically radar reports that show objects doing things that violate our understanding of physics and flight quite often.
reminds me of my neighbor I had growing up, he was a World War 2 vet and he told me one day He saw a me 262 break through the clouds. he watched in disbelief as a loud plane was in the air with no propeller. When he told his buddies about it, they said he was a liar and full of crap. After all, planes can't fly without propellers!
;-)
[This message has been edited by NickD3.4 (edited 01-09-2014).]
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11:21 PM
Fats Member
Posts: 5577 From: Wheaton, Mo. Registered: Jan 2012
I get what your sayin, I'm just very cautious to talk in absolutes when it comes to this department because we are constantly being proven wrong time and time again scientifically speaking.
like Neils pointed out, its physics as we understand It, however our understanding changes often in what we think Are set in stone laws aren't necessarily the case.
if you research UFOs seriously, there is a mountain of compelling scientific Data out there, specifically radar reports that show objects doing things that violate our understanding of physics and flight quite often.
reminds me of my neighbor I had growing up, he was a World War 2 vet and he told me one day He saw a me 262 break through the clouds. he watched in disbelief as a loud plane was in the air with no propeller. When he told his buddies about it, they said he was a liar and full of crap. After all, planes can't fly without propellers!
;-)
I've said this before, there is no one on this planet that wants UFOs, aliens, Bigfoot, time travellers and many other things to be true more than me. It would be AWESOME. I am not poo-pooing on this because I like to be negative. But once I started taking a serious look at what I believed, it's not there. Not a little, not a smidge, not a bit - it's not there. An open mind doesn't make unreal things real. It just makes some believe unreal things are real.
I am not single handedly holding back our ability to go faster than light by denying its feasibility, It's not as simple as just believing it might be possible. I don't deny that aliens from outer space could be visiting earth because there is nothing that would preclude them doing it is they wanted to put the effort into it, but I don't believe they have yet done it. If we find life in our solar system then we can claim to have done it first.
But for the sake of pop-science and speculation, sure, we are on the verge of pulling it off. Hopefully that makes it now possible.
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10:24 AM
rogergarrison Member
Posts: 49601 From: A Western Caribbean Island/ Columbus, Ohio Registered: Apr 99
Nick, you brought up jets flying without propellers. Add to that there are some planes that even fly with barely any wing area for lift. Look at the F 104 starfighter. Barely an airfoil on the wing at all and the wing is smaller than a car...yet it flies perfectly fine. The whole basis behind airplanes was they had to have wings for lift in order to fly. If you would have shown the Wright brothers plans for the F104, they themselves would have told you it would never be able to fly.
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10:38 AM
PFF
System Bot
dratts Member
Posts: 8373 From: Coeur d' alene Idaho USA Registered: Apr 2001
I'm being exposed to theories that I never bothered to look at previously. My take on this is that there are some fun theories out there, but I'm guessing that no one alive now will solve the problems all of these have to overcome.
[This message has been edited by dratts (edited 01-10-2014).]
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12:06 PM
dratts Member
Posts: 8373 From: Coeur d' alene Idaho USA Registered: Apr 2001
Nick, you brought up jets flying without propellers. Add to that there are some planes that even fly with barely any wing area for lift. Look at the F 104 starfighter. Barely an airfoil on the wing at all and the wing is smaller than a car...yet it flies perfectly fine. The whole basis behind airplanes was they had to have wings for lift in order to fly. If you would have shown the Wright brothers plans for the F104, they themselves would have told you it would never be able to fly.
Originally posted by TK: once I started taking a serious look at what I believed, it's not there. Not a little, not a smidge, not a bit.
that's your opinion, & I disagree with You. there's a lot of solid studies done by reputable scientist and others that have very convincing data and evidence to support Ufo claims.
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07:05 PM
Neils88 Member
Posts: 4063 From: Jeddore,Nova Scotia Registered: Aug 2013
that's your opinion, & I disagree with You. there's a lot of solid studies done by reputable scientist and others that have very convincing data and evidence to support Ufo claims.
I accept that as a valid opinion...however, many people (myself included) strongly feel that the evidence is far from convincing. Data can always be manipulated or interpreted to support any theory or story. People WANT to believe that extraterrestrials have come to earth, and quickly accept misleading interpretations. I'm absolutely fascinated by the topic, yet I find that everything I have read always has flaws and holes when objectively reviewed.
I would love to be alive to see the day when we make contact in some manner...unfortunately, I don't realistically believe that I will be.
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08:15 PM
Boondawg Member
Posts: 38235 From: Displaced Alaskan Registered: Jun 2003
I've said this before, there is no one on this planet that wants UFOs, aliens, Bigfoot, time travellers and many other things to be true more than me. It would be AWESOME. I am not poo-pooing on this because I like to be negative.
But for the sake of pop-science and speculation, sure, we are on the verge of pulling it off.
I feel the same. I'm just a little more slutty with mine. It's fun so I'm in!
[This message has been edited by Boondawg (edited 01-10-2014).]
