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Things not to do at the beach by carnut122
Started on: 05-22-2012 07:08 PM
Replies: 9
Last post by: heybjorn on 05-23-2012 03:48 PM
carnut122
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Report this Post05-22-2012 07:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for carnut122Send a Private Message to carnut122Direct Link to This Post
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Boondawg
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Report this Post05-22-2012 07:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BoondawgSend a Private Message to BoondawgDirect Link to This Post
I did that last one...........twice!
It turns out I didn't need a bigger boat.
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MidEngineManiac
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Report this Post05-22-2012 08:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MidEngineManiacSend a Private Message to MidEngineManiacDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Boondawg:

I did that last one...........twice!
It turns out I didn't need a bigger boat.


LMAO!!!...That one reminds me (true story)....I had just gotten my Commercial ticket, and was building some hours flying a Cessna 172 on sight-seeing hops over the north shore of lake Erie while working at the airport.....these 2 fat ( and I mean FAT, minimum 350 to 400 pound) women come in and try to book a trip....guy at the dispatch desk says to me as I come out of the bathroom "your next passengers are in the lounge"...I walk out there, take one look, go back to the office and say "I need a bigger effin airplane"---only to turn around and have one of them standing there...

oooooooopppsssssss

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Uaana
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Report this Post05-22-2012 09:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for UaanaClick Here to visit Uaana's HomePageSend a Private Message to UaanaDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by MidEngineManiac:


LMAO!!!...That one reminds me (true story)....I had just gotten my Commercial ticket, and was building some hours flying a Cessna 172 on sight-seeing hops over the north shore of lake Erie while working at the airport.....these 2 fat ( and I mean FAT, minimum 350 to 400 pound) women come in and try to book a trip....guy at the dispatch desk says to me as I come out of the bathroom "your next passengers are in the lounge"...I walk out there, take one look, go back to the office and say "I need a bigger effin airplane"---only to turn around and have one of them standing there...

oooooooopppsssssss


Well to be fair you were logging hrs in a 172.. If they had a carry on you'd be pootched.

<edit> Sorry paranoid about weight.. The 172 being a 3 passenger craft.. (average wt 160lbs) Two biguns (I don't care if m/f) show up even for a sight seeing trip.. I'd be worried as hell.

[This message has been edited by Uaana (edited 05-22-2012).]

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Marvin McInnis
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Report this Post05-23-2012 01:45 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Marvin McInnisClick Here to visit Marvin McInnis's HomePageSend a Private Message to Marvin McInnisDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by MidEngineManiac:

[I] was building some hours flying a Cessna 172 on sight-seeing hops over the north shore of lake Erie while working at the airport.....these 2 fat ( and I mean FAT, minimum 350 to 400 pound) women come in and try to book a trip....



Hmmmmm. As I remember, the useful load for a typical 172M with full fuel (38 gallons) was about 700 pounds, but I don't believe there was any stated cabin load limit. (Conversely, in airplanes like the Cherokee 6 there is a maximum allowable fuselage load. Beyond that, any additional weight up to maximum gross has to be fuel in the wing tanks.) Two 350-pound passengers plus a standard 170-pound pilot would be an 870 pound cabin load. To be legal you would have to drain at least 170 pounds (~28 gallons) of fuel ... which would leave you pretty much at legal minimum fuel immediately after takeoff. With two 400-pound passengers it would be impossible to offload enough fuel to get down to certificated max gross weight. Not my idea of a fun ride!

[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 05-23-2012).]

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maryjane
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Report this Post05-23-2012 02:47 AM Click Here to See the Profile for maryjaneSend a Private Message to maryjaneDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Marvin McInnis:


Hmmmmm. As I remember, the useful load for a typical 172M with full fuel (38 gallons) was about 700 pounds, but I don't believe there was any stated cabin load limit. (Conversely, in airplanes like the Cherokee 6 there is a maximum allowable fuselage load. Beyond that, any additional weight up to maximum gross has to be fuel in the wing tanks.) Two 350-pound passengers plus a standard 170-pound pilot would be an 870 pound cabin load. To be legal you would have to drain at least 170 pounds (~28 gallons) of fuel ... which would leave you pretty much at legal minimum fuel immediately after takeoff. With two 400-pound passengers it would be impossible to offload enough fuel to get down to certificated max gross weight. Not my idea of a fun ride!


Yeah, glider pilots have all the fun--it just doesn't last very long.
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Marvin McInnis
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Report this Post05-23-2012 01:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Marvin McInnisClick Here to visit Marvin McInnis's HomePageSend a Private Message to Marvin McInnisDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by maryjane:

Yeah, glider pilots have all the fun--it just doesn't last very long.



In an actual glider => Fun (usually sweaty fun) ... and it can sometimes last for hours.

In a powered airplane => Not fun (sweaty not fun) ... and yes, it doesn't last very long.

In a helicopter => Yikes! Are we on the ground already? Excuse me ... I have to go change my shorts.

[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 05-23-2012).]

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MidEngineManiac
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Report this Post05-23-2012 02:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MidEngineManiacSend a Private Message to MidEngineManiacDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Marvin McInnis:


Hmmmmm. As I remember, the useful load for a typical 172M with full fuel (38 gallons) was about 700 pounds, but I don't believe there was any stated cabin load limit. (Conversely, in airplanes like the Cherokee 6 there is a maximum allowable fuselage load. Beyond that, any additional weight up to maximum gross has to be fuel in the wing tanks.) Two 350-pound passengers plus a standard 170-pound pilot would be an 870 pound cabin load. To be legal you would have to drain at least 170 pounds (~28 gallons) of fuel ... which would leave you pretty much at legal minimum fuel immediately after takeoff. With two 400-pound passengers it would be impossible to offload enough fuel to get down to certificated max gross weight. Not my idea of a fun ride!



So long as your density altitude is low enough, a 172 will get off the ground slightly over gross <sticks hands in pocket and whistles>. Depending on model, gross is around 2200-2400, and I am SUURREEE a northern pilot has never gotten one off the ground closer to the 3,000 mark.

Ya dont want to do it in summer weather, but it MAY be possible in winter....<walks away whistling knowing nothing>....

[This message has been edited by MidEngineManiac (edited 05-23-2012).]

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Marvin McInnis
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Report this Post05-23-2012 02:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Marvin McInnisClick Here to visit Marvin McInnis's HomePageSend a Private Message to Marvin McInnisDirect Link to This Post
Anytime you operate an aircraft at more than max certificated gross weight you are a test pilot. Usually you can get away with it, sometimes not, but doing so you have intentionally given up any safety margin available to you. More than once, I've seen an airplane sufficiently overloaded that it couldn't climb out of ground effect on a hot summer day; the usual result was lots of sheet metal and/or fiberglass repairs.

I've operated a 150 hp 172M out of Taos, New Mexico (KSKX), where the field elevation is 7,095 feet. It is not unusual in summer for the density altitude to exceed 10,000 feet by noon (temperature >78 F). With just my wife and me, our luggage, and full fuel, a summer takeoff at Taos was always "exciting." On the other hand, I've taken off on crisp winter mornings in Kansas City with the calculated density altitude more than 1000 feet below sea level.

I used to fly a rental 180 hp Piper Arrow that somebody else once put into the weeds at Taos ... attempting to take off at substantially above maximum gross weight, downwind, and uphill. Stupid is as stupid does.

Then there was the time I had to land the 172 at Santa Fe, NM (KSAF) on a hot summer day with an inoperative airspeed indicator ... but that's another story for another time. I'll just say that it was a non-event, and the outcome was successful. Fly the way you train, train the way you fly.

A typical afternoon at Taos during the summer monsoon season:



That's my brother, with the "What, me worry?" grin on his face, and his beautiful money-pit Debonair.

[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 05-23-2012).]

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heybjorn
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Report this Post05-23-2012 03:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for heybjornSend a Private Message to heybjornDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Marvin McInnis:

That's my brother, with the "What, me worry?" grin on his face, and his money-pit Debonair.



Let's face it, Marvin, it takes a great deal of money to be suave and urbane.

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