Ok, so debtors prisons are illegal, but what if a debt collection agency files a lawsuit against you for that debt and you don't make it? In a some places, apparently, that can land you in jail.
How did breast cancer survivor Lisa Lindsay end up behind bars? She didn't pay a medical bill -- one the Herrin, Ill., teaching assistant was told she didn't owe. "She got a $280 medical bill in error and was told she didn't have to pay it," The Associated Press reports. "But the bill was turned over to a collection agency, and eventually state troopers showed up at her home and took her to jail in handcuffs."
Although the U.S. abolished debtors' prisons in the 1830s, more than a third of U.S. states allow the police to haul people in who don't pay all manner of debts, from bills for health care services to credit card and auto loans. In parts of Illinois, debt collectors commonly use publicly funded courts, sheriff's deputies, and country jails to pressure people who owe even small amounts to pay up, according to the AP.
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Under the law, debtors aren't arrested for nonpayment, but rather for failing to respond to court hearings, pay legal fines, or otherwise showing "contempt of court" in connection with a creditor lawsuit. That loophole has lawmakers in the Illinois House of Representatives concerned enough to pass a bill in March that would make it illegal to send residents of the state to jail if they can't pay a debt. The measure awaits action in the senate.
"Creditors have been manipulating the court system to extract money from the unemployed, veterans, even seniors who rely solely on their benefits to get by each month," Illinois Attorney General Lisa Madigan said last month in a statement voicing support for the legislation. "Too many people have been thrown in jail simply because they're too poor to pay their debts. We cannot allow these illegal abuses to continue."
Debt collectors typically avoid filing suit against debtors, a representative with the Illinois Collectors Association tells the AP. "A consumer that has been arrested or jailed can't pay a debt. We want to work with consumers to resolve issues," he said.
Yet Illinois isn't the only state where residents get locked up for owing money. A 2010 report by the American Civil Liberties Union that focused on only five states -- Georgia, Louisiana, Michigan, Ohio, and Washington -- found that people were being jailed at "increasingly alarming rates" over legal debts. Cases ranged from a woman who was arrested four separate times for failing to pay $251 in fines and court costs related to a fourth-degree misdemeanor conviction, to a mentally ill juvenile jailed by a judge over a previous conviction for stealing school supplies.
According to the ACLU: "The sad truth is that debtors' prisons are flourishing today, more than two decades after the Supreme Court prohibited imprisoning those who are too poor to pay their legal debts. In this era of shrinking budgets, state and local governments have turned aggressively to using the threat and reality of imprisonment to squeeze revenue out of the poorest defendants who appear in their courts."
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Some states also apply "poverty penalties," including late fees, payment plan fees, and interest when people are unable to pay all their debts at once, according to a report by the New York University's Brennan Center for Justice. Alabama charges a 30 percent collection fee, for instance, while Florida allows private debt collectors to add a 40 percent surcharge on the original debt. Some Florida counties also use so-called collection courts, where debtors can be jailed but have no right to a public defender.
"Many states are imposing new and often onerous 'user fees' on individuals with criminal convictions," the authors of the Brennan Center report wrote. "Yet far from being easy money, these fees impose severe -- and often hidden -- costs on communities, taxpayers, and indigent people convicted of crimes. They create new paths to prison for those unable to pay their debts and make it harder to find employment and housing as well to meet child-support obligations."
Such practices, heightened in recent years by the effects of the recession, amount to criminalizing poverty, say critics in urging federal authorities to intervene. "More people are unemployed, more people are struggling financially, and more creditors are trying to get their debt paid," Madigan told the AP.
[This message has been edited by Rallaster (edited 04-28-2012).]
Creditors have been manipulating the court system to extract money from the unemployed, veterans, even seniors who rely solely on their benefits to get by each month," Illinois Attorney General Lisa Madigan said last month in a statement voicing support for the legislation. "Too many people have been thrown in jail simply because they're too poor to pay their debts. We cannot allow these illegal abuses to continue."
Well technically it is legal with the current laws, but i agree there should be something done to stop it from being legal. Not sure what would scare me more, the potential of being jailed like that, or an attorney general that thinks loopholes are illegal.
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09:34 PM
MidEngineManiac Member
Posts: 29566 From: Some unacceptable view Registered: Feb 2007
They do that in Canada under child support/ alimony schemes......if somebody falls behind in payments (for whatever reason, the guy could have been in a coma for 6 months, they dont care) 1st they take the drivers licence making it nearly impossible to work for most people---then they jail them INDEFINATLEY for "contempt" for not paying....the guy sits in a jail cell until he comes up with the cash--which aint gonna happen since he cant work because he is in jail.....its an unwinable catch-22 for a lot of people who loose their jobs or get sick.
They do that in Canada under child support/ alimony schemes......if somebody falls behind in payments (for whatever reason, the guy could have been in a coma for 6 months, they dont care) 1st they take the drivers licence making it nearly impossible to work for most people---then they jail them INDEFINATLEY for "contempt" for not paying....the guy sits in a jail cell until he comes up with the cash--which aint gonna happen since he cant work because he is in jail.....its an unwinable catch-22 for a lot of people who loose their jobs or get sick.
We have that here too, but that is a bit different than "traditional debt" from buying too much stuff. Court orders to pay is a far cry from visa complaining you owe them.
Here they also tend to let them out after a short time if they aren't hard core offenders, so they can get back to work.
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09:50 PM
FriendGregory Member
Posts: 4833 From: Palo Alto, CA, USA Registered: Jan 2004
Originally posted by MidEngineManiac: They do that in Canada under child support/ alimony schemes......if somebody falls behind in payments (for whatever reason, the guy could have been in a coma for 6 months, they dont care) 1st they take the drivers license making it nearly impossible to work for most people---then they jail them INDEFINATLEY for "contempt" for not paying....the guy sits in a jail cell until he comes up with the cash--which aint gonna happen since he cant work because he is in jail.....its an unwinable catch-22 for a lot of people who loose their jobs or get sick.
This is the one that drives me nuts. Take away a professional license so the would be payer can not legally work, B/S. As if the courts assume that now single guys can not fall on hard times just like intact families do sometimes.
This is the one that drives me nuts. Take away a professional license so the would be payer can not legally work, B/S. As if the courts assume that now single guys can not fall on hard times just like intact families do sometimes.
For what its worth, here if you fall on hard times you can go back to court and have the amount re-evaluated, relative to your new income.
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09:34 AM
82-T/A [At Work] Member
Posts: 25577 From: Florida USA Registered: Aug 2002
Ok, so debtors prisons are illegal, but what if a debt collection agency files a lawsuit against you for that debt and you don't make it? In a some places, apparently, that can land you in jail.
Yeah, I was reading about this a few weeks ago... it's really scary, but basically... the loop-hole is that the debt collectors "can" file a lawsuit against you (as the consumer). It's still something that is entirely in the control of the consumer, but basically what causes them to end up in prison is not the debt, but the failure to appear in court after the debt collectors have filed suit.
I think the article I read said there were 5 states that permitted this. It's just a matter of the legislature not realizing fully that there were loop-holes of sorts...
