quote Originally posted by Doni Hagan: I don't know if I agree with that premise in totality though I will say that the GOP supporting someone based on their skin color in order to deflect criticism has been tried before....and failed miserably. Ask Michael Steele.

It's not an absolute, but I think it's a major factor and it's a shame he won't be judged more by his platform and the content of his character than his skin color... just like Obama.
I'm glad America has moved to the point where a black man can be elected President. I just hate that it had to be Obama. I would have hoped our first black president (other than Bill Clinton) would have been a successful one.

Just look at this topic: "Cain....is this the new Obama for the right?"
What could that possibly mean other than a black candidate for the right? (Nick, if I'm off base, please let me know)
He's being called the "Obama for the right" solely because of his skin color - not because of his two autobiographies, or history as a Constitutional Law professor, or winning the Nobel Peace Prize. Other than both being unqualified to be president (for different reasons) what do Cain and Obama have in common other than skin color?

I don't really care. I'll vote for a black candidate, if it's the right candidate. I'd probably vote for Colin Powell even if he ran on the Democrat ticket. It's about the candidate and not their ethnicity. At least, it should be.

George Washington had no real elected office experience when he became president. I'm sure there have been others.
I don't think government experience is necessarily a good thing. I don't like most of the professional politicians or bureaucrats . I rather have a person with common sense, a good understanding of how the country works, stands by the constitution and isn't afraid to say what needs to be said...political consequences be damned. Experienced in the real America. To get this country back on level ground is going to take a tough hard-nosed person who is willing to go out on a limb and shake the whole tree. The rotten fruit usually falls out first. Herman Cain isn't perfect but he's closer than any of the others running right now. Will I vote for him in the primary....I don't know yet. There's a lot of water to go under that bridge yet.

I worry about Romney.. Some days I like him and he "says" some of the right things. But then I read about some of his past doings and it bothers me. His campaign will not make a definitive statement about his TRUE feelings on the 2nd Amendment. I worry about what kind of judges he will appoint. His willingness to "work" with the opposition sounds too McCainish for me. I heard Romney on the radio today and he sounded too much like polished politician. He was speaking so fast that he was hard to understand at times.
BUT---- If he becomes the nominee I'll have to hold my nose again. I'm tired of that.

quote Originally posted by 2farnorth: George Washington had no real elected office experience when he became president. I'm sure there have been others. I don't think government experience is necessarily a good thing. I don't like most of the professional politicians or bureaucrats . I rather have a person with common sense, a good understanding of how the country works, stands by the constitution and isn't afraid to say what needs to be said...political consequences be damned. Experienced in the real America. To get this country back on level ground is going to take a tough hard-nosed person who is willing to go out on a limb and shake the whole tree.

In terms of experience, no one who's ever held the job did it beforehand and you all already know our Constitution won't let us hire back former ones....two downs and out, so to speak. You can attempt to gauge a given person's ability to do the job based on a "pre-hire interview" (the primary process & campaign) but the bottom line is regardless of how much executive experience ones had prior to the presidency, it's a different animal from running a company or even a state. POTUS is the pressure gig to end all pressure gigs and most who get it seem to age 10 years for every 4 they hold it. All presidential elections are crapshoots at best, especially when a two term president is on his way out. You roll the dice and see what you get.

Yeah, I know that doesn't apply to the current situation as it stands but if Obama craps out, it most certainly does.

In that instance, class begins January 2013.

[This message has been edited by Doni Hagan (edited 10-24-2011).]

quote Originally posted by Formula88: What could that possibly mean other than a black candidate for the right? (Nick, if I'm off base, please let me know) He's being called the "Obama for the right" solely because of his skin color - not because of his two autobiographies, or history as a Constitutional Law professor, or winning the Nobel Peace Prize. Other than both being unqualified to be president (for different reasons) what do Cain and Obama have in common other than skin color?

It means everything he posted in the thread. Nothing to do with race, really...

quote Originally posted by Formula88: Just look at this topic: "Cain....is this the new Obama for the right?" What could that possibly mean other than a black candidate for the right? (Nick, if I'm off base, please let me know) He's being called the "Obama for the right" solely because of his skin color - not because of his two autobiographies, or history as a Constitutional Law professor, or winning the Nobel Peace Prize. Other than both being unqualified to be president (for different reasons) what do Cain and Obama have in common other than skin color?

Yes your off base....what is so hard for people to understand about this?...What do they have in common besides skin color???.........here.. I will say it again.

Cain: no government experience .....Obama:no executive experience.....both require on the job learning in different areas

Obama: lacked substance when pushed, would change position on things after short period, i.e. "Iran is not a threat and a little country...days later, "Iran is a big threat". Cain....... lacks substance when pushed, changes positions on things after short period, i.e. the debt ceiling, the federal reserve, and the terrorist negotiations.

Obama....despite the changing of positions and and lack of substance, the obama crowd cheered him on anyway and put their love for him above the man, and ignored the short comings and red flags.

Cain.....Despite his recent changing positions, and lacking of substance on these positions many conservatives are choosing to ignore this and cheer lead on the Cain band wagon. Their ignoring the red flags popping up, While I am simply pointing them out...

see how they are similar?...I can't make it anymore clear then that. Palin is not a comparison at all, she was a governor and a successful one with high approval as well. She also was not shifting around constantly on her positions. Their skin color has nothing to do with my comparison. That's ridiculous.


I hope this clears it up. Although. according to Wichita, if your critical of Cain as I have been, then it must be because he's "black". Yeah, he called me a racist. They did that with those critical of Obama too by the way......I guess that's just more similarity.

[This message has been edited by NickD3.4 (edited 10-24-2011).]

quote Originally posted by NickD3.4: I pretty much agree, but if you look at all the self contradictions Cain has made in the past 4 months, it's pretty hard to know where exactly he stands on issues. Just watch all these and tell me, do you know where he stands?.....I sure as hell don't. I'm looking for clarity and instead get mud.

X2

quote Originally posted by Doni Hagan: In terms of experience, no one who's ever held the job did it beforehand and you all already know our Constitution won't let us hire back former ones....two downs and out, so to speak.

Grover Cleveland.

quote Originally posted by Formula88: Thank you for clearing that up. It doesn't change my opinion of many of his supporters, but I didn't want to assume you meant something you didn't. For that I apologize.

No worries, I didn't think you mean anything negative.. no need to apologize, but thank you none the less for the civility.

[This message has been edited by NickD3.4 (edited 10-24-2011).]

quote Originally posted by Gridlock: I was kind of liking Cain-thought he was a little outside the establishment, and perhaps actually had a brain. Then he started going off about outlawing birth control, and gay marriage and the same **** that everyone else goes off about instead of talking about issues that matter: Re-building a pretty ruined country. Then I saw this: I get so tired of them having to be "hardcore conservative" enough to make it through the primary process. I get it! There ARE hardcore conservatives that get off on that stuff, but it just comes across to me as this issue that doesn't matter in the grand scheme, and they ALL do it. "I want to outlaw gay marriage" "Ok, I see that, and I want to repeal DADT(tell me, how do you push a 1000 queers back in the closet?) "I see that, and I want to ban abortion." "Yeah, I'll do that and more and I want to ban birth control!" "Oh yeah! I'm so conservative that I want to ban nighttime emissions! If you cum, it should be for the purpose of procreation!" And it just goes on, this sense of oneupmanship to the bottom. ALL WHILE SAYING THEY WANT SMALLER GOVERNMENT! Um, smaller government means less regulation, yeah? Not more.

The folks in the senate and congress who want to vote to extend the tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans and who want to raise taxes on the rest of use by not extending the payroll tax cut somehow can't see this wealth distribution as the biggest the world's seen since Communism.

Funny how that works. Since I'm pretty sure that nobody reading this or likely ever to read this is going to be in the receiving end of this wealth redistribution, I gotta ask, why are people want to vote for tax increases for themselves? Anyone who supports 999 supports raising taxes on literally almost Americans. I though they were against tax increases, especially in this down economy? We've been suffering for many, many years. I say, give us a break why don't ya? Please?

I look at this way. This world is screwed up because of politicians. Politicians that haven't a clue how to run a BUSINESS. and yes the U.S. is nothing but a business.
So ask youself this what has the politicians done for you latley? To me nothing but frack UP OUR LIVES AND OUR KIDS LIVES. I think a real person someone that is not a politician and someone that has scrubbed toilets and worked himself from poor to wealthy. ON HIS OWN SWEAT AND TEARS. WE need something that is really different not just change or more lies being told by a life long politicians.

quote Originally posted by Formula88: Grover Cleveland.

Oops....forgot about Cleveland....a DEMOCRAT no less.

My bad.

But you get my point, I think.

Here are some interesting views. I hope there was more to the converstation than what this video shows with his responses.

quote Originally posted by JazzMan: The folks in the senate and congress who want to vote to extend the tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans and who want to raise taxes on the rest of use by not extending the payroll tax cut somehow can't see this wealth distribution as the biggest the world's seen since Communism. Funny how that works. Since I'm pretty sure that nobody reading this or likely ever to read this is going to be in the receiving end of this wealth redistribution, I gotta ask, why are people want to vote for tax increases for themselves? Anyone who supports 999 supports raising taxes on literally almost Americans. I though they were against tax increases, especially in this down economy? We've been suffering for many, many years. I say, give us a break why don't ya? Please?

No! It's more like we have to pay our fair share. The Middle Class and lower Middle Class has been skimping on their fair share of taxes for decades, because politicians pander to the middle class for votes. Since the wealthiest people in America basically pay for almost half the tax revenue, it is time for the middle class to pay their fair share.

I'm sick and tired of everybody expecting a damn free ride for everything and yet stick it to the rich. The rich pay extremely disappointingly, which could be used for investment in the job market and the middle class needs to pony up some more. You expect a free country, fire, police, school teachers, roads, social security benefits, medicare, flood insurance, FEMA relief, your house to be bailed out, cash for your clunkers, government medical care and etc... but you don't want to pay for it. You want some rich bastard to pay for it.

Guess what? You can confiscate the entire wealth of ever person in America who is considered the top 5% and the government will still not have enough money to pay for everything. The only way this is going to be solved if the middle class and the lower middle class pay something.

If Cain's 999 plan will do that, then he has the best plan to save our country from financial insolvency then anybody out there who is just pandering to welfare politics.