This happened a week ago at work, so I'm just now calm enough to put this down in writting.

Here we go.....

All three shifts in the area that I work have been leaving the next shift in good shape and have been for some time. All of a sudden two whinners start complaining about being left in too good of shape . Now what I mean by that is, is that we assemble parts on a two man opperation and we've left the cooling rack a little ahead so that you don't have to "kill" yourself to catch up. You CAN still make your production numbers this way and it's been proven on numerous ocassions.

Our superivsor spoke with us over the night shift bringing it to his attention of why the rack was left so low due to the press not running at the same time. I told him I stayed over to get some parts out to make shipment. No big deal with him and he understood.

Now here's where things go south. I know the two that complained about it and I did a little diggin' of my own with the two complantants. One thinks he's been victomized by the company for the trouble that he's been in. The other is just a little worm that goes along with whatever the other says.

I sarcastically said the following day to them both if they had enough parts to make them happy. The worm didn't quite get the sarcasim, but when I said to the other it sparked a little feud. He started throwing things around and mumbling to the worm while lookin' at me. I just laughed while shakin' my head.

My friend and team mate walked by to get his roll-around (tools) to take to his press. He asked what was goin' on and I told him, so he proceded to calmly talk to him and explain how he should have come to us instead of takin' it straight to managment over something this petty.

The guy then raised his voice and started cursing at my team mate. Well, that didn't set well with him, so tempers flaired . My friend walked away twice as to not lose his job over this idiot. The guy just kept yelling at him, so he came back for another round of pissin'. My friend told him word for word......"do I need to take a vacation day to settle this because we both don't need to lose our jobs. I can take one if it's that important to you".

This whole incedent made it to our supervisor, so he started to interview everyone involved. We were told to not speek to eachother til he was finished ( so we couldn't match our stories). Well, this is when things go even further south. The third shift crew got to spend their entire night to get their "stories" straight before being interviewed .

Well, since it started with me I got 1 day off without pay, formal right-up, lost 1/3 of my bonus, lost my lead possition, lost my raise, and a years probation.

My friend got 3 days off without pay, no raise, 1/3 bonus taken, formal right-up, years probation, kicked off the team, and can not get into another altercation with ANYONE for the rest of his employment.

No crap or exaderation here, but both of us went in telling exactly what we said and how it happened as well as one other on our shift that was a witness.

Our superivsor let some of what was said in the interviews from the off shift and it was WAY off base. They said things that didn't happen as well as said things that weren't said. These guys had to be so convincing to fool management. The main one my friend had the altercation with was made out to be the "victim" in this whole thing.

And to think, I was going to apologize for getting this whole thing started, but due to total cowardly lies being said to incriminate my friend and I is unforgivable. He's been quoted sayin' "they just don't know how close they came to an a$$ whoopin'". WHATEVER ! BRING IT ! ! ! We're hoping to catch these two out sometime to settle the score.

What happened to integrity and honor that men have/had? Even if you're wrong you tell the truth ! They are the most spineless, useless human beings I've ever worked with. I don't and won't even call them men.

quote Originally posted by kyunderdawg: What happened to men of integrity?

You answered your own question; They got 1 day suspension without pay, formal right-up, lost 1/3 of thier bonus, lost thier lead possition, lost thier raise, and got a years probation.
Good guys finish last.
Sorry.
I didn't invent it, I just live it.

[This message has been edited by Boondawg (edited 06-09-2011).]

Quote:

"What happened to integrity and honor that men have/had?"

It was lost in the Garden when Adam committed treason against the Lord.

I'm not going to say anything about what your other two coworkers did or say since we don't have their side of the story.

I can tell you what it looks likes from management's perspective and why you two were disciplined.

1. It is management's job to handle disputes between employees. While it is nice that an employee take a gripe to an offending employee, it is not required and in some circumstances can make things worse.

2. The other two employees did exactly that with their beef with you and your team mate. In management's eyes, they did what they were supposed to do.

3. A manager has a talk with you and your teammate over #2. It gets cleared up so in management's eyes, it is a closed case.

4. You and your teammate then start an argument with the other two employees over an issue that was already settled. This is viewed as a form of workplace retaliation.

5. Your teammate issued a threat of violence towards another employee. A big no no. That can be grounds of termination on the spot in a lot of workplaces.

6. Generally, discipline is handed out behind closed doors and is not disclosed. I would not be surprised of the other two guys were given similar discipline.

I'm sorry the two of you got disciplined. But don't think it was just because the other crew lied about what happened. You two were going to get disciplined anyway.

quote Originally posted by Doug85GT:

I do see managements side and I admit to starting it, but whatever happened to having a spine and dealing with others instead of tuckin' tale?

Edit: I don't care for the punishment. Some of it is excessive IMO, but I am pissed that MY integrity is/was in question due to someone having no spine.

[This message has been edited by kyunderdawg (edited 06-09-2011).]

quote Originally posted by kyunderdawg: I do see managements side and I admit to starting it, but whatever happened to having a spine and dealing with others instead of tuckin' tale?

Integrity means inner strength. Not very many people have integrity.

When I was younger (not that I am that old), I used to be shocked and surprised when I saw acts of evil or a person taking the low road like what happened to you. I think that when we are young, we are predisposed to imagine the world is such a better place than it really is. Schools fill our heads with a lot of theoretical crap about how the world is supposed to be instead of how the world really is. Bad people far outnumber the good.

Now I am more shocked and surprised when I run across someone that does something good or shows those things you list: integrity, honor and respect. They are just rare.

I can count the number of my friends and family that have those virtues on one hand. It is kind of funny because I used to think that I had a lot of friends when I was younger. When the chips are down and you need help, you find out real quick who your real friends are. You also find out who you can trust and who you can't.

Go postal. Just don't take out any innocents, so you can face yourself tomorrow.

Is that good advice? No. But it's what I expect to do next time something like that happens to me. The world is full of assholes, and I won't regret taking out a few on my way out the door.

This was true in Roman times and I believe it to be true today. It is a short 25 minute video. I think it applies here:

The moral of the story is: Stay away from troublemakers. If someone wants to start something with you at work walk away. Go directly to your supervisor or management and report them. Making threats to others at work and fighting can get one fired and even arrested. Don't worry about the job performance of others, that is the supervisors job, if they are underperforming they will eventually get replaced. Management does not want drama happeing at work, they want work being done.

quote Originally posted by Boondawg: You answered your own question; They got 1 day suspension without pay, formal right-up, lost 1/3 of thier bonus, lost thier lead possition, lost thier raise, and got a years probation. Good guys finish last. Sorry. I didn't invent it, I just live it.

Listen to Boonie, he speaks the truth. Me? I'd just tell you to drink. Heavily. (joke)

[humor is a great way to deal with everyday life]

[This message has been edited by htexans1 (edited 06-10-2011).]

quote Originally posted by kyunderdawg: My friend and team mate walked by to get his roll-around (tools) to take to his press. He asked what was goin' on and I told him, so he proceded to calmly talk to him and explain how he should have come to us instead of takin' it straight to managment over something this petty.

Sounds like an episode from, "Car Warriors." Seriously, your friend almost made it out by walking away from the situation, but the continued taunting got the best of him. The situation might have been better if you had stopped your friend from reigniting the dispute. Money talks and so too are promotions and it appears nobody won here, but the company.

quote Originally posted by kyunderdawg: ... I got 1 day off without pay, formal right-up, lost 1/3 of my bonus, lost my lead possition, lost my raise, and a years probation. .

You need a different job bad. Thats some serious overkill punishment IMO for anyone involved.

quote Originally posted by Stubby79: Go postal. Just don't take out any innocents, so you can face yourself tomorrow. Is that good advice? No. But it's what I expect to do next time something like that happens to me. The world is full of assholes, and I won't regret taking out a few on my way out the door. .

The only thing we can honestly control is ourselves. Alot of how things turn out in the end for us has to do with how we respond to things, our decisions. The world is full of jerks I agree, best we can do is not be one.
Avoid troublemakers is good advice.
Sorry to hear about the tough times Kyunderdawg.

quote Originally posted by madcurl: Sounds like an episode from, "Car Warriors." Seriously, your friend almost made it out by walking away from the situation, but the continued taunting got the best of him. The situation might have been better if you had stopped your friend from reigniting the dispute. Money talks and so too are promotions and it appears nobody won here, but the company.

OK, I've got to ask, how did the company win, what did the company win? Inquiring minds want to know.

I'll agree that the company re-established some order to the work floor but, I'm having a hard time understanding what else they might have won.

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Ron

quote Originally posted by blackrams: OK, I've got to ask, how did the company win, what did the company win? Inquiring minds want to know.

No pay increases for all of those involved and no "sass" on the line.

quote Originally posted by madcurl: No pay increases for all of those involved and no "sass" on the line.

I can assure you, the small amount of payroll affected by this incident is miniscule compared to the crap associated with disgruntled employees. Nope, sorry but, the company didn't win squat here IMO. Having to referee situations like this is not something supervisors nor upper managagement want to have to deal with.

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Ron

[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 06-10-2011).]

quote Originally posted by blackrams: I can assure you, the small amount of payroll affected by this incident is miniscule compared to the crap associated with disgruntled employees. Nope, sorry but, the company didn't win squat here IMO. Having to referee situations like this is not something supervisors nor upper managagement want to have to deal with.

quote Originally posted by kyunderdawg: This happened a week ago at work, so I'm just now calm enough to put this down in writting. Here we go..... All three shifts in the area that I work have been leaving the next shift in good shape and have been for some time. All of a sudden two whinners start complaining about being left in too good of shape . Now what I mean by that is, is that we assemble parts on a two man opperation and we've left the cooling rack a little ahead so that you don't have to "kill" yourself to catch up. You CAN still make your production numbers this way and it's been proven on numerous ocassions. .

Although, you maybe correct, the production numbers (as was stated) must remain the same. If the production starts to slack-off-heads will roll. Many years ago I used to work for a chemical company and there was a certain quota that needed to be kept regardless if the employees didn't get along (usually 1,100 bags per shift).

Some people arrived drunk and/or on drugs, had sex on breaks, stole peoples lunch, blasted 70s music, and goof off. One of the operators was a cocaine addict and that dud was crazy man on the production line.

However, at the end of the shift-only the numbers counted. My boss (big #9-I called him engine, engine number nine) smoked the blunts during his rounds and didn't care one bit. Only the production numbers. Glad I continued my education because during the mid 80s plant closures was the big thing.

[This message has been edited by madcurl (edited 06-10-2011).]

I'd agree with your assessment for the most part. It's not the company's problem if you don't like your co-worker to a great extent unless that dislike gets in the way of why we're there. If such things happen, the company is frequently forced to get involved whether they like it or not because, the numbers do matter. You know as well as I do that companies do not exist to give folks jobs, they exist to make money. If production numbers drop to unacceptable levels, you can bet your bippy something is going to change.

Once, when I was a production manager, I had two employees that always seem to be on the outs with each other. One day, one of them threw a wad of paper at the other, this continued un-noticed by the supervisor until it escalated to the point that they were throwing hard objects at each other. At least this is what Union witnesses told me. Eventually, one of them got hit in the face and blood was drawn. That person immediately shouted FOUL and wanted the first guy fired.

One was a great employee, the other was not so much but, they both participated. They were both looking for other employment when they left my office. I understand what Paul was doing but, I can't say he did himself any favors. Direct confrontation isn't always the best ploy. There are other ways to get even.
Yes, during this incident, production numbers were greatly affected but, that was only part of the issue. Violence can not be tolerated in the work place. You (they) want to play, take it somewhere else.

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Ron

[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 06-10-2011).]

Yesterday I picked up the press behind the "victim" and his trainee. He stood there trying to intimidate me by standing at the foot of my press with his arms crossed and staring. He knows now what kind of trouble my friend and I got and is gloating. He's also going around letting everyone know just how close my friend and I were from getting our a$$'s whooped that day. Yeah, its hearsay, but I know how this guy is and it's believable because he's that cocky.

There's no point in getting management involved since we're made out to be the liars.

quote Originally posted by blackrams: Violence can not be tolerated in the work place.

Agreed.

quote Originally posted by blackrams: You (they) want to play, take it somewhere else.

I intend to.