Dear PFF,
I am writing this to let any members considering a career in the automotive field why they should NOT consider a WyoTech Degree. First the representatives will butter you up with promises of jobs, and lots of free Goodies. Next, the trip to Laramie and tour, where one will be flattered by inflated statistics, wordy expressions, and empty promises. I personally was promised a 30 student class size, caring instructors, and a 98% placement. Next there is the "Degree" unless one takes the shop management, known as ASM, elective you are awarded with an associate degree, which works well as toilet paper, and does not transfer to any college other than the other "Corinthian Colleges" in my case I am currently sitting in a class of 52 people, with an instructor that could give two ***** less about whether or not their students pass or fail. And then there is the idea of eagle tech. Eagle Tech is WyoTech's honor program; it is supposed to honor students who show excellence in grades, attendance, and leadership. This would make one think they wish for students to help each other out and work as a team, however this is directly the opposite. In my personal experience, I was put on academic probation for assisting a student when that student's computer broke. I was taken advantage of and the other student was caught cheating. We were both penalized by an instructor who is quitting their job. She is the sixth instructor to quit Wyotech in less than two months. As a result of her punishment, I was docked 5% of my overall grade, penalized by being placed on a "screw up again your expelled" probation, and my nomination for this honors program was pulled for good. I believe this punishment to be extremely harsh, border-lining on cruel and unusual. Of course my view point is biased based on direct interaction. As for the programs themselves, I have found that the success of the students is directly result of the ability of the instructor. I have found most of the instructor to be unfriendly, cold, and uncaring. It seems they could care less about the success of their students and more about upholding their "rules." Currently there are about a dozen students failing in my class alone, and about eight on some kind of probation. If I had the opportunity to do this again I'd take my $56,000 elsewhere to a school that cares about the success of its students and not about the bottom line of the almighty dollar. Again this is my personal opinion and in no way reflects that of Corinthian Colleges INC, nor WyoTech or its affiliates. Your results may vary.
Sincerely,
CW

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That is a bummer. I heard from a few people in my town that they liked WyoTech. They were not graduated yet so I don't know if they ever got a job from it but they said they were learning a lot and liked it.

I can't deny learning alot and I'm sure core programs may be different, but the ASM program is a Huge Joke and I won't even get into the "Technology Fees" and the prices of their IT and other stuff like that

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yes, gotta be careful with them "trade schools". most just specialize in getting a tiny pell grant & a large student loan - not in any kind of education. these places can be a shortcut vs college - but you really need alot of drive to make it a go.

Four_hundred_86- the same can be said of Universal Technical Institute.

Overpriced, false promises, etc etc.

I had one guy come to my house to try and get me to apply. He stated he gets no kickback form UTI for each student that signs on due to him- Caught dead in a lie there.
same BS about 98% placement etc.

I have 3 friends that went there and each dropped out due to them not actually learning anything that our Highschool shop class didnt teach them!

Add on top of that the fact that my Brother in law graduated from there and he can back up any false statement from the representatives.

"education first school" lol my ass. Paychecks paychecks first and foremost!

This is a school to learn how to turn a wrench and it costs $56,000 for how long?

Gee I guess all those years I spent under the hood really paid off.

Steve

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Technology is great when it works,
and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't.
Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.

Whoa. I must have missed that part. $56k for an associates degree is rediculous. I earned my 4 year degree in 2005 for about $30k.

The info above is false.

quote Originally posted by 87antuzzi: The info above is false.

Excellent.. care to elaborate?

quote Originally posted by Four_hundred_86: I'd take my $56,000 elsewhere to a school that cares about the success of its students and not about the bottom line of the almighty dollar. Again this is my personal opinion and in no way reflects that of Corinthian Colleges INC, nor WyoTech or its affiliates. Your results may vary. Sincerely, CW

For 56k I'd rather go into nursing. Yeah, it takes 4-yrs, but at least there's a demand.

It is actually 35K for the associates IF you take ASM and a Core. I have ASM, collision, and Street rod/ custom FAB while I do not know my Exact loan amount, I have the standard 35K + a 16K living stipend there is 51K right there plus whatever street rod would cost

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quote Originally posted by Four_hundred_86: First the representatives will butter you up with promises of jobs, and lots of free Goodies. Next, the trip to Laramie and tour, where one will be flattered by inflated statistics, wordy expressions, and empty promises.

Well of cousre they do, they are a business and their business model requires them to 'recruit' more students all the time. They are really no different then any other 'college'.

quote Originally posted by datacop: Excellent.. care to elaborate?

Why not. Back in the day (like 3 or 4 years ago) wyo tec went through our schools and gave us a bunch of free crap. They also offered to a select group of people to go to their schools for nothing. I was in the group along with a friend. I went for a little while then got a job in san fransciso and quit going to school like a dumbass. My buddie stayed and got ASE and ICAR and now makes good money. From everyone i know who went through wyotec now makes decent money and was not out 56k like what was said. The most paid was like 15k. So many people I know who did the program are happy that they did. Im not going to get into to much detail but yea. It sounds like the people who went through it and got screwed were just being lazy. No one is gonna place you in a job. You gotta get out and look for it.

Kris, you were right, and I said the statement was merely my opinion. As for the prices, the schools price has gone up considerably especially since CCI's takeover about three to five years ago. As for the school, I have been learning a lot, I just mainly meant to state that for what I was promised I was severely let down. Honestly I was quite a bit angry when I wrote this post, and for my trash I apologize. However, I am still not happy with some aspects of the school. The education is good, but it is much like any other college, over promise, under deliver. Things might get better, and I am sorry for the argument I started.

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You mean the reality doesn't always mirror the marketing? What a surprise!
You mean to tell me the instructor expects you to learn on your own? Oh, the horror!

Quit bitching, suck it up, and learn what you're there to learn. If it sucks that bad, drop out and go somewhere else.
College (or anything past High School) doesn't care if you pass or fail. They'll offer knowledge, but it's up to you to learn it. They won't hold your hand and spoon feed you.

Real life is just the same. Get used to it. Life is what you make of it, and no one but yourself gives a rat's butt if you pass or fail in life.

(You're probably pissed off reading that, and think I'm trolling you. but if you get past the emotion, you'll realize this is some of the best advice you'll ever get - seriously.)

[This message has been edited by Formula88 (edited 12-17-2010).]

Sorry to hear it man...but its not like ùi never heard it before...ùhell, ùi went to one of those professinal flight accademies that promised I would be driving a 727 out of Dubi within 2 years....

I did get to sleep with a stew based in dubi....and learned how to throw myself at the ground and miss in twin-motor-fligating-machines...

And mostly learned that ALL salesmen are POSès....no matter what they are selling, they are all the same lying trash.

Much of what you described was a mirror of my experience with Spartan School of Aeronautics here in Tulsa. Overpriced yet underfunded (meaning crappy classrooms and equipment with no indication that the high tuition is actually making back into the school). Lots of lofty promises with little follow through.

On the other hand, Spartan was the reason I moved to OK from CA and my life has been better for that move.

How about the fact that I'm paying $5k a year for two years to get the exact same knowledge and opportunity?

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If you can earn ASE certification you should be alright. Many of the repair shops I looked at were looking to hire ASE techs. They like to hang the employee's ASE certifications on the wall behind the customer counter. I did notice that some shops had expired certifications. I guess you have to keep your certification current somehow, so be prepared to keep paying and training.

[This message has been edited by avengador1 (edited 12-17-2010).]

Sounds EXACTLY like my experience at Michigan Tech. Money 1st and foremost, education... what, 98th?

$56k though, wow, I only wasted $36,000 on my Engineering degree. I know a guy who went to Wyotech, he's now earning just above minimum wage at Auto Zone.

For Profit Learning Institutions are very popular right now since unemployeement is so high. Stay home from work and watch the commercials making all kinds of promises. Recently students from a local popular Art Institute testified in DC about being promised all kinds of eduations and placements. What they found was the school was inflating statistics to attract students. Employees testified also, saying graduates working for a toy store were described as "Toy Design & Marketeers". These schools unlike a university are corporate run, and run like a business. Despite being very expensive a college education is still worth the money. Once you have it you have it forever and no one can take it away from you.

Our local public community college (Johnson County Community College) has excellent automotive, welding, and industrial technology programs that are fully accredited ... and tuition for a full load of classes will still be less than $4000 a year. If you successfully complete their two-year Railroad Welding program, you are guaranteed a job with the BNSF railroad upon graduation (the college does all of BNSF's welding training under contract) ... at a starting wage of at least $19 an hour.

Accreditation of any college program is vitally important. What you must insist upon is called "Regional Accreditation" ... as opposed to the better sounding but effectively bogus "National Accreditation" advertised by many shady trade schools and private "colleges." (I have even seen some fly-by-night schools proudly proclaiming that they are "unaccredited.") Regional accreditation means that your degree may actually mean something after you graduate, and that at least some of your credits will be transferable to a four-year college if you choose to go that route.

CW,

I won't get into specifics but can add some experience you might find interesting. I got called to fill-in as an instructor at a "career college" when one of their instructors left them high and dry 2 weeks before the start of a term. This Was Not a place like WyoTech.

They gave me a contract for $35 / hr. with 1 hour of class time and 3 hours of prep time per week. OK with me since I really had nothing to do for that time anyway but $140 a week in Los Angeles barely buys you gas and lunch every day. After I got started, I discovered they had generic corporate lesson plans that didn't match the textbook, thrown-together student hand-outs and no exams. I immediately scheduled a meeting with the Assistant Dean (my boss), showed him what I was trying to work with and explained the situation. He said he would discuss it with the Dean and get back to me. meantime, days passed and the term started. Everytime I wanted to meet with the Asst Dean, I had to schedule it which wasted more days. I worked the minimum extra required to get through the class, and ended up meeting with the Dean myself. She approved a few more hours and said she would continue to approve the extra hours as she could. Yeah. The check was in the mail.

i don't work for free. Some of you might find this unbelievable, but I held my temper through their attempts to pressure me to do so. Their game quickly became clear to me and I just saw it as another scam. I talked at length to one of the other instructors that had been there a while. Turns out that there had been 3 other instructors for the class i was teaching, everyone had similar problems with the admin and left. This explained the call to me with such short notice when the last guy just walked out and never came back.

My opinion is that this place solicited students that had no real plans or needed direction; these students had not been academically prepped for a 4-year college, so good marketing resulted in the term "career college". They promised them whatever they had to to get them motivated - good paying future job with good benefits, impressive title, "personalized care", etc. The students then get loans and grants and whatever assistance they need to feed the "college". The institution then has frequent meetings, awards celebrations, honor lists, and schmoozes the students while paying out as little as possible. Paying the instructors was the last thing they wanted to do. They didn't give a damn about the quality of what was taught - they only wanted to have someone "put on the show" and keep the students reasonably satisfied while keeping the process moving students through their system.

There were some smart and well-behaved students in my class. Unfortunately, a lot of them didn't have the pre-requisite knowledge for the subject and some were sunk from the first day. Luckily only a few had a "i paid my money, now make me learn this junk" attitude.

I have no experience with the automotive-type places, but this opened my eyes to "career colleges" {although i hope they are all not like the one i was at}. Definitely a business more than a learning institution.

[This message has been edited by PaulJK (edited 12-18-2010).]

sounds like you are upset in the service you are receiving.

A lot of people will tell you to suck it up, yet it is not their money. You were given false promises, and have every right to be upset.

do yourself a favor and find the pros and cons in staying at that school. There are other options, like going to a community college, majorng in automotive/mechanical engineering or something.

imho, community colleges are a good start.
good luck!

There is a two year RN degree.

quote Originally posted by madcurl: For 56k I'd rather go into nursing. Yeah, it takes 4-yrs, but at least there's a demand.

quote Originally posted by Doug85GT: That is a bummer. I heard from a few people in my town that they liked WyoTech. They were not graduated yet so I don't know if they ever got a job from it but they said they were learning a lot and liked it.

The difference is location. I have done work in our Wyotech schools and eavesdropped on the classes and can say that I have never seen such a group of dedicated people towards the students. California is quite a bit different than the rest of the U.S and Wyotech really seems to give a damn about their students out here. Most of the other smaller States hire any bum off the street to run the classes hence the "give a crap less" attitude.

[This message has been edited by IMSA GT (edited 12-18-2010).]

quote Originally posted by Formula88: You mean the reality doesn't always mirror the marketing? What a surprise! You mean to tell me the instructor expects you to learn on your own? Oh, the horror! Quit bitching, suck it up, and learn what you're there to learn. If it sucks that bad, drop out and go somewhere else. College (or anything past High School) doesn't care if you pass or fail. They'll offer knowledge, but it's up to you to learn it. They won't hold your hand and spoon feed you. Real life is just the same. Get used to it. Life is what you make of it, and no one but yourself gives a rat's butt if you pass or fail in life. (You're probably pissed off reading that, and think I'm trolling you. but if you get past the emotion, you'll realize this is some of the best advice you'll ever get - seriously.)

I agree 110% on this.

I started the automotive program at ISU back in 04'... it was a great program, the instructors were passionate about what they taught, they took the time to explain and teach you, but if you were to dumb/lazy they wouldn't waste their time.

Finding a job should, in my opinion, never be up to the school. If you are too damn lazy to put forth the effort to apply yourself to the profession, good riddance.

As far as Wyotech, around these parts it is thought of as somewhat a joke, 80% of the people that come from that schooling usually fail, the other 20% have to have a hell of a drive and determination to learn **** their school failed at. At my work (dealership) I think there is only one person that came out of wyotech and he only survived because he took other schooling after leaving wyotech.

Good luck, be prepared to work your ass off and never give up learning new stuff.

quote Originally posted by avengador1: (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste Bunny into your (")_(") signature to help him gain world domination. If you can earn ASE certification you should be alright. Many of the repair shops I looked at were looking to hire ASE techs. They like to hang the employee's ASE certifications on the wall behind the customer counter. I did notice that some shops had expired certifications. I guess you have to keep your certification current somehow, so be prepared to keep paying and training.

I did not earn my ASE Certifications, paid about $100 to take around 4 tests get 70% or better on easy questions. I think almost anyone can pass them with the help of a test guide. The kinds of questions are ether, Tech A says a clogged cat will cause a bad running vehicle, Tech B says a clogged cat will cause poor fuel mileage. The answers are a. tech one is right, b. tech b is right, c. both are right, c. nither is right. Or you will be given a question and have two stupid answers and one that looks a lot like a trick answer so a good guesser with a little auto back ground will have a fighting chance.

quote Originally posted by Kekipi: I did not earn my ASE Certifications, paid about $100 to take around 4 tests get 70% or better on easy questions.

I agree with you that the ASE certification tests are pretty basic, but unfortunately there are a lot of guys out there who simply can't pass them. Given the choice, and assuming you are a mechanically naive car owner, who would you prefer to have working on your car ... somebody who has passed a simple certification test or somebody who could never pass it? ... somebody who was motivated enough to prepare for and take the test, or somebody who wasn't?

FWIW ... as a pilot I feel the same way about the FAA written exams, except that they are mandatory and they aren't so easy. Does it make you feel more or less secure to know that the pilot on your next airline flight could have scored as low as 70% on all of his written exams and still passed? Many years ago I knew a young guy who did an excellent job taking off, landing, and maneuvering the airplane, but he could not pass the FAA Private Pilot's written exam; in fact, he could not reliably perform even the simplest arithmetic calculations needed to assure the safety of a flight (e.g. weight and balance, speed and distance, fuel requirements, etc.). Today he would probably be identified as learning impaired. It was sad, but he could never obtain his license, and we are all safer because of it.

[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 12-18-2010).]

quote Many years ago I knew a young guy who did an excellent job taking off, landing,..

That's all I really care about anyway--especially the landing part. While it would be nice if he manuevered our way to the appropriate destination, it comes in way behind................. landing. I don't really care if we only fly 1000 yards--or overshoot the destination 1000 miles--as long as he can land.

ASE certs are kind of like A+ in the IT world. It doesn't mean you're some guru, but NOT having one (or being able to get one) means you have NO BUSINESS trying to do the work.

quote Originally posted by maryjane: I don't really care if we only fly 1000 yards--or overshoot the destination 1000 miles--as long as he can land.

I prefer to land 1) safely, and 2) somewhere near the intended destination. Extra points if you can use the plane again, too.

[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 12-18-2010).]

quote Originally posted by hnthomps: There is a two year RN degree.

True. If you have the needed prerequisites that are transferable its two years, but normally, its 18-months for a LVN, but many (if they have a spouse or family support) continue onward to become a RN. Start to finish it’s about 4-years if you start early out of high school with specific courses.

quote Originally posted by Nebiros88: Finding a job should, in my opinion, never be up to the school. If you are too damn lazy to put forth the effort to apply yourself to the profession, good riddance.

That might be true sometimes, but when un-employment is 10% nationwide and 12%+ locally (and HAS been for the last few YEARS), "lazy" may very well have nothing to do with it. According to a local paper today (San Gabriel Valley Tribune), we're at 12.9 %. I'd hate to have to be looking for an automotive job in Michigan.

[This message has been edited by PaulJK (edited 12-18-2010).]

quote Originally posted by Marvin McInnis: Our local public community college (Johnson County Community College) has excellent automotive, welding, and industrial technology programs that are fully accredited ... and tuition for a full load of classes will still be less than $4000 a year. If you successfully complete their two-year Railroad Welding program, you are guaranteed a job with the BNSF railroad upon graduation (the college does all of BNSF's welding training under contract) ... at a starting wage of at least $19 an hour. Accreditation of any college program is vitally important. What you must insist upon is called "Regional Accreditation" ... as opposed to the better sounding but effectively bogus "National Accreditation" advertised by many shady trade schools and private "colleges." (I have even seen some fly-by-night schools proudly proclaiming that they are "unaccredited.") Regional accreditation means that your degree may actually mean something after you graduate, and that at least some of your credits will be transferable to a four-year college if you choose to go that route.

That is what I love about Kansas. We have excellent "National Accredited" Technical schools that are public and it cost very little to go to. I went through Aircraft Instrument Technician School and was interned during school and had the job the day I graduated. Cost only $1000 for the 1-year program.

Same with A&P school. Why would anybody go to a private one and pay tremendous amounts of money, when you can go to a public one for the fraction of the cost with better facilities, training and a job waiting for you.

I'm surprised how much WyoTech went up in price. I had thought of going there after high school *going on 10 years ago now* and it seemed like the price was about $19K.