I am thinking about acquiring one soon... I love fieros. However, this car appeals to me too.

What are your guys's take on toronados? are there custom/aftermarket stuff for these old cars? Nothing ricey, just upgrades here n there..
http://modules.dealercarsea...0&bgColor=000000 i like this one.
Just how big is the car ? I LOVE the Cadillac Sixteen concept...

Land-yacht...........I love them!
I think they are thexy!

[This message has been edited by Boondawg (edited 12-08-2010).]

I've always loved the early Toros. The drivetrains on those things are built like tanks but be forewarned...they drink gas like crazy!! My dad had a 67 Eldorado that was essentially the same car....just styled differently.

Enjoy!

I would love to have one of those. When I was a kid, I thought they were among the coolest cars around.
They handle funny though. The motor sits high and forward, and it will pull oddly when accelerating with the wheels turned.
They are an icon of an America long since past.

Twilight Fenrir had quite a posting on them....

https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum6/HTML/073250.html

Back in 1967, there were four custom Toronados designed and built by George Barris called the 67X. They were given away as part of a promotion celebrating Canada's centennial that year. You can read about them and see more pictures Here.



There was one on eBay a while ago. More pictures and history Here.

They are cool. Jay Leno has one with like 1000 hp. Make sure its got a good rear window. Those are weird 3 pieces molded into one that wraps around and theyre very expensive.

quote Originally posted by ghost187x: I am thinking about acquiring one soon... I love fieros. However, this car appeals to me too. What are your guys's take on toronados? are there custom/aftermarket stuff for these old cars? Nothing ricey, just upgrades here n there.. http://modules.dealercarsea...0&bgColor=000000 i like this one. Just how big is the car ? I LOVE the Cadillac Sixteen concept...

Well, the hood scoop destroyed the car as far as I'm concerned.

The Oldsmobile Toronado back then was the flagship vehicle of Oldsmobile. It had all the technology and features that were available in the marketplace today. It was their premier luxury model for the Oldsmobile line.

Part of the advanced technology that the car came with (for 66-68 I believe) was a feature called the "Switch Pitch." It was a variable stator torque converter. This meant that at the flick of a button, the torque converter would automatically change it's stall speed. I'm just throwing out numbers here (but I'm fairly close). The stall speed under normal cruising would be something like 1,600 rpms, but then when you smashed down on the pedal, it would engage a button at the back of the gas pedal. This button enabled the transmission downshift selector, as well as the "SWP" feature. The torque converter stators would then pneumatically change to something like 3,800 stall speed, and the car would burn rubber like no one's business.

I believe they were offered with a limited slip differential as well... or maybe THAT part was aftermarket. Anyway, the Switch Pitch functionality was dead reliable... you could NOT break it. The reason GM discontinued it was because it was so ridiculously expensive to make, and most people didn't know or care at the time. Those transmissions are pretty sought after (those who actually know about them). There are companies that still make the replacement torque converters for them as well. It has an entirely different pump assembly too.

Anyway... all Toronados came with the top engine available for that year. I think 67 would probably have come with a 425 cubic inch Olds big block. That would have come with forged rods, and a nodular crank. It's not as big as the 455, but it was a very durable motor... all Oldsmobile engines were rock solid back then, and all Olds big blocks came with forged rods from the factory. Oldsmobile torque / technology during the time peaked in 1969... although there was little difference from 67-69 except displacement. 68 saw the first year for the 455 in those cars (pretty sure).


This is my 1969 Olds 455 big block that originally came from a 1969 "full size" Oldsmobile Delta-98 Royal Sedan. The motor in that car was essentially the EXACT same one offered in the 1968 Hurst / Olds and the 1969 Olds 442. The only diffference between them was the camshaft profile (one was for performance, the other for cruising) and the size of the valves. The GOOD thing is that the cyl heads are identical... meaning that the port sizes are actually the same. The Delta-98 full size got the same massive ports as what came on the Hurst / Olds... except that the valves (and valve sizes) installed were smaller on the sedan.

I took my engine, had it completely rebuilt... I installed a Joe Mondello 2030 roller cam with roller lifters (more aggressive profile than the 68 Hurst / Olds cam, but still totally streetable, and with a relaxed exhaust, could easily go in a full sized sedan and be civilized). I had the forged rods shot-peened and selected from a set of 16 (although they were all quite good since most of those motors were basically hand built back then anyway). I got a set of NOS .030 TRW forged pistons, hardened pushrods, Crand Gold full roller fulcrum roller rockers, a set of stainless steel 2.07:1 intake valves (larger than what came stock on the Hurst / Olds) and 1.72 exhaust valves on my "C" heads with a port and polish of the exhaust and intake ports. I used an Oldsmobile HO Toronado "K" intake, roller timing chain, and an Toronado HO Rochester QuadraJet for awesome streetability. It also has a high volume oil pump, crank scraper, roller timing chain, and all that other mumbo jumbo. I bought some chrome valve covers, and then ordered OER wire looms from the 50s Oldsmobile small block and tack-welded some stainless bolts upside down to the top of the valve covers. I then used acorn nuts to affix them. The engine now looks like the original mid-50s style Oldsmobile engine that was offered back then. I'm not really a fan of LOTS of chrome, so those valve covers will basically be it for chrome. Everything else will be black (that I haven't added yet).

I've never even broken it in. I don't have anything to put it in.




EDIT: To say that I got lucky because the 455 big block I have was ACTUALLY a 1968 casting. Meaning that it was basically made in 1968 (it's an F1 block), so it had the highest level of nickle content offered through any of the years... 1968-1976 (and 1978). It made it into this Delta-98 because it was a left-over from the previous year and this was an early 69 model. All the casting information on the block shows it as being a late 68 block, but the VIN information decodes as a 1969 Delta 98.

I've been hanging onto this engine because I just don't want to get rid of it. I'm in a time in my life where I really can't afford to have too many project / hobby cars... but this engine is so awesome that they just don't come around like this. Certainly, I could buy any old Olds 455 big block from the early 70s for fairly cheap, and I could probably buy some aftermarket heads and make just as much, if not more power... but this particular engine is quite rare, and it's a quality block.


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Todd,
2008 Jeep Patriot Limited 4x2
2002 Ford Explorer Sport 2dr 4x2
2002 Ford Crown Victoria LX
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6
1973 Volkswagen Type-2 Transporter

[This message has been edited by 82-T/A [At Work] (edited 12-09-2010).]

It is .just ok. Just don't ruin it like you did your Fiero! (but you probally will. )

Interesting info on the torque converter. I had 50s Buicks with Dynaflow transmissions that sounds sort of similar. The stators gradually changed pitch as you sped up so it never 'changed' gears at all. One smooth transition from start to top speed. Think of it as a constantly variable gear ratio. Theyre awesome when the worked right and a nitemare when the didnt. I think in 58 or 59 they done away with it and went to hydramatic.

I like what they did with the valve covers/ spark plug wires. Similar to old original Chrysler Hemi.

[This message has been edited by rogergarrison (edited 12-09-2010).]

quote Originally posted by rogergarrison: Interesting info on the torque converter. I had 50s Buicks with Dynaflow transmissions that sounds sort of similar. The stators gradually changed pitch as you sped up so it never 'changed' gears at all. One smooth transition from start to top speed. Think of it as a constantly variable gear ratio. Theyre awesome when the worked right and a nitemare when the didnt. I think in 58 or 59 they done away with it and went to hydramatic. I like what they did with the valve covers/ spark plug wires. Similar to old original Chrysler Hemi.

Thanks, the Olds big blocks never came like that. I just took some parts from the mid-50s small block Oldsmobile motors and did some minor fabrication to make it work on big block valve covers. The only thing is, I no longer have a functional breather element on it, so I'm going to have to figure out what to do there now.. hah... I might drill a hole somewhere and add a PCV filter / valve there.... I just don't know if I'll have the room because the roller rockers are MASSIVE under there.

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Todd,
2008 Jeep Patriot Limited 4x2
2002 Ford Explorer Sport 2dr 4x2
2002 Ford Crown Victoria LX
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6
1973 Volkswagen Type-2 Transporter

Maybe put a pvc valve hole at the end or on the side ? Or just not run one at all. I had lots of old engines that just had a breather tube from somewhere in the block and even out of the side of the oilpan above the oil level.

I kind of like the scoop. I think it has lines that compliment the car, and I notice is is a functional scoop,and a shaker.

I wonder if the pop-up lights need a fix though.

If the price is good it would be a real nice one to own.



Arn

quote Originally posted by rogergarrison: Maybe put a pvc valve hole at the end or on the side ? Or just not run one at all. I had lots of old engines that just had a breather tube from somewhere in the block and even out of the side of the oilpan above the oil level.

Well, the point of the PCV is to help extract blow-by, right? (I'm asking, not saying...)

If I just had a breather, then I guess that probably wouldn't happen then. I've seen in-line PCVs... so all I really need I suppose is a small hole. I'm not really sure what the fitment is either, so if I was going to put it at the back, what would it hit if I later installed it in something that was tight (like a Toronado)...

I'm so tempted to sell this, but I'm also so tempted to keep it.. ugh...

of course, if I sold it, it would pay for an Edelbrock E-Force SuperCharger for my 2002 Crown Victoria LX... which would be awesome. It already runs nearly a flat 15 in the quarter... add another 100hp and I'd probably be in the high 13s... and on something that has a leather bench seat and white-walled tires...

quote Originally posted by Arns85GT: I kind of like the scoop. I think it has lines that compliment the car, and I notice is is a functional scoop,and a shaker. I wonder if the pop-up lights need a fix though. If the price is good it would be a real nice one to own. Arn

To each their own I suppose... the way I see it, it's better like that, than left stock and possibly rotting in someone's back yard. :/

I'm just kind of a stock guy, for the MOST part. I like for things, even when modified, to look like they came that way from the factory. But if everyone was just like 82-T/A [At Work], then life would be pretty boring. Everyone would automatically agree with me, there would be no arguing, and there would be a limited supply of athletic 5'7" blond girls that nag and like to spend. There'd also be a very limited supply of Fieros I would guess too...


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Todd,
2008 Jeep Patriot Limited 4x2
2002 Ford Explorer Sport 2dr 4x2
2002 Ford Crown Victoria LX
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6
1973 Volkswagen Type-2 Transporter

[This message has been edited by 82-T/A [At Work] (edited 12-09-2010).]

The one with the window I mentioned must be the next generation, since this one obviously still has a flat rear glass.

this one...

[This message has been edited by rogergarrison (edited 12-09-2010).]

quote Originally posted by rogergarrison: The one with the window I mentioned must be the next generation, since this one obviously still has a flat rear glass. this one...

Yeah, Rog...that's a '72 I think. I remember that the back glass on those cost a FORTUNE to replace....like the ones on the "boattail" Rivieras..... and are probably a PITA to source out nowadays. Occasionally, you see one listed on Hemming's site in mint condition.

i really want one. i would like to see on in person. I never seen these in real life.
I live in texas and i found one on craigslist for sale for pretty cheap. however, there has to be rust everywhere. It needs a really big paint job too.

I loved that first generation Toronado. But, it was a heavy car, so all performance parameters suffered.

If you do get one whatever you do DO NOT GET RADIAL TIRES!!!!
there is a fault that the entire front end will shake if they are installed.

Dont ask me why it does but having been in two seperate toros and having heard from many other owners to avoid Radials im passing the info on to you for your safety!

My father bought a 68 Toronado new. What a cool car. It was the first year for the 455. Also the first year the styling had a mild update. The hide a way headlights moved into a honeycomb grill inside the new front bumper design. It sort of had the look of a big 1970 Fierbird. I remember my father would smoke the tires, and rubber smoke would come out between the hood and fenders. They also had a cool dash with the speedo needle being fixed and the numbers on a rotating drum. On the fuel cap I remember it said "Use 100+ Octane". Try and find that now......

The "Switch Pitch" transmsission is also a neat piece. I have a built Buick Switch Pitch Turbo 400 behind the Pontiac 428-HO I installed in my 69 GTO convertible. My high stall is about 2800 rpm and the low stall is about 1000 rpm. I can load the convertor in high stall against the brake, and then let it drop into low stall and the tires just light up sitting at a dead stop. It's really good for intimidating the ricer kids.

[This message has been edited by Rick 88 (edited 12-09-2010).]

I think the Toronado looks great but it is still front wheel drive. I just can't do front wheel drive. A guy I used to work with lived with a Toro-nut. He had a beautiful 455 powered one that would smoke the tires any time. But it was front wheel drive...

I've wanted a ~1964 Riviera for years. Thats what I would go with if I wanted a luxury liner with some muscle....

quote Originally posted by TommyRocker: .....if I wanted a luxury liner with some muscle....

Don't forget Pontiac's contender in this class: a GTO in a Tuxedo


(my '70 Grand Prix)

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quote Originally posted by Rick 88: The "Switch Pitch" transmsission is also a neat piece. I have a built Buick Switch Pitch Turbo 400 behind the Pontiac 428-HO I installed in my 69 GTO convertible. My high stall is about 2800 rpm and the low stall is about 1000 rpm. I can load the convertor in high stall against the brake, and then let it drop into low stall and the tires just light up sitting at a dead stop. It's really good for intimidating the ricer kids.

I can picture this, but you oughta get a video.
I've never heard of such a feature for a transmission, sounds pretty neat. I love learning something new everyday I read this forum.