http://www.freep.com/articl...-for-clunkers-basher

quote The consumer automotive Web site Edmunds.com is being criticized by the White House, as well the nation’s largest car dealer, for bias because of its analysis of the federal cash-for-clunkers program earlier this year. Edmunds has been critical of the program, saying many of the vehicles would have been bought anyway and estimating that U.S. taxpayers spent about $24,000 for each sale spurred by the incentives. It accused the White House, which defended the effectiveness of the program, of “shooting the messenger.” But Mike Jackson, CEO of AutoNation, also defended the program. Of Edmunds, he said: “Simply put, they’ve misrepresented the facts, and the White House is completely justified in calling them out on it. It would appear that their political views have tainted their usual rigorous approach to research."

Edmuds' Report:

quote SANTA MONICA, Calif.--(Business Wire)-- Edmunds.com, the premier resource for online automotive information, has determined that Cash for Clunkers cost taxpayers $24,000 per vehicle sold. Nearly 690,000 vehicles were sold during the Cash for Clunkers program, officially known as CARS, but Edmunds.com analysts calculated that only 125,000 of the sales were incremental. The rest of the sales would have happened anyway, regardless of the existence of the program. Ironically, the average transaction price for a new vehicle in August 2009 was only $26,915 minus an average cash rebate of $1,667. "This analysis is valuable for two reasons," explained Edmunds.com CEO Jeremy Anwyl. "First, it can form the basis for a complete assessment of the program`s impact and costs. Second-and more important-it can help us to understand the true state of auto sales and the economy. For example, October sales are up, but without Cash for Clunkers, sales would have been even better. This suggests that the industry`s recovery is gaining momentum." The chart below sets forth actual SAAR (Seasonally Adjusted Annual Rate) compared to Edmunds.com`s forecasted rate if the program had never been implemented. Actual If no Cash for Clunkers Difference Sales Volume (or Forecast) Jan `09 9.59 9.59 n/a 654,922 Feb `09 9.14 9.14 n/a 687,182 Mar `09 9.69 9.69 n/a 855,146 April `09 9.20 9.20 n/a 817,096 May `09 9.85 9.85 n/a 923,141 Jun `09 9.67 9.80 -0.13 857,447 Jul `09 11.22 10.11 1.11 995,216 Aug `09 14.06 10.45 3.61 1,258,747 Sep `09 9.19 10.63 -1.44 744,367 Oct `09 10.40 10.89 -0.49 n/a Nov `09 10.40 10.82 -0.42 n/a Dec `09 10.61 10.85 -0.24 n/a "Our research indicates that without the Cash for Clunkers program, many customers would not have traded in an old vehicle when making a new purchase," Edmunds.com Senior Analyst David Tompkins, PhD told AutoObserver.com. "That may give some credence to the environmental claims, but unfortunately the economic claims have been rendered quite weak." To conduct the analysis, the Edmunds.com team of PhDs and statisticians examined the sales trend for luxury vehicles and others not included in Cash for Clunkers, and applied the historic relationship of those vehicles to total SAAR to make informed estimates. These estimates were independently verified through careful examination of sales patterns reflected by transaction data. Once the numbers were determined, Edmunds.com`s analysts divided three billion dollars by 125,000 vehicles to arrive at the average $24,000 per vehicle. Coincidentally, a parallel analysis of the first-time homebuyer credit was reported yesterday by MIT Sloan Professor Simon Johnson and Yale law student James Kwak, who both blog about economics at The BaseLine Scenario.

http://www.reuters.com/arti...-Oct-2009+BW20091028

[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 10-29-2009).]

While their forcasts may be pure speculation, I have no doubt that the program was full of waste.

How dare you edmunds, now bow down and maybe I won't tax you into submission.

Hey Don, while you're on the freep site check out the Kwame stories today. Texas can have him back anytime now !!

I would opine that CFC did far more damage for the car companies, in that while they had a temporary increase in sales, they reduced the demand for future sales in the months ahead. Hopefully the manufactures won't use sales figures from CFC to anticipate demand the next year, and thus increase production and inventory.

I have discovered undeniable proof that the program was not worth is.
Was in a yard last week and there was an 85 SE V-6 with 40k that was turned in and the engine destroyed.
It was a one owner non smoking lady who owned it, and it was as clean as any Fiero I have ever seen.
The whole interior now sits in my garage and I get sick every time I look at it.
Of course it had an Obama 08 bumper sticker on it.

Mike Jackson also supports higher taxes on gasoline and his company benefited from the C4C because they moved cars from his inventory.

Hmmm..... I wouldn't trust him either.

Trying to make heads or tails out of that report is just too complicated for a math major retard like me.
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Where is RayB when I really need him?

Just another organization making the Obama enemies list. He dissed the Chamber, one of the big political doners and many others. George Soros and his ilk will need to put more of their money into the democratic party to keep the Obama machine well lubricated.

quote Originally posted by partfiero: I have discovered undeniable proof that the program was not worth is. Was in a yard last week and there was an 85 SE V-6 with 40k that was turned in and the engine destroyed. It was a one owner non smoking lady who owned it, and it was as clean as any Fiero I have ever seen. The whole interior now sits in my garage and I get sick every time I look at it. Of course it had an Obama 08 bumper sticker on it.

quote Originally posted by partfiero: Wow. Talk about symbolic! 1. Ruin a perfectly good car 2. Get rid of a car you own, and probably have a car loan 3. Brought to you by Obama [quote]Where is RayB when I really need him?

You won't hear from him on this, because it wasn't a Republican doing it. Perhaps I can fill in for him?

CforC voodoo didnt do anything moved existing sales typical BIGLIE reaganomics

quote Originally posted by partfiero: I have discovered undeniable proof that the program was not worth is. Was in a yard last week and there was an 85 SE V-6 with 40k that was turned in and the engine destroyed. It was a one owner non smoking lady who owned it, and it was as clean as any Fiero I have ever seen. The whole interior now sits in my garage and I get sick every time I look at it. Of course it had an Obama 08 bumper sticker on it.

Sorry, but I call BS. No Fiero was eligible for C4C.

quote Originally posted by Zeb: Sorry, but I call BS. No Fiero was eligible for C4C.

I believe V6 autos were, with an EPA rating of 19mpg.

quote Originally posted by fierobear: I believe V6 autos were, with an EPA rating of 19mpg.

It was 18 MPG and it was the 1985 V6 Auto tranny.

J.

quote Originally posted by fierobear: You won't hear from him on this, because it wasn't a Republican doing it. Perhaps I can fill in for him? CforC voodoo didnt do anything moved existing sales typical BIGLIE reaganomics

you forgot
the
sporadic use of
the return
button

NEO CONNED

Bush2

The big lie

Voodoo

Ronny Raygun

quote Originally posted by Zeb: Sorry, but I call BS. No Fiero was eligible for C4C.

All th dealerships around here took anything. All the ads said "Bring your car in and get [$ amount] even if it doesn't qualify for CFC"

quote Originally posted by Zeb: Sorry, but I call BS. No Fiero was eligible for C4C.

Got the pics on my cell phone including the Obama sticker.
Knew someone would call BS so I backed it up.
I have seen quite a few cars way older than this Fiero.
Post the pics later.
I can also pull the tag they put on the throttle body, and take a pic of the blue paint that adorns the 40k Fiero motor.

quote Originally posted by partfiero: Got the pics on my cell phone including the Obama sticker. Knew someone would call BS so I backed it up. I have seen quite a few cars way older than this Fiero. Post the pics later. I can also pull the tag they put on the throttle body, and take a pic of the blue paint that adorns the 40k Fiero motor.

That could all be photoshopped. I need to see the original painted engine and tag.

(Hey, I'm a birther. What can I say ?)

[This message has been edited by D B Cooper (edited 10-30-2009).]

quote Originally posted by partfiero: I have discovered undeniable proof that the program was not worth is. Was in a yard last week and there was an 85 SE V-6 with 40k that was turned in and the engine destroyed. It was a one owner non smoking lady who owned it, and it was as clean as any Fiero I have ever seen. The whole interior now sits in my garage and I get sick every time I look at it. Of course it had an Obama 08 bumper sticker on it.

Interesting story
Especially since that model Fiero didn't qualify.
I;m not saying you lying.
I will say the Obama 08 bumper sticker was a nice little after thought.

quote Originally posted by Wolfhound: I will say the Obama 08 bumper sticker was a nice little after thought.

Yup. Apt symbol of a perfect waste of a good car. Thanks, Obama.

quote Originally posted by Wolfhound: Interesting story Especially since that model Fiero didn't qualify. I;m not saying you lying. I will say the Obama 08 bumper sticker was a nice little after thought.

Sorry to take so long getting back, had to order a cord to transfer the pics from my cell.
Does it qualify, gov says it does; You should have checked it out first.
Might have given you a clue I wasn't fibbing.

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/...1.jsp?column=1&id=29

Here is the vin and the options. Wonder if Carfax is reporting the CFCs?


The car with the clunker sign in the window.


Info on the death of this fine car. Notice the X on the roof.


The mileage.


The toe tag.


The paint on the engine, same as the X on the top of the car.
Took the EGR tube and got $40 for it on eBay.

And the Obama bumper sticker that you claimed was a nice afterthought.
You just can't make this crap up.



Was wondering since the tax payers paid for these, they belong to John Q. Public.
And since BO ordered them destroyed.
Should he be arrested for destroying public property?