A friend of mine has a 1990 Volvo 240 that has a no start problem. The usual shut it off one day and will not start the next day. They took the car to two different places and got two different solutions to the no start problem. The first place told them the ECM was bad, the second place told them the fual tank was rusty and that was the problem. I can not hear the fuel pump cycle when you turn the key on. The last place that worked on it took the cover off to see the top of the gas tank (in the trunk) and broke the electrical connection going in the top of the tank. What are those wires for? The fuel pump or fuel sender or both? I Have read this car has two fuel pumps, is that true? Does anybody have any wire schematics for this car??

Steve

There are two fuel pumps...one in the tank and one under the car. Check the basics....Spark, fuel pressure/volume, compression, and injection pulse. I can't give you any more advice until you find out what element you are missing....otherwise I'd be guessing
Dave

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450hp 1987 Fiero GT, 1986 Fiero SE, certified master technician/shop owner
www.njautobahn.com

What bmwguru said.

Check fuel and spark. What engine control does this have (LH 2.x, Motronic, EZK, Regina?). Also what number is the ECU, 561?) You'll have to see the ECU to know for sure.

If no fuel, listen for the fuel pump prime. If no fuel/pump prime, get to the fuel pump relay (white box on the relay block). Turn key from off to KPII while holding a finger on the relay feeling for the click of the relay. If no click, try a spare relay (you should always have a spare FPR in the car). If still no click, and you're running LH2.4 (not sure about the others) ground FPR terminal 86/2. Take a twisted, insulated wire, around 16 gauge, ground one end to the chassis and the other end gets shoved in the terminal for 86/2 on the relay block. Plug in the relay and do same test feeling for relay click. If relay clicks and pumps prime, the fuel pump relay control in the ECU is bad (pretty common problem on the 2.4). This is a suitable band-aid until the ECU is replaced, or you can leave it like this, although its slightly less safe than original.

In the picture below (taken from a 7xx series, the 240 relay block may be different), the Fuel Pump Relay Socket is outlined in red, and pin 86/2 is outlined in yellow.



The FPR or FPR control from the ECU are likely candidates for no fuel to the engine. If no fuel from engine into cylinders, that's different and we can cover that.

If no spark, that's another ball game. The crank position sensor (not likely), distributor, radio noise suppression relay, etc.

The Bosch ECUs in these cars isn't very robust. One of my Volvo's has the FPR ground band-aid on it.

I would just do searches on the below forums rather than post questions on them. Most of the posting folks are 16 year old know-it-alls driving their first car who don't know $hit. The knowledgeable folks built some of those places when the 'net was younger, but have since left. Likely your answer will be in the archives anyway.
www.turbobricks.com (not as likely to find an answer)
www.brickboard.com (great archives)

http://www.swedishbricks.ne...able%20of%20Contents
http://www.volvoclub.org.uk/faq/FAQSummary1.shtml

Or just continue to post here, bmwguru or myself may be able to help additionally.

[This message has been edited by Rainman (edited 11-07-2007).]

Thanks guys I'll check some of that out.

Steve

O.K. guys I have the car here finally. Neiither fuel pump is turning on. I have no power to either one also. The ecu is a Bosch Jetronic with a 561 on it. Is the fuel pump relay by the Ecu or is it by the fuse panel?





Any help would be great!

Steve

Check the fuses.

I did a quick search as I have NO 240 experience. The relay should be on the passenger side under the dash above a kick pad or something, I saw a reference to being above a piece of cloth. It will be a white box relay.

That las picture looks like it, but best to be sure.

[This message has been edited by Rainman (edited 11-25-2007).]

The last picture shown, the relay mounts on a clip on the ecu shown.
Is that it?
Anybody know how it's wired?

Steve

go here

http://forums.turbobricks.com/
yes they cover nonturbo cars tooo

or here

http://www.brickboard.com/

both are very very good teck sites for fixing volvos

as here use the search function

1990 volvo 240 should have a 2.4 or 3.1 bosch CPU
I think the #561 is a 2.4
there is a russian site that has the volvo green book wire diagrams
you should find a link on eathor site to it

I would try poping the covers on the relays [both]
and squezzze the contact closed to see if the pumps run or jumper them
[after you fix the tank cover wires] yes they are both sender and power to the pump
also look at the bottom of the curcut board for cracked soider joints on the relay
they are a known failure point and a eazy fix
just reheat the soider to fix the cracks

another common failt is the crank position sensor

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Question wonder and be wierd
are you kind?

[This message has been edited by ray b (edited 11-25-2007).]

Well I found the relay. Took the cover off and the fuel pump side is not pulling in. So I grounded the negative side and the pumps ran! YAY! Still no start? How does one check fuel pressure and what is it supposed to be? I hear fuel running past or thru the FPR but it doesn't come out the vac line. Could the FPR be bad? How do you check the injectors for a pulse? Noid light? Could the crank sensor be bad?

Steve

Good deal about the FP relay. We still haven't established if this is due to the relay itself or the relay control in the ECU. The 561 is common for failing the relay control. You'll have to try a known good relay to know for sure.

Fuel not coming out the vac line is a good thing. Checking fuel pressure can be a pain on these cars.

While cranking the engine is the tach showing the engine RPMs?

You'll need a noid light for the injector pulse. I would just crank it and check to see if the plugs are wet or dry.

Crank sensor could be bad, but it would be highly suspect to have more than one issue come about instantly like this. I would stay the fuel issue to make sure before guessing bad unrelated sensors.

[This message has been edited by Rainman (edited 11-25-2007).]

do the fuel injector pulse?
[you should be able to feel them fire]
do you have spark?

there could be a shrader valve [looks like a tyre valve] on the fuel rail
bottom between 3 and 4 but some cars lack one
should be about 45 lbs

yes FPR go bad it may leak fuel out the vacume line

if the crank sensor is bad no spark or fuel pulse

------------------
Question wonder and be wierd
are you kind?

I have spark. I just read on a Volvo forum that a guy had the same issue exactly and the ecu was bad. I am going to try an ECU.
I read a 951 will replace a 561. Is that true?

Steve

btw if you have a 2.4 cpu it has a code reader built in
2 inch square black box that will blink codes
it is under the hood on drivers fender

go to the brickboard under FAQ for the 700-900 for the codes

561 is LH 2.4.

You can put the ECU into a sensor test mode, in which it sends signals out to all sensors one-by-one and will report back their response. I suspect the ECU is dead as well.

They are very common on eBay and the volvo boards. Not sure about compatibility.

Rainman, how do you put the ECU in sensor test mode?

Steve

Go here for instructions, item #3: http://www.swedishbricks.ne...Q/Engine-Codes1.html

Thanks Rainman, I will try that.

Steve

OK I tried the sensor test mode and nothing happened. Let me rephrase that, when going through test mode 2: system sensor test, the tps and rpm sensor test worked fine, both sent me a 3-3-4 and 1-4-1 in that order after their test.Then it says to put the lead in socket #2 for fuel injection -related tests. This is when I get no light flashing or anything after pressing the button 2 times.

I think I have a BAD ECU.

What do you guys think?
Rainman, bmwguru, ray b or anybody else?

Steve

Its pretty common for corrosion to set in on one or both diagnostic terminals. It can take quite some time fiddling with the thing to get it to read. I actually can't get one of them to read on one of my Volvos, I've simply given up. I would try wiggling the pin and trying to get a solid connection, but it might just not happen.

I supposed it could also be due to a toasted computer but is more likley just not making a connection for the diagnostic.

Rainman, when i plug the lead in #2 the light looks dim. Is that right?

checked for corroded terminals and all are nice and clean.

By the way, what is the other black ecu looking box for?

Steve

[This message has been edited by 86soon3.4 (edited 11-27-2007).]

Yep. That's how they are. When it begins flashing it will be bright.

1. Inster diagnostic pin = steady dim light
2. Enter diagnostic mode = rapidly flashing brighter light
3. code flashes = bright long flashes

Rainman, I get no flashing light in the sensor test mode, only a dim light.
It will flash when I go to #6 hole.

Steve

Exactly, what is lacking in the equation right now? Fuel pressure/volume, injection pulse, spark, compression? I wouldn't even mess with the computer until I know what is missing. The fuel pump relay also controls injection pulse if I remember correctly. Also, you can power up both fuel pumps separately to see if they at least power on. The self diagnostic connector I don't mess with on a crank/no start condition.
Dave

bmwguru, I don't have any fuel pressure as the pumps do not turn on. If i bypass the relay the pumps turn on(supply a ground to the relay 86/2 terminal),
I have spark and compression. The rpm sensor works (according to the test above). I have to beleive the ecu is not supplying a ground to the fuel pump relay.

Steve

The next step would be to pin out terminal 86/2. I'd make sure there is a good connection to the ecu...if that is where that goes...I'll have to pull out the book to make sure. I used to work on Volvos everyday...and I used to own a 240, but I've since rid myself of those Swedish car customers and stick to just German and Italian...I still have the books, though
Dave

quote Originally posted by 86soon3.4: Rainman, I get no flashing light in the sensor test mode, only a dim light. It will flash when I go to #6 hole. Steve

You don't get any flashing when you put the pin in diag port 2 and press the button twice for two seconds each? Odd.

But its almost a guarantee that the fuel pump relay control in the ecu took a dump, the 561's are common for that. But grounding 86/2 is a band aid for that, so its now "fixed." Like I said, one of mine did the same thing. But it is fairly rare for the ECU to do much worse that just that.

Here's the ECU pinout for LH 2.4: http://www.carsoft.ru/avtorepair/ecm/9_1.pdf
You'll be checking pin 20.

Is it still not starting? I'll have to go back through your posts, but if its still not starting you need to check for fuel or spark to see what's missing. But its possible the ECU is totally gone.

Edit, I see you're getting spark so you need to check for fuel. Pull a plug after cranking to see if its wet.

[This message has been edited by Rainman (edited 11-27-2007).]

Rainman, I got spark, but no fuel. Plugs are dry. I put my fingers on an injector but could't feel anything. I was cranking it over with a starter button jumped across the starter. I have to get a noid light to check for injector pulse.


Steve

Well for those who are interested in this post, I have no injector pulse at the injectors. No fuel pumps turn on. I have spark and compression. The rpm sensor works per the above sensor test mode.

I think I have a bad ECU! What do you guys think?

Steve

Still banking on a bad ECU. They are on ebay all the time. Or you can check the mall in turbo bricks or post in the wanted section. I've always had good response posting want ads there.

Update....The owner bought a #951 ecu. I installed it and it ran!

A big thank you to Rainman, Bmwguru and Ray b for all the help.

Steve

Good to hear. These are stupid-simple, reliable cars. As one saying goes, "A low-mile Volvo is really only a psychological benefit."

Between my two Volvos, I've got over 450K miles.

[This message has been edited by Rainman (edited 12-18-2007).]