And here all my friends think I drive a 2200 pound Civic Hatchback in relation to how light they are. That's 2920 without me in it. So add another 180lbs and you get 3100lbs or so.
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[This message has been edited by Rare87GT (edited 12-25-2012).]
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01:45 AM
PFF
System Bot
TM_Fiero Member
Posts: 1077 From: Brookville, PA Registered: Jun 2002
Yes, Fieros are heavier. But at least it isn't a Civic.
I've always liked your Fiero, still looking good after all these years.
Thank you. I pride myself in being a perfectionist. I've had my Formula since April 2002. Almost 11 years, and I like to think it's about as perfect as it was the day after I picked it up! I hope to be in attendance for the 30th this coming summer!
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02:00 AM
AkursedX Member
Posts: 2890 From: Lackawanna NY Registered: Aug 2000
I really wonder if the Fiero had managed to stay in the GM lineup how much it would weigh. I could only imagine the weight savings if they were able to use an all-aluminum spaceframe. The Lotus Elise was easily under 2000lbs. I wonder if the Fiero would have been able to do the same.
I seen the thread of all part weights, I never added it all up. But IIRC the space frame was only 600lbs, which is not much in the grand scheme. That is of course if my memory and the specs are correct.
No wonder it's heavy, Get it away from the feed store. He looks pretty good for being fat
quote
Originally posted by Rare87GT:
And here all my friends think I drive a 2200 pound Civic Hatchback in relation to how light they are. That's 2920 without me in it. So add another 180lbs and you get 3100lbs or so.
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06:39 AM
Capt Fiero Member
Posts: 7657 From: British Columbia, Canada Registered: Feb 2000
The big things are the doors they weigh a ton due to the impact beams, the front and rear beams are not that bad, but still heavy. the engine for what is, is VERY heavy. my 4.9 V8 weighs less than the V6. There are lots of things that you could do to save weight, look at the Fiero Racing List, they got a Fiero to under 2000lbs buy gutting and changing to modern safety parts. GM had to use off the shelf parts used in crappy Family Sedans, and in some cases Pick Up truck parts to build the Fiero. IF they had access to the Corvette parts bins and stuff it would have came in a lot better. My 85GT tipped the scales at 2600lbs with the 4.9 5spd combo and me gutting out everything I didn't need like spare tire and related things. I always wanted to build a set of 1/2 doors for a Fiero. Like the Jeep guys do. By law the jeeps with solid doors have to keep them. But they make Aluminum 1/2 doors without glass or impact beams and save a lot of weight. Heck I'll bet just wheel and tire choice on a later car could save 100lbs. (believe it or not the Fiero 14" are really light)
To me, I'd prefer to add all the luxury stuff that a Caddy would have, I might end up at 4000lbs instead of 3000lbs, but that just means I would need more horsepower and that's find with me. Heater Power Buckets and Remote Start are 2 of the things high on my list.
------------------ 857GT Part 85GT Part 87GT Part Caddy, 93 Eldorado 4.9, 5spd Dual O2 Custom Chip, Custom Exhaust. MSD Everything Now with Nitrous. Capt Fiero --- My Over View Cadero Pics Yellow 88GT 5spd Full Poly Suspension, Lowered 1/2" in front, Corner Carver.
A foxbody mustang gt weighs around 3100 lbs stock compared to a Fiero GT was around 2700 lbs. A new mustang is 3600 (I had a 2009 completely loaded with a centrifugal supercharger/intercooled/headers/gears/suspension/etc.. that weighed 3800), a camaro ss is 3800 (I had a 2010 that was ~3900 with just bolt ons/suspension) and the challengers at the drag strip are all around/over 4000. Even corvettes start getting up there when you get the options you want (z06 starts at 3200 lbs - grand sport at 3300) - I had a c5 that weighed 3150).
Compared to a lotus or civic they are heavy, but I'm not a big fan of a civics looks and lotus' are way to fragile - I've known a few people that totaled them by running over something in the road.
The new lotus evora is 3000 lbs, compared to the elise which was 2000lbs.
Fieros are maybe 150-200 lbs heavier then they should be, but a lot of other cars are bloated too. 3800 Fieros are even more bloated, especially if you keep ac and use an automatic.
It's the L67 and the 4T65e-HD that adds to that weight, that's a fairly heavy combo. Your Fiero would be at least another 75lbs heavier if it was a fastback as well. My 4.9/4t60e 86 SE (notchback) weighs 2800lbs without driver. That would drop about 110-125lbs if/when I swap to a 4-speed manual.
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02:47 PM
VF1Skullangel Member
Posts: 190 From: Southern California Registered: Jun 2008
Gotta agree here... I LOVE my fiero but considering it generally diminutive size just pushing it in and out of the shop I was surprised at how heavy the little monster is. When we got it I had to push it out of the driveway and back up into place for some reason and my driveway is on a slight angle and it took CONSIDERABLE effort from me and my loving wife to get it moved back up the driveway. Of course I am comparing it to my other project cars which mostly included lifted Suzuki Samurai's which are probably the lightest cars ever made LOL.. Still I love the way they handle especially with the last one I had with the 18x8 5x100 rims and low profile tires it was a blast to drive. I am trying to r and r my current wheels and tires so I can sell them to help me afford the larger rims. Makes a HUGE difference in the way the car looks. This 88notchie looks amazing and I would love to have a ride in it someday. Owning a similar car my 85GT I can truly appreciate why he loves it so much. They are just such a unique looking car and when they are lowered they really come into their own. Peace
Pete
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03:16 PM
La fiera Member
Posts: 2277 From: Mooresville, NC Registered: Jun 2008
My crx with bald all seasons and a laggy 180hp turbo setup is as fast around autox as justins 600hp fiero and i suck at driving. You can hate all over the hondas but i would not hesitate to race any fieros based on handling.
My fiero was a good handlin upgrade over my gtp... but not by much and drivin a fiero hard is not for the faint hearted as they get away from you quickly.
My crx with bald all seasons and a laggy 180hp turbo setup is as fast around autox as justins 600hp fiero and i suck at driving. You can hate all over the hondas but i would not hesitate to race any fieros based on handling.
My fiero was a good handlin upgrade over my gtp... but not by much and drivin a fiero hard is not for the faint hearted as they get away from you quickly.
Have you lost your mind? I had 5 seconds on you easily
The duke fiero was still 3-4 seconds faster than you.
Originally posted by darkhorizon: My fiero was a good handlin upgrade over my gtp... but not by much and drivin a fiero hard is not for the faint hearted as they get away from you quickly.
Originally posted by Rare87GT: And here all my friends think I drive a 2200 pound Civic Hatchback in relation to how light they are. That's 2920 without me in it. So add another 180lbs and you get 3100lbs or so.
So, their stock Honda is 16.5-18.0 seconds in the 1/4? You car is what, 13.0-13.5 seconds? That gives you 3.0-5.0 second lead that puts the "finger out the window" in their line of site... Oh, and it isn't a Honda with a big fart-can on it...
Fieros are too heavy, considering it is only a 2 seater with a small trunk. I am not sure why this is a big shock to anyone... It is kind of funny when people are posting questions about removing an AC compressor, an EGR valve, or a tire jack to "save weight"... As if removing these parts (less than 1% of the weight of the car) will have any measurable performance improvement. It is a cool looking commuter car. The steering, handling, braking, and power to weight ratio are just not there to be considered a real sports car.
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10:56 PM
Dec 27th, 2012
hyperv6 Member
Posts: 6136 From: Clinton, OH, USA Registered: Mar 2003
The Fiero is or was heavy for a car back in the 80's. Today most cars are 2800 pounds or heavier. Crash standards have gone up and many of the cars from the 80's would just fold up like the Civic.
The new Vette is working to get down to 3000 pound in the C7.
The real issue with the Fiero was the space frame. It may have been stronger but it saved little to any weight. We have more steerl than many steel cars under a plastic body. Also the sheet molded panels like the hood are not Lotus light either.
With the money Pontiac had to build the Fiero there was little room to worry about weight. Losing weight in a car cost money and they already did not have enough money to build the car with the suspension or engine they really wanted.
It is what it is and by todays standard the Fiero is lighter than many cars. Today we are in the world of a 4000 pound Camaro. GM is just now going to the Alpha platform to get it down to 3400-3500 pounds.
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08:05 AM
2.5 Member
Posts: 43235 From: Southern MN Registered: May 2007
And here all my friends think I drive a 2200 pound Civic Hatchback in relation to how light they are. That's 2920 without me in it. So add another 180lbs and you get 3100lbs or so.
I always thought Fieros were 2,790 lb, I suppose it depends on how they are equipped.
Ever looked at an 87 Civic, gross. Probably the aluminum block saves alot of weight, that and it is a 1.5 liter.
A 2013 Civic is 2800 lbs. Must be all the electric wires?
[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 12-27-2012).]
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09:02 AM
darkhorizon Member
Posts: 12279 From: Flint Michigan Registered: Jan 2006
Fieros are too heavy, considering it is only a 2 seater with a small trunk. I am not sure why this is a big shock to anyone... It is kind of funny when people are posting questions about removing an AC compressor, an EGR valve, or a tire jack to "save weight"... As if removing these parts (less than 1% of the weight of the car) will have any measurable performance improvement. It is a cool looking commuter car. The steering, handling, braking, and power to weight ratio are just not there to be considered a real sports car.
Consider the weight of all the other GM cars produced in the 80s, rather than modern tiny 2-seaters. It's one of the lighter cars to come out of GM in the 80s. The C4 Vette weighed in at almost 3300 lbs. The 3rd gen F-body weighed 3300-3600 depending on options. The Monte Carlo was around 3200 lbs. There weren't many models that were lighter than the Fiero.
The steering, handling, braking, and power to weight ratio are there (at least for the V6 Fieros), for it to be considered a real sports car, of the 80s era. Everyone seems to forget that even the top end Vette only had about 115 HP more than the Fiero did, at the time. The 80s were just a horrible time for sports cars in general.
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10:37 AM
Capt Fiero Member
Posts: 7657 From: British Columbia, Canada Registered: Feb 2000
We have a club guy, that autocrosses a fair bit and we have video of him turning in better times than a 911 Porsche, in fact the Porsche club was so impressed with the Fiero that they invited the Fiero guys at the track to come racing with them on the Mission Road Course for track days. They honestly couldn't believe it, that a Fiero was outrunning many of their cars. Mods to the Fiero were basic to say the least, 3.2 V6, (bored and strocked 3.2) Good Track tires, DOT legal though, full poly suspension conversion and a rear sway bar added, car was an 86GT with a 4spd. There are plenty of video's of him running around the track. Around some of the longer corners he is balanced so perfect that he is doing a perfect 4 wheel drift and lines it up for the next corner. I was extremely impressed when I rode with him.
I might have a magazine around here that I could scan, if I could find it, that pits the CRX up against the Fiero in several Tests. The CRX lost badly. I mean hell it does not even have an IRS. Its got a solid bar. (don't really want to call it an axle) I believe it even has rear drum brakes. If the Fiero is a crappy 80's car, then the CRX is diarrhea.
------------------ 857GT Part 85GT Part 87GT Part Caddy, 93 Eldorado 4.9, 5spd Dual O2 Custom Chip, Custom Exhaust. MSD Everything Now with Nitrous. Capt Fiero --- My Over View Cadero Pics Yellow 88GT 5spd Full Poly Suspension, Lowered 1/2" in front, Corner Carver.
Originally posted by Capt Fiero: I might have a magazine around here that I could scan, if I could find it, that pits the CRX up against the Fiero in several Tests. The CRX lost badly. I mean hell it does not even have an IRS. Its got a solid bar. (don't really want to call it an axle) I believe it even has rear drum brakes. If the Fiero is a crappy 80's car, then the CRX is diarrhea.
The re-design for the 88-91 model of CRX fixed that though. It had full independent all around. Then of course there was the del Sol that came after it, in 1992. But much like the Fiero, and everything else, the 80s cars built before 88 were not really built for performance. 1988 was just a year where manufacturers started leaning their efforts into bringing some performance back into the line-up, and were no longer dealing with having to catch up to new emissions standards, or responding to the energy crisis of 79.
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03:25 PM
Toontown Fiero Member
Posts: 82 From: Saskatoon, Canada Registered: Aug 2012
Gotta agree here... I LOVE my fiero but considering it generally diminutive size just pushing it in and out of the shop I was surprised at how heavy the little monster is. When we got it I had to push it out of the driveway and back up into place for some reason and my driveway is on a slight angle and it took CONSIDERABLE effort from me and my loving wife to get it moved back up the driveway. Of course I am comparing it to my other project cars which mostly included lifted Suzuki Samurai's which are probably the lightest cars ever made LOL.. Still I love the way they handle especially with the last one I had with the 18x8 5x100 rims and low profile tires it was a blast to drive. I am trying to r and r my current wheels and tires so I can sell them to help me afford the larger rims. Makes a HUGE difference in the way the car looks. This 88notchie looks amazing and I would love to have a ride in it someday. Owning a similar car my 85GT I can truly appreciate why he loves it so much. They are just such a unique looking car and when they are lowered they really come into their own. Peace
Pete
I have to agree with many of your points. I bought a fiero to restore because it is different and unique. My car is 26 years old and still gets attention. I can never understand why people compare it to new sports cars or any new cars period. Is it as fast as a new camaro? No. Does it handle like a new Porsche? No. Does it have the luxuries like a new Lexus? No. But....does it look like every other car on the road? No. That's why I have one. It's hard enough to find my chrysler daily driver in the parking lot in the sea of identical cars with identical paint jobs. Ever drive down the street following the identical model car to yours with the same paint color? Awesome. Nothing better than spending $40k on your shiny new car and then pulling up to a red light beside the identical car driven by a fat bimbo. Just saying.
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06:21 PM
Pete Matos Member
Posts: 2291 From: Port St. Lucie, Florida Registered: Jan 2010
I have to agree with many of your points. I bought a fiero to restore because it is different and unique. My car is 26 years old and still gets attention. I can never understand why people compare it to new sports cars or any new cars period. Is it as fast as a new camaro? No. Does it handle like a new Porsche? No. Does it have the luxuries like a new Lexus? No. But....does it look like every other car on the road? No. That's why I have one. It's hard enough to find my chrysler daily driver in the parking lot in the sea of identical cars with identical paint jobs. Ever drive down the street following the identical model car to yours with the same paint color? Awesome. Nothing better than spending $40k on your shiny new car and then pulling up to a red light beside the identical car driven by a fat bimbo. Just saying.
Now ya see Great minds DO think alike LOL..... Peace
Pete
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06:27 PM
86 toy Member
Posts: 674 From: Mifflinville,PA Registered: Jan 2011
I have to agree with many of your points. I bought a fiero to restore because it is different and unique. My car is 26 years old and still gets attention. I can never understand why people compare it to new sports cars or any new cars period. Is it as fast as a new camaro? No. Does it handle like a new Porsche? No. Does it have the luxuries like a new Lexus? No. But....does it look like every other car on the road? No. That's why I have one. It's hard enough to find my chrysler daily driver in the parking lot in the sea of identical cars with identical paint jobs. Ever drive down the street following the identical model car to yours with the same paint color? Awesome. Nothing better than spending $40k on your shiny new car and then pulling up to a red light beside the identical car driven by a fat bimbo. Just saying.
I beleave this is why most of us own our cars.. I know thats the case for me also
I beleave this is why most of us own our cars.. I know thats the case for me also
Exactly how I feel. Everyone is like what's your interest in Fieros or how did you get interested more so. I always respond with how many do you see a day? And they are like well yours is the only one or hardly ever. It's a good ratio. When I show up at our local get togethers or car shows, everyone is always very interested as it's so unique. I like being the odd ball with the cool car
The body panels on a Fiero aren't thin light fiberglass either, they're heavy braced fiberglass and RRIM... the light gauge steel uni-body of a late 80s, early 90s Honda weighs less. A Honda hatch of the same time period didn't have a safety rating as good as the Fiero either.
[This message has been edited by carbon (edited 12-28-2012).]
