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Need some advice on buying another fiero. is 4 years sitting too long for a fiero.. by freedom0226
Started on: 04-20-2010 12:48 AM
Replies: 26
Last post by: fierocarparts on 04-22-2010 10:47 AM
freedom0226
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Report this Post04-20-2010 12:48 AM Click Here to See the Profile for freedom0226Click Here to Email freedom0226Send a Private Message to freedom0226Direct Link to This Post
so since work is super slow today i was at my local workforce one taking an exam for a possible scholarship for school to get my associate for free... anyway the guy giving the exam was talking about cars and i mentioned my baby...lol. such a small world the guy said he also has owned about 3 different fieros and has one for sale he was planning on posting on ebay soon...i just need some advice on what am i getting myself into. he is going to send me pics soon and i will post them up..he is a diesel mechanic so i believe him when he says it needs a new clutch but the motor and tranny are good..
my question is he said its been sitting for four years soooo.. what am i really looking at here cost wise because i am not a mechanic but do plan on doing minor things myself like body work fixing the interior .. basically small things.....

since its been sitting for four years what can i expect to have to do or get done . the windshield is smashed thats only $100 at the junkyard by shea stadium. the car is a 1986 gt v6 4 speed.

so how much for a clutch ? and how much to expect for the job .. labor and all ?

and can anyone tell me what to look for and what to check. when i go see it in person. i already know basics like pulling the carpet back and checking for rust etcc. but anything else that can help ..

he would sell the car to me for $400 and he is in PA.. i could rent a hitch at a uhaul for about 60 for the day and use my girls 97 jeep cheeroke to bring it back...

so any advice is appreciated...

all im worried about is mech wise... if the car is 400 and clutch is about 100-200. now how much is labor to install the clutch...
will i need to get new brake lines and flush everything out...???? is four years sitting tooo long. ?????

------------------
new fiero owner...
1987 gt v6 blue

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freedom0226
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Report this Post04-20-2010 01:19 AM Click Here to See the Profile for freedom0226Click Here to Email freedom0226Send a Private Message to freedom0226Direct Link to This Post

freedom0226

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anyone ???? ill check back in the am...
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Fiero1Fan
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Report this Post04-20-2010 01:43 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Fiero1FanClick Here to visit Fiero1Fan's HomePageClick Here to Email Fiero1FanSend a Private Message to Fiero1FanDirect Link to This Post
The sitting for 4 years isn't good but remember that the car is 20+ years old. You'll need to check (rebuild) the suspension. Check for rust in the trunk under the carpet, the battery area and the rear frame. The clutch you can install yourself it isn't too big of a job and save yourself a lot of money having a mechanic that has absolutely not idea how to work on Fieros install it.

[This message has been edited by Fiero1Fan (edited 04-20-2010).]

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Patrick
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Report this Post04-20-2010 02:00 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickDirect Link to This Post

If I were you, I'd look at this Fiero long and hard before buying it. If you need to be paying someone else to be replacing clutches and windshields and who knows what else after it's been sitting (things like dried out and hardened valve guide seals), $400 may not be that great of a deal.

I just got an '84 duke/4-spd roadworthy after it had sat for five years. I knew it needed the tranny pulled when I bought it. I ended up swapping a 5-speed into it. I also had to replace basically the entire braking system, plus a hundred other things that were messed up from sitting.

In hindsight, I shouldn't have bought this Fiero. The time and money (mostly time in my case because I've done all the work) I've put into this car go well beyond what this Fiero is worth. For me, lesson learned.
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FieroRumor
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Report this Post04-20-2010 06:06 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FieroRumorClick Here to visit FieroRumor's HomePageClick Here to Email FieroRumorSend a Private Message to FieroRumorDirect Link to This Post
A few things - how much "play money" do you have?

Do you have the cash (and space) to store the car off the street while you work on it?(for months, possibly)

Do you have enough space that you could, in theory, part the car out and use some on another Fiero, or sell the parts on Ebay or locally?

How many miles are on the car? Can you have the guy climb under (or stick a camera under) the car?

If possible, have him take some pics of the battery compartment (have him remove the battery)

also have him take a few pics of the suspension, maybe have him turn the wheel and then take a pic of the front suspension...

It's hard to say what needs to be done, but an oil change and coolant flush would be a good start. DON'T FORGET TO BURP CAR WHEN YOU DO THE COOLANT FLUSH! Once you get the car, and change out the fluids, there are oodles of things you can check out - (even by just using yer ears)
Quick checklist of some things to check out - Fuel pump/Filter, Water Pump, hoses, belts. Distributor. Spark plugs (especially the front 3) wires and the area that houses the resistor in the heating system (in the front of the car) Mice build nests in there, and then the resistor gets hot and ignites. NOT a good thing!)
What part of queens do you live in? Where do you work? (are they HIRING?)

Happy Fieroing!

-Rumor

[This message has been edited by FieroRumor (edited 04-20-2010).]

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freedom0226
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Report this Post04-20-2010 09:02 AM Click Here to See the Profile for freedom0226Click Here to Email freedom0226Send a Private Message to freedom0226Direct Link to This Post
I'm in corona queens ny I work as an apprentice plumber for 2 yrs now. Work is extremly slow so I went to my local workforce cause they hAve a free diesel mechanics class going on. The instructor is the one with the car.
Honestly if I get it for 400 it was so that I can learn how to do things myself and learn more about cars. He says it's a bad clutch and other than it's been sitting for soo long no issues.
Now to replace the clutch you have to remove the tranny right ?
There is no way I can do that myself ? I have a decent size backyard but no garage. And if you tell me I don't have to remove the tranny to do the clutch I'm willing to try.

Let me know. Also for the last post. If you know electricity we always need someone to wire up the boilers when we install new ones. We can do it but after doing a double And installing a boiler noone wants to start messing with wires.
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TXGOOD
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Report this Post04-20-2010 09:46 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TXGOODClick Here to visit TXGOOD's HomePageSend a Private Message to TXGOODDirect Link to This Post
I say go for it.
The car I have has been sitting since 1995 but I am slowly going to be repairing everything that needs it.
If you don`t mind the car sitting while you work on it then you can really get it back up to good condition.
Look at it this way, if you buy a car for 2000.00 you may have to still put parts into it, but if you buy a car
for a couple of hundred and spend 1800.00 on it, you will have a bunch of new parts.
Everyone talks about cars being 20 years old and while that`s true with rubber, hoses, bushings etc, but
unless metal is rusting the main parts of the cars are not deteriorating.
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bowrapennocks
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Report this Post04-20-2010 09:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for bowrapennocksDirect Link to This Post
You never know what it needs until you get it home. Last summer, I got an 85 SE 4cyl/5 sp for free. It had been sitting for 10 years and had been sidelined with a "bad clutch". When I got it home, I pulled the gas tank and got rid of the really bad gas. The fuel pump would not start, so I installed a spare one that I had. I changed the filters and the oil, and primed the oil in the engine. It started on first crank and ran fine. I ended up replacing the clutch slave and master cylinders and the car was on the road. The car had 100K miles on it and the interior was original and in good shape. Also be concerned about the age of the tires. Tires are date coded and you don't want anything too old. Carfully go over all the rubber seals and hoses, as they dry out.

Good luck!
Jim
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Report this Post04-20-2010 09:58 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TopNotchClick Here to visit TopNotch's HomePageSend a Private Message to TopNotchDirect Link to This Post
The best way to replace the clutch is to drop the cradle. It's been done in back yards by others. Just have a tarp to throw over everything when it rains.
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fierocarparts
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Report this Post04-20-2010 09:59 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierocarpartsClick Here to Email fierocarpartsSend a Private Message to fierocarpartsDirect Link to This Post
Here is a place for new windshields inexpensive: http://www.windshieldstogo.com/
As far as the cost versus the return, you can expect to lose your butt on it. However you have realized that education isn't cheap. Think of it as an investment into your education of mechanics. Something you can use to apply your new skills towards. If you can read a manual, you can repair a car. If you run into a hard spot, there is a GREAT resource to help you out. PENNOCK'S FIERO FORUM.
Once you get it up and running, you will have the pride that you brought it back to life.
WARNING-----you do tend to buy MORE of these things!
Good luck and hope to see you on here!

------------------
Life is just SO much better when you own AND drive a Fiero!

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Report this Post04-20-2010 01:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Alex4mulaClick Here to Email Alex4mulaSend a Private Message to Alex4mulaDirect Link to This Post
How many miles the car has? Condition? That would mainly tell if $400 could be a great deal or not. A clutch job for a novice is nothing easy at all to do no matter what anyone tells you here. You need space, tools and something to rise the car very high in a safe way. If you have to pay for that it won't be $200. That won't even cover the new clutch. I doubt you would get a shop to do it for less than $600 (labor only) unless you have a friend that may charge you less. So if you have at least an extra $800+ to make the car move on its own then skip it. Of course then will come the other things that "may" go wrong related to the long hybernation.
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Patrick
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Report this Post04-20-2010 03:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by freedom0226:

And if you tell me I don't have to remove the tranny to do the clutch I'm willing to try.



I've replaced tons of clutches without removing the tranny.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.

You have a lot to learn, grasshopper.

This could be you in a couple of weeks...

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 04-20-2010).]

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Philero
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Report this Post04-20-2010 03:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PhileroClick Here to Email PhileroSend a Private Message to PhileroDirect Link to This Post
Nobody said this before, so I have to be the bad guy I guess!

You can not rent a dolly from UHaul to tow a Fiero... unless you tell them it is not a Fiero you are towing. If you do, they will make you rent a flatbed. This is because it is a rear wheel drive car. I have towed my fiero with a dolly before (i told UHaul it was going to be a Ford Escort !!) and it did OKAY, but the clearance on the ramps is pretty close to zero on your rocker panels and you will HAVE to make sure the transmission is in Neutral and also realize you will rack up some miles. PS, check your brakes!!! Make sure your ebrake is not engaged or the brakes are not seized!

Best bet though, just rent the flatbed!

Hope this helps!

------------------
Phil
Always trying to create something new!
'88 SE
'86 GT
'87 GT Extreme body mod and 2.8L Turbo Propane powered (in the garage and getting closer to being completed)

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freedom0226
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Report this Post04-20-2010 05:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for freedom0226Click Here to Email freedom0226Send a Private Message to freedom0226Direct Link to This Post
now thats some kick ass advice thanx everyone.. im still waitin on him to send the pics... if the body isnt bad and the taillights and gt quarter panels arent broken then i will give him 400 and just learn as i go..... i figure if the taillights are in good condition i could sell those for 120 for the set and the car now cost me 300.....

it all depends on his pics now.. i will post them up when i get them....ive been messing around with a dodge caravan se 1997... changing the spark plugs cap rotor etc just to start off. im just going to keep taking this van apart to learn things as i go then junk it at the yard....


does anyone know where i can download any free service manuals....im looking for the 1997 dodge caravan se. but cant find it all doing a google search..
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Report this Post04-20-2010 05:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2farnorthSend a Private Message to 2farnorthDirect Link to This Post
How long it is stored is not as important as under what conditions it was stored in. If the 4 years was outside uncovered, not moved, not started, and same gas in tank then it would be too long for a $400 car. You'd be looking at dropping the gas tank, replacing the fuel pump, replacing brake calipers that have frozen up with rust and corrosion, and looking at some dried seals in the engine and trans. Also have mice gotten into the wiring and the ducts? Also looking at replacing all 4 tires
Now if it was inside, occasionally started, gas freshened up or stabilized, moved occasionally to exercise the brakes and wet the seals then you're talking a decent deal.

Find out what the clutch is doing. I've seen people get ripped off to replace a clutch when the only problem was the clutch slave or master cylinder. Now if it's got a broken spring, bad throw out bearing, or the friction material is worn down to the rivets, then the eng and trans have to be split apart to install at least a new disc. I'd recommend a new pressure plate and throw out bearing also.. If the fly wheel is scored, it should be re-surfaced also
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30+mpg
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Report this Post04-20-2010 06:00 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 30+mpgClick Here to Email 30+mpgSend a Private Message to 30+mpgDirect Link to This Post
Here's a taste of what to expect from a member who has BTDT.

//www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/049190.html
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silver 85 sc
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Report this Post04-20-2010 06:35 PM Click Here to See the Profile for silver 85 scClick Here to Email silver 85 scSend a Private Message to silver 85 scDirect Link to This Post
Mine sat for about 5 years, My son 's sat for about 2 years and then I pulled one out of a pasture. 86 2.5 liter. Put in new coolant tube hangers and a fuel pump and she started right up. I sat for about 11 years outside in the elements on dirt. Lots of rust but she ran great. Sold it for $150.00 about 6 months ago.
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Report this Post04-20-2010 06:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by silver 85 sc:

I sat for about 11 years outside in the elements on dirt.



Now that right there is a sad, sad story!
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Report this Post04-20-2010 07:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jscott1Send a Private Message to jscott1Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Philero:

you will HAVE to make sure the transmission is in Neutral and also realize you will rack up some miles.




Do you mean miles on the Fiero odometer? Not likely, unless you have the key in the ignition and the car on. The Fiero odometer uses an electronic VSS and no miles will be recorded with the car off, no matter how much the wheels are turning.

As for a car sitting 5 years? Yeah it's going to need some work, but $400 is not bad for a fastback even if the car is a total loss. The parts you can salvage are worth a lot more than that. I say go for it.

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jscott1
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Report this Post04-20-2010 07:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jscott1Send a Private Message to jscott1Direct Link to This Post

jscott1

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quote
Originally posted by Patrick:


I've replaced tons of clutches without removing the tranny.
.
.





Uh what's that thing laying on the ground? I think you meant to say you've replaced tons of clutches without removing the engine.

[This message has been edited by jscott1 (edited 04-20-2010).]

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Patrick
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Report this Post04-20-2010 07:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jscott1:

Uh what's that thing laying on the ground? I think you meant to say you've replaced tons of clutches without removing the engine.



No, what I said is what I meant.

The comment about not removing the tranny was a joke in reference to the OP question that I had quoted.

The joke and the image weren't meant to be directly connected (other than to possibly show that I was indeed just kidding), but I can now see where it could get confusing if you didn't get the joke.

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 04-20-2010).]

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Report this Post04-20-2010 08:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PhileroClick Here to Email PhileroSend a Private Message to PhileroDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jscott1:


Do you mean miles on the Fiero odometer? Not likely, unless you have the key in the ignition and the car on. The Fiero odometer uses an electronic VSS and no miles will be recorded with the car off, no matter how much the wheels are turning.



JScott, fair enough, and thank you for pointing out my error, but at least agree that where I was wrong, should have been the least of his worries compared to the other reasons why I pointed out using a flatbed is far better and safer than a dolly.

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Report this Post04-20-2010 09:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jscott1Send a Private Message to jscott1Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Philero:


but at least agree that where I was wrong, should have been the least of his worries compared to the other reasons why I pointed out using a flatbed is far better and safer than a dolly.


Yeah I didn't get the tranny joke. I was trying to imagine how you replace a clutch without removing the transmission. I suppose anything is possible, but that's a tough one.

I agree with 2farnorth...chances are the clutch is fine and all it needs is a new master or slave cylinder.

Oh and Philero, I do agree with you by the way. I used a tow dolly and I was run over by an 18 wheeler because towing a black car at night he didn't see it. So I now only tow using a flatbed. But I understand not everybody has a truck big enough to pull off a 1 ton U Haul trailer.

[This message has been edited by jscott1 (edited 04-20-2010).]

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Report this Post04-22-2010 12:09 AM Click Here to See the Profile for SNAPPY829Click Here to Email SNAPPY829Send a Private Message to SNAPPY829Direct Link to This Post
Ive towed Fieros several times with a dolley, I just put them on backwards with the front wheels on the ground and lock the steering wheel straight. One of the members causions about high speed towing if it has a wing, be safe and remove it although I never have had a problem. $ 400 for a fastback that is all there, clutch working or not is a good deal to me. Worst case if the frame is bad sell the parts and you will be more than fine..... learning is far more valuable than your 400 !!! good luck!!
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ltlfrari
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Report this Post04-22-2010 07:28 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ltlfrariClick Here to visit ltlfrari's HomePageClick Here to Email ltlfrariSend a Private Message to ltlfrariDirect Link to This Post
Pretty much anything is fixable, just watch some of the car shows on TV but also look at how much those cars cost to do as well.

Without the money to spend on it, the car will sit for a looooooonnnnnnng time while you work on it and without $$ can you really afford to have someone else be doing the work for you. It's also not just parts, there's tools as well. Need to pull the engine, then you need a hoist and a good selection of wrenches etc. Serious rust, need a welder. Half the cost of owning a Fiero is tools because you need far more of them than for a newer car.

You state it has a broken windshield so whats the state of the interior like. If it's all moldy/damp then you will need to replace a lot of it. not impossible but more $$. Rust? Frame rails are hard to spot as they are covered by the body. They are repairable but you need tools, room to work/store body and a welder (but strangely not so much $$).
Ditto, rockers (under plastic panels).
A/C - If dead can get expensive to refurbish.
Engine work - Anything you touch will break - more money !

Personally I'd say this is not the car for you, but then again I'm not you.

Engine removal:

This images is larger than 153600 bytes. Click to view.

Bad rockers:



Upper frame rail rust (under bodywork so canot see):



Not saying your car would be like this, just that it 'could' be and it's hard to see (rust in pics was on an 88, now fixed) and it all costs $$ (lots of $$) to fix. For what you might spend on this car to get it roadworthy you could save and buy a decent runner. At least you could test drive a running car. This one is pot luck (just because owner says it runs does not mean it does).

Of course it could also be a gem but odds are against it in my opinion.

Just my $0.02 worth.


------------------
Dave

www.ltlfrari.com

[This message has been edited by ltlfrari (edited 04-22-2010).]

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Pyrthian
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Report this Post04-22-2010 09:26 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PyrthianClick Here to Email PyrthianSend a Private Message to PyrthianDirect Link to This Post
mine sat in my garage for 7 years....
yes, there were issues from sitting - but - overall - its an old car - even if stuff didnt dry rot by now - its wore out.
be ready to replace stuff - no matter what.
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fierocarparts
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Report this Post04-22-2010 10:47 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierocarpartsClick Here to Email fierocarpartsSend a Private Message to fierocarpartsDirect Link to This Post
Sorry I missed the part about it being a fastback. Yea you can part it out for more than $400. Just removing things to sell will help further your education about mechanics. Like others have said, doubt it is the actual clutch that is out. I have bought 4-5 cars in the last couple of years that the owner told me the clutch was out and most had replaced the slave cylinder. Bled the slave cylinder correctly (if it was new), and the clutch worked fine. Replaced the slave cylinder on the others and they worked as well.

Technically, I have changed a clutch without removing the transmission from the vehicle (not a Fiero). It was still attached to the engine by long all thread. I slid the transmission back on the all thread enough to do the clutch. I was a line mechanic at the time and had the vehicle on the lift. Rear seal leakage was a common problem with Chevys at the time. Worked with sticks and autos.
To do a Fiero, I can't see any reason not to pivot the cradle and do it that way. SO much easier.
Good luck with whichever direction you decide!

------------------
Life is just SO much better when you own AND drive a Fiero!

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