i heard one of the reasons the fiero stopped being produced was lotus filed a suit against GM for the suspension and look of the fiero in 88? is this true or did it not sell enough cars.

Nope the the suspension in the 88 is not from lotus it was a one and only design from gm with i think lotus inspired features. ferrari did sue GM for the 87-88 meras which were a rebody from the dealership pretty much. Than I herd they were affecting corvette sales which is a big no no withn the company. I have herd a bunch of storys but who knows.

It's all about the sales!

The official answer is that projected sales for the future models wouldn't be a profit, although I'm pretty sure every year the Fiero was developed it was a profit. =/

quote Originally posted by N3M3S1S: The official answer is that projected sales for the future models wouldn't be a profit, although I'm pretty sure every year the Fiero was developed it was a profit. =/

yep. i dont know where, but someone posted the sales figures for fieros, and they consistently outsold all other 2 seater cars put together. i guarantee thats a profit. my guess is it was hurting vettes sales, so they killed it off. they let personal preference come before the good of the company, which is what led to their downfall.

http://www.nytimes.com/1988...g-pontiac-fiero.html

G.M. to Stop Building Pontiac Fiero
By JOHN HOLUSHA, Special to the New York Times
Published: Wednesday, March 2, 1988

Production of the Pontiac Fiero, a car hailed for its innovative design and manufacturing process when it was introduced in 1983, will stop at the end of the current model year, the General Motors Corporation said today.

Executives of G.M.'s Pontiac division attributed the Fiero's demise to increased competition and slumping sales of sporty two-seat cars. But angry workers here, who will lose their jobs when the plant making the model closes in August, say the company skimped on the Fiero's engineering development and advertising in favor of other car lines.

The car also suffered when all of the 1984 models were recalled for problems that had led to several hundred engine failures and fires. Potential Labor Problems

G.M. executives said the Fiero's sole production facility was not being permanently closed, but they acknowledged that no production is planned for the plant for at least several years. The shutdown of the plant, which once had 2,300 employees, could pose labor problems for G.M., which had promised the United Automobile Workers union a moratorium on plant closings last year in return for cooperation on productivity and quality programs.

The Fiero includes several features that were firsts for American automobiles in the modern era. The engine of the low two-seat car is between the driver and the rear wheels, as in Indianapolis racers, and the chassis is a drivable metal frame covered by removable plastic panels that resist dents and will not corrode.

Sales in the first model year, which totaled more than 125,000, far exceeded the expectations of G.M., which had internally predicted about 30,000. But sales have since fallen, and only 47,156 Fieros were sold in the 1987 model year.

J. Michael Losh, the general manager of Pontiac, said the success of the Fiero had attracted competing models, which include the Honda CRX and Toyota MR2, to the two-seat market segment, while the introduction of sporty four-passenger coupes attracted buyers away from two-seat cars. In 1984, he said, the two-seat segment amounted to 335,000 cars, compared with only 265,000 anticipated sales this year. Criticism of G.M. Auto enthusiasts and Fiero plant workers contend that sales suffered because the company neglected to make improvements, such as adding power steering. More than half of all Fieros have been sold to women, and without the power assist considerable strength was required for parallel parking, a characteristic that might have turned away prospective buyers. ''We told the engineers in 1984 that it needed power steering,'' said Dick Long, a vice president of U.A.W.'s Local 653.

Harold Cox, president of the local, said Pontiac seemed to spend more money advertising and promoting other models, including its South Korean-made LeMans. ''All these products that are flooding our shores get all the promotion,'' he said.

When Fiero production ceases, about 1,100 workers will join 1,200 already on layoff. G.M. executives had nothing but praise for the workers, who had agreed to accept major changes in their work practices to obtain work on the Fiero.

''The Fiero plant is recognized as a leader in G.M. in terms of joint practices, high quality and productivity,'' said David Campbell, a G.M. vice president.

A version of this article appeared in print on Wednesday, March 2, 1988, on section D page 5 of the New York edition.

One of the four reasons listed in a Fiero book I had was the sales numbers. Although in total it is one of teh most successful cras Pontiac has sold, it suffered in the latter years. Another reason is listed as "we just could not get past the stigma of the fires from the 84s." That impacted sales a great deal. I guess no matter what the reason you give it still will float back to sales. There are probably political influences such as racing successes over a certain GM flagship, etc. that could be true but in the end it was killed. Sad.

Wow they killed the Fiero and now they are failing, serves them right!

Regardless of any other reasons, if sales had been at acceptable levels, they'd still be making Fieros today. Poor marketing, lack of improvements, internal competition with the "other" two seater or competition from off shore two and four seaters and union issues aside or inspite of, if our beloved passion had made money, they'd still be making it.

Ron

Seemed foolish to put tons of money into the '88 model to not make them a year later. It was just getting good. A better powerplant might have helped, the 2.5 and 2.8 weren't quite up to the task.

I favor the line around "affecting corvette sales". The corvette is a don't touch image within the GM world. If you read the article around sales, the expectation was around 30,000 units. The sales numbers far exceeded that figure. So, it can't be sales alone. It also seems strange to dump $$'s into a new design, the '89 model to only end up scraping it in the end.

Go figure........... my 2cents

Cajun

There were a lot of politics involved and no one simple reason.

But here in a nut shell is what I got from two people who inolved with the Fiero. Also part of this was based on the confidential paperwork I was permitted to read.

The Fiero was originally set to be built with the GM 80 [FWD F body] The GM 80 was canceled.

Pontiac over built the first couple years of the Fiero to keep the plant capacity up. In doing so they were taking a chance to hurt future sales.

Once the GM 80 was cancled they had a plant that could build 250,000 cars building just over 30,000 Fieros. An number Pontiac expected but had planced to share with asnother car to keep the plant viable.

The Fiero then became a target of the Corvette program. They wanted a C5 but with their sales dropping and money tight even they had to fight for the C5. THey saw a more powerful Fiero as a possible way to lose sales and a threat of the loss of future sales on a Vette with a increasing price.

The bad press was hurting the Fiero as Loshe call in the pricipals. GM had several plans presented but came in with the intent to kill the car. They did.

The Vette people pushed the Chevy people to get GM to kill the car and they did. As John Schineilla said Chevy sells more car and Chevy get more say.

Needless to say the hard feeling went on for almost 20 years after with in GM. It is still something some still with GM will not talk about as it could hurt them in the future.

The lack of this info to the public and others not talking till they retired are a testimate of the political fight with in GM vs Pontiac. I hope someday someone publishes the truth if full details and names names.

quote Originally posted by pontiackid86: ferrari did sue GM for the 87-88 meras which were a rebody from the dealership pretty much. .

Ferrari never sued GM. They took Corporate Concepts to court over copying the design of the 308 Ferrari. Ferrari has never sued and won any money from any kit car manufacturer. They just litigate them to the point they give up because they can not afford to keep defending themselves in court. In the long run Corporate Concepts would have won but the cost was too much and the Fiero was being canceled anyway.

Rodney Dickman
Mera Registry

i still think a 2010 fiero would have saved Pontiac...

R.I.P.

(however, i'm glad that they're dead, rather than govermant-owned.)

They quit making them becuase the crates of spare Chevette and Lotus parts got used up!

quote Originally posted by katatak: It's all about the sales!

I heard that the Corvette got scared.......the little mid engine car was kicking it's butt in the performance department....or soon to be.

*sarcasim* And the mighty General put his foot down and said......"no other GM car will best the Vette".*sarcasim*

[This message has been edited by kyunderdawg (edited 10-05-2009).]

quote Originally posted by Rodney: Ferrari never sued GM. They took Corporate Concepts to court over copying the design of the 308 Ferrari. Ferrari has never sued and won any money from any kit car manufacturer. They just litigate them to the point they give up because they can not afford to keep defending themselves in court.

True. The still do this to anyone selling a kit on the internet. The big F corporation versus the little guy.


As for the Fiero, the official answer was as stated...low sales and market saturation for 2 seaters. It kills me that the Miata came out the following year, (as a 1990) and went on to become the most popular 2 seater of all time.

quote Originally posted by johnyrottin: One of the four reasons listed in a Fiero book I had was the sales numbers. Although in total it is one of teh most successful cras Pontiac has sold, it suffered in the latter years. Another reason is listed as "we just could not get past the stigma of the fires from the 84s." That impacted sales a great deal. I guess no matter what the reason you give it still will float back to sales. There are probably political influences such as racing successes over a certain GM flagship, etc. that could be true but in the end it was killed. Sad.

I was a District Sales Manager for Pontiac during those years and this about sums it up. Those will say that Chevy killed it and others will say that it was making a profit but I remember when i had to turn down production allotments week after week in 87 and 88 because most of my dealers had a lot full of unsold Fieros and refused to take anymore. The Press was all over the 84 due to fires and recalls and by that time the car was damaged goods not to mention Nissan and Toyota entered the 2 seat competition.

The final year saw production of about 26,000 Fieros from an underutilized plant that should have been building 200,000 cars. Over 50% of Fieros sold were not GT or Formula but base coupes purchased by women. It had the lowest age of buyer with the average at 25. It also had some of the most expensive insurance rates when the monthly premium often exceeded the car payment to those young buyers.

Seriously I doubt the Fiero ever threatened the Corvette. Think about it.....totally in a different class. Even if it did what kind of numbers are we talking about? The Fieros sales steadily declined after 1984's extended 18 month build. Any wonder? 2 seaters were 1 % of US car sales. Just do the math and then think of the practicality of the car for a family of 3 or more. Even if you are single how many of your friends can you take along on a Saturday night? Take that thought a little farther when you are out crusin for chicks.

Fast forward 25 years or so when gas really is over $3 or more at times and the commuter car idea still looks pretty good. The car was brought to market too early when fuel was still cheap and there were other choices. If the Fiero had been brought to market properly as it was finally done in 1988 with the engine technology we have now I don't think they would have been so quick to turn the lights out on Pontiac but with rising fuel costs let's face it performance cars the masses will become extinct someday much like the performance division of GM.

Even the sacred Corvette is subject to sacrifice someday. Why? Lack of sales translate to little or no profit. When gas hits 7-8 bucks a gallon it will go the way of the Fiero too.

quote Originally posted by Mike Murphy: Even the sacred Corvette is subject to sacrifice someday. Why? Lack of sales translate to little or no profit. When gas hits 7-8 bucks a gallon it will go the way of the Fiero too.

True, but they might offer it with a turbo 4 cylinder instead.....on second thought....nah, they probably would kill it before putting in a 4 banger.

Often overlooked is women were the pricipal Fiero buyers and the safety factor and bad press kept many away,,Fathers ,,brothers male friends said that car catches on fire .stay away from it !!.Most women have no problem turning the steering wheel on a new ,,or an older properly set Fiero..
My faint recollection of the Fiero,when it was being manufactured,, women wanted it..never heard a male say he wanted a Fiero !!!
the only conversation I ever heard about a Fiero ,,amongst a group ?/ I was a bouncer in a topless bar and 3 of the girls wanted a Fiero..Ms.Chelsea bought one

quote Originally posted by hyperv6: The Fiero then became a target of the Corvette program. They wanted a C5 but with their sales dropping and money tight even they had to fight for the C5. THey saw a more powerful Fiero as a possible way to lose sales and a threat of the loss of future sales on a Vette with a increasing price. The Vette people pushed the Chevy people to get GM to kill the car and they did. As John Schineilla said Chevy sells more car and Chevy get more say.

This is total bunk. The book "All Corvettes Are Red" by Popular Mechanics editor James Schefter (now deceased) is the definitive and candid history of the development of the C5 Corvette inside GM, and I've read it cover to cover several times. Nowhere did it ever mention the Fiero. The C5 team had more than enough problems of its own and they couldn't have cared less what was going on with Fiero. Not to mention that C5 development didn't even begin until 1989, after the ZR-1 development was completed. It's only been recently that Dave McClellan has come out and admitted that the Fiero was the outgrowth of the stillborn mid-engine Corvette program of the 60s and 70s. We now know that "Turbo 2.8 Fiero" you guys like to talk about was actually a Corvette prototype, not a Fiero.

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