I have always thought of the Fiero as being a unique design and later copied by others like the Toyota MR2 and Nissan Pulsar until I saw this ad at e-bay http://cgi.ebay.com/Bertone...C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 and then I looked it up at Wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_X1/9 The Bertone had been around considerably longer. Makes me wonder if this is how Hulki got his inspiration for the Fiero design.
The Fiero design goes all the way back to the 1969 Pontiac X4 concept car. It was featured in Popular Science magazine (April 1969). It looks sort of like the Fiat also, but did they have a Fiat X1/9 in 1969?
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02:53 PM
Gokart Member
Posts: 4635 From: Mashpee, Ma. USA Registered: May 99
Originally posted by pumpkincarriage: I'd say it's pretty likely, especially when compared to the very first sketches of the Fiero, back from '79 or so. I love the X1/9's... If I could find one in halfway decent shape I would own it (ha, ha I know the odds of that).
I wonder how many were actually here in North America?! I had never seen one until that e-bay ad.
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Originally posted by pswayne: The Fiero design goes all the way back to the 1969 Pontiac X4 concept car. It was featured in Popular Science magazine (April 1969). It looks sort of like the Fiat also, but did they have a Fiat X1/9 in 1969?
The Wiki page under history says: "The X1/9 started life in 1969 as a show concept car called the Autobianchi A112 Runabout, with styling by Bertone under chief designer Marcello Gandini." So we may never really know which was designed first!
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04:02 PM
Patrick Member
Posts: 38416 From: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada Registered: Apr 99
Pontiac did have some X1/9's in hand during the design process, at least according to what I've read. I know Bob Dorn (Pontiac's chief engineer at the time) has said they bought a few of them to examine.
From memory Pontiac consorted many designs before they designed the Fiero sadly, in the end of the Fiero's production the car's reputation was ruined. Here is a few more great cars like the fiero's design. Well... some of them where
Bricklin V1 1974-1976
Triumph TR7-8 1974-1980
Porsche 914 1970-1976?
[This message has been edited by FieroJimm (edited 11-23-2008).]
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04:30 PM
Patrick Member
Posts: 38416 From: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada Registered: Apr 99
Originally posted by Patrick: So, does this layout look familiar? Read about this beautiful car produced from '79-'85 and never sold in North America Here.
Wow does that hit home. At first glance I thought it was a Fiero! Here some info about it at Wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_Cars You'll have to scroll down to AC 3000ME. Marc
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05:36 PM
PFF
System Bot
88 Formula Member
Posts: 608 From: Baden, PA USA Registered: Aug 2003
There were quite a few Fiat X1/9's sold here in early 70's, I think 72 or 73 was first year for them. I had one in 80's, Several members here have talked about having one. They had 1.3 and 1.5 liter engines. The 1.5s in later years got fuel injection. They all had Targa tops that stowed neatly just under the front hood. There main problem was rust. Complete shock towers would separate from the body. They were a blast to drive, low powered but you never had to come off the throttle in a turn. The stock redline was around 6800 rpm. With a quad exhaust they sounded like a Formula 1 car.
I have always thought of the Fiero as being a unique design and later copied by others like the Toyota MR2 and Nissan Pulsar until I saw this ad at e-bay http://cgi.ebay.com/Bertone...C39% 3A1%7C240%3A1318 and then I looked it up at Wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_X1/9 The Bertone had been around considerably longer. Makes me wonder if this is how Hulki got his inspiration for the Fiero design.
Truth of the matter is that once more compact front drive transmissions became available, doing a cheap mid engine car became a viable option for the larger manufacturers. The X1/9, the Fiero, the MR2- they are all layed out almost identically with a front drive drivetrain mounted mid ships. Once it was done, others were sure to give it a try if they thought it was a viable product! Let's not forget the discussion about the Fiero possibly being part of a stillborn mid engined V6 Vette Program as mentioned in one the Corvette History books either. Again, a large part of the run on mid engine layouts was precipitated by the newer front drive drivetrains because they were off the shelf and cheap compared to previous mid engined drivetrains, specifically the transmissions.
[This message has been edited by FieroFanatic13 (edited 11-24-2008).]
They are out there. These people are but one company supporting the Fiats including the lil X 1/9. BTW: they look really cool when setup for road racing with the windshield cut down and wider fenders. They were very popular road race cars for years overseas.
I purchased a garage kept X1/9 with under 50K miles and it was already rotting (holes big enough to stick your fist through).
The best deviating from the X1/9 is the ample leg room in the fiero (I barely fit in the X1/9). The worst deviation is probably the lack of Targa for the fiero.
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05:48 PM
PFF
System Bot
wftb Member
Posts: 3692 From: kincardine,ontario,canada Registered: Jun 2005
another fiat to check out was the 850 spyder .rear engine air cooled .mid 60's car .also brought in to canada .fiats were horrible rust buckets .i wonder if they lasted better in europe?
At the 20th Anniversary, Hulki mentioned that the Fiat was part of their testing. I am paraphrasing, one would need to pull the video out to get his exact words, I am working away from home and do not have it handy. He mentioned they put Bob Stempel, Then GM Presdident in a X1/9, to give him a feel for what they wanted to build. Stempel was a very big man, tall and large. He basically got stuck in the Bertone and was very cramped for leg room. Hulki said that everyone was instructed to make sure the Fiero had a lot of interior room in it.
Again I am paraphrasing, and this may not be 100% the story. If you do a google search for the 20th Anniv. it may still be out there on youtube or another video site. Look for Hulki's speech.
The first 2 pictures are of Fiat X1/9's I saw a month ago at Italian Car Day. The last picture is another interesting little Italian car, its a Lancia Scorpion, rear-engine RWD with a targa top I think.
I considered getting a X1/9 last spring for $500 but it didn't run and it was rusted as f**k. I guess those are common traits for X1/9's . From what I've heard most X1/9's don't have rust-proofing on their frames/bodies, so they rust extremely easily. I've heard of them rusting brand new in dealership parking lots because people didn't buy them. I would buy one though if I ever found a running 1 for a cheap price that wasn't rusty as hell.
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10:37 PM
Nov 25th, 2008
Erik Member
Posts: 5625 From: Des Moines, Iowa Registered: Jul 2002
another fiat to check out was the 850 spyder .rear engine air cooled .mid 60's car .also brought in to canada .fiats were horrible rust buckets .i wonder if they lasted better in europe?
The 850 is not air cooled....none of the 5-800cc Fiats where.
Here is the one that is sitting in my garage.
Before Engine Pic....note the Rad/water pump, hoses and such.
The rest of the photos can be seen here...it is not 56k friendly.
That is a very nice Lancia. Fiats rusted no worse then any other car of the time, just with american cars there was so much more of them....When was the last time you saw an Pinto, Vega, or any other american small car from that era, or car period. In fact have you ever seen a 240-280z that was not restored....talk about rust buckets....everything back then rusted...In fact I would say that if not for the material that the body of the Fiero is made of it would be as big a rust bucket as any fiat....just like any other american car from the 80's
Fiats are great little cars, parts are a little difficult but there are sources for just about everything.
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04:11 PM
Francis T Member
Posts: 6620 From: spotsylvania va. usa Registered: Oct 2003
My 78 Fiat 124 spider also has rust issues! Need to replace both doors and do fenderwell work AGAIN. Has a realy built engine and custom interior but I've had it with the rusting thing. Id will sell it once I get it fixed up and painted. Gotta love that plastic Fiero body. BTW: I sold my 340 69 cuda -org owner too- for the same reasons.
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05:24 PM
RACE Member
Posts: 4842 From: Des Moines IA Registered: Dec 2002
. From what I've heard most X1/9's don't have rust-proofing on their frames/bodies, so they rust extremely easily. I've heard of them rusting brand new in dealership parking lots because people didn't buy them. I would buy one though if I ever found a running 1 for a cheap price that wasn't rusty as hell.
