Looking for some input.

I've been enjoying my Formula for several years now in stock form, fixing it up a bit as I go along, while saving up money for an engine swap, etc. Now, I'm close to pulling the trigger on the next phase of my project, but I'm debating what direction to go.

For the money I'm planning to spend on my Fiero, I could buy an old muscle car (or LS1 Firebird, for that matter). I've been looking at some late 60's to 70's Firebirds and Trans Ams, and have found a few good candidates for pretty good prices. Of course, these cars would need work, too, so in the end it would likely be more expensive to buy and fix up an old muscle car, but I'd also have my Fiero for my economy car.

Hmmm, decisions, decisions...
V8 Fiero, custom wheels, new paint job, etc.
LS1 Formula/TA, and keep the Fiero stock...
455 Trans Am, and stock Fiero...

Not really looking for advice so much as tossing some ideas around. Discuss.

You have another car for transportation don't you? (Don't you have a Solstice?) If so, I'd say stick with modding the Fiero. It's no investment, but they sure are fun to drive, especially when you've got all kinds of custom work done to 'em, like an engine swap.

quote Originally posted by Cheever3000: You have another car for transportation don't you? (Don't you have a Solstice?) If so, I'd say stick with modding the Fiero. It's no investment, but they sure are fun to drive, especially when you've got all kinds of custom work done to 'em, like an engine swap.

Daily driver is a '99 Grand Am. The Fiero's a toy, so I can pretty much do whatever I want with it.
I've always been a die hard Firebird fan. My first car was a '69 Firebird 350, and my second was a '72 Trans Am. But, I have to admit I think the biggest grin I had on my face was the first time Clem gave me a ride in his LT1 88 GT.

So, regardless of what I do, I'll still have the Grand Am. Of course, that adds another option, too. If I go with a late model LS1 car, I could sell the Grand Am and drive the LS1 as my daily driver. That makes the effective price of the late model car a bit more attractive.

You're right, though. As much fun as a Fiero can be stock - do some work to them and it's a laugh.

Buy an LSx car (Firebird whatever), total it without hurting anyone or the engine, buy it back from the insurance company, put the engine in the Fiero, then buy a 60's muscle car. Think outside the box.

Jim

[This message has been edited by jimbolaya (edited 02-19-2008).]

quote Originally posted by jimbolaya: Buy an LSx car (Firebird whatever), total it without hurting anyone or the engine, buy it back from the insurance company, put the engine in the Fiero, then buy a 60's muscle car. Think outside the box. Jim

Why do that when I could just buy a crate LS2? The box is cheaper than a whole car.
And no problems with insurance investigations.

[This message has been edited by Formula88 (edited 02-19-2008).]

if u know a auto body guy with the paper work to buy a car from the crashed-car actions, tell him to find u a totaled low millage LS? Camaro. the use the engine and interior on the fiero and sell the rest of the good parts off the camaro and then scrap whats left. that way you save money and have a sweet car

thats what im thinking of doing for my fiero only i will put in a 3.4 and ill sell the camaro interior (i love that boxy look of the fiero interior)

Tough call.
I have also been looking at other cars, my car already has the V8 installed, body work is started but my eye still seems to stray.

quote Originally posted by Formula88: Why do that when I could just buy a crate LS2? The box is cheaper than a whole car. And no problems with insurance investigations.

It was a joke. The point was to be able to get an engine for free, and still get the 60's muscle car.

Jim

My question for you would be this: What do you want to do for long term? Where do you want to end up?

If the answer is anything other than a modded Fiero, then you already know the answer. I say this because you mentioned modding your Fiero, not because I think that is the ultimate thing to do. If, the muscle car is your ultimate dream ride, then that's the direction you should go.
If, on the other hand a modded Fiero is your goal, then your options are much greater IMHO. Though I love muscle cars of all types, they are pretty much straight line competitors and my personal opinion is that just about anyone can hit the gas and go in a straight line for a block or two. A Fiero though is a whole different category of car, you can do so many more things with a Fiero, you can go straight line racing or you can auto cross or road rally, and there are other options. So, I ask you, where do you want to go?

------------------
Ron

It's the Soldier, not the reporter
Who has given us the freedom of the press.
It's the Soldier, not the poet,
Who has given us the freedom of speech.
It's the Soldier, not the politicians
That ensures our right to Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness.
It's the Soldier who salutes the flag,
Who serves beneath the flag,
And whose coffin is draped by the flag.

I think with the prediction that gas is going to hit $4 to 5 bucks a gallon by this summer, our auto hobbies aren't going to be as much fun this year, and it get harder to justify anything that's going to cost you more money at the pump. I currently have 33 inch tires on my Jeep Wrangler, but just bought a kit to move up to 35s, which means less gas milage. Luckily I live close to work, but the cost of gas does impact my discreationary funds. On the one hand you want to have fun, on the other, you want to be smart.

quote Originally posted by ChopTop: I think with the prediction that gas is going to hit $4 to 5 bucks a gallon by this summer

"They" have been saying that for at least three years now.

I think the uniqueness (izat a word?) of a Fiero with a V8 makes it much more desireable than one of thousands of Firebirds and Camaros out there.

quote Originally posted by ChopTop: I think with the prediction that gas is going to hit $4 to 5 bucks a gallon by this summer, our auto hobbies aren't going to be as much fun this year, and it get harder to justify anything that's going to cost you more money at the pump. I currently have 33 inch tires on my Jeep Wrangler, but just bought a kit to move up to 35s, which means less gas milage. Luckily I live close to work, but the cost of gas does impact my discreationary funds. On the one hand you want to have fun, on the other, you want to be smart.

Good point. Even a LS2 Fiero will still get better gas mileage than a 455, though.

In the long run, I'll probably have a modded Fiero and a muscle car. I guess I'm debating on which to do first. But if I get a muscle car, I might be tempted to do something other than a V8 for the Fiero, since I'd already have a V8 toy.

I want one of everything. Is that too much to ask?

start looking for a decent 5sp duke powered fiero deal. you know runs good (for a duke that is) and not too bad looking. something you can drive and try to resist throwing too much cash at.

when you find it, trade or sell the grand am in for or on the muscle car you want.

hopefully you end up with the muscle car you want, a cheap fiero for when you feel the need for a fiero fix, and you can work on the formula at whatever pace you are able.

once you finish it you can sell the beater fiero or give it a little love last, or just maintain it as your economy car.

I'd either go with dropping a V8 in the Fiero, of picking up a vintage Trans Am as a toy. The LS1's are nice, and probably be reliable if you wanted to use it as a DD, but a vintage T/A would be far more fun... IMO. The LS1 certainly are fast, but I always felt they seemed a little big too. Now, a 79 Trans Am... perfect (if you can find one with the 400 cid Pontiac motor and not the Olds 403. Or rip all that out and drop in a 455.

quote Originally posted by Fformula88: I'd either go with dropping a V8 in the Fiero, of picking up a vintage Trans Am as a toy. The LS1's are nice, and probably be reliable if you wanted to use it as a DD, but a vintage T/A would be far more fun... IMO. The LS1 certainly are fast, but I always felt they seemed a little big too. Now, a 79 Trans Am... perfect (if you can find one with the 400 cid Pontiac motor and not the Olds 403. Or rip all that out and drop in a 455.

Well, eventually, I WILL have a '79 W72 TA. (400 4-speed, WS6). The last year of the Pontiac 400. I'd like to find one in a Tenth Anniversary TA, but a W72 TATA brings big money now. If not a TATA, I'd like to find one in Nocturn Blue with the Camel tan interior and gold graphics. Beautiful.

Heck, I wouldn't mind a 301 4-speed TA. Fun to cruise in (even if desparately slow), and all the parts are already there to drop in a 400 or 455 at a later date.

I do have a line on a '74 TA, 455 auto. The two major downsides are what appears to be minor rust (rear quarters) and no-AC.

Another one I want for the stable eventually is a 2002 Firebird Formula 6-speed, Navy Blue Metallic w/ the Tan leather interior. They only made about 900 Formulas in 2002 because everyone was buying loaded Trans Ams since it was the last year of production.

So I guess I'm debating more the order in which I do things rather than what to do.

I have always wanted an older C3 Vette. Even made some offers on some local ones for sale. I would love to have one in the drive way.

quote Originally posted by Formula88: Well, eventually, I WILL have a '79 W72 TA. (400 4-speed, WS6). The last year of the Pontiac 400. I'd like to find one in a Tenth Anniversary TA, but a W72 TATA brings big money now. If not a TATA, I'd like to find one in Nocturn Blue with the Camel tan interior and gold graphics. Beautiful. Heck, I wouldn't mind a 301 4-speed TA. Fun to cruise in (even if desparately slow), and all the parts are already there to drop in a 400 or 455 at a later date. I do have a line on a '74 TA, 455 auto. The two major downsides are what appears to be minor rust (rear quarters) and no-AC. Another one I want for the stable eventually is a 2002 Firebird Formula 6-speed, Navy Blue Metallic w/ the Tan leather interior. They only made about 900 Formulas in 2002 because everyone was buying loaded Trans Ams since it was the last year of production. So I guess I'm debating more the order in which I do things rather than what to do.

I am a big fan of the old TA's. My uncle has had a 79 with the Olds 403 since new, bright yellow with black interior, bright red and orange bird on the hood. Looks fabulous, and he has done a lot of work on the engine too. No idea what kind of power he is putting down, but it is rediculously fast! I remember him taking me for rides in my younger days, and after I had my license teaching me the ins and outs of a proper burnout with it! His only regret is the Olds 403 instead of the Pontiac 400 under the hood.

I always figured I would own a T/A someday, but it hasn't happened. I ended up bitten by the Fiero bug as an impressionable youth too, and that is sort of where my loyalties have been for toy cars! Next up probably will be a Solstice (maybe why Cheaver3000 thought you had one... mixup on the oh so close screenames).

Sounds like a good plan to me. A classic T/A, LS1 Formula, and a modified Fiero! Only problem your going to have is selecting which key to grab! Good luck!

the supercharged cobalt engine looks best, its lighter, more powerful, and durable than the older engines. plus you get much better gas milage and a 6spd trans.

quote Originally posted by megafreakindeth: the supercharged cobalt engine looks best, its lighter, more powerful, and durable than the older engines. plus you get much better gas milage and a 6spd trans.

FWIW, the Cobalt has a 5 speed stick.

Anyway, those are nice engines, but they have already been more or less antiquated by the SIDI 2.0L turbo ecotecs in the Solstice, Sky, HHR SS, and a Cobalt SS not available yet (replacing the s-charged motor). Dual scroll turbo, direct injection, variable timing, 55 more HP than the s-charged Cobalt motor, and city mileage in the 20's. However, I suspect he isn't interested in 4 banger engines...

quote Originally posted by Fformula88: FWIW, the Cobalt has a 5 speed stick. Anyway, those are nice engines, but they have already been more or less antiquated by the SIDI 2.0L turbo ecotecs in the Solstice, Sky, HHR SS, and a Cobalt SS not available yet (replacing the s-charged motor). Dual scroll turbo, direct injection, variable timing, 55 more HP than the s-charged Cobalt motor, and city mileage in the 20's. However, I suspect he isn't interested in 4 banger engines...

No real interest in a 4 banger, but if I were - the turbo Ecotec would be at the top of the list. What a freakin' awesome engine!