quote Originally posted by edhering: and surprise the heck out of a few people once in a while.

I find it very hard to suprise anyone with my 4.9 ,I have had quite a few occasions where someone was ready to race me then backed out once they heard the car. To me if they chicken out it's better than beating them in a race

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100% USDA Certified
1988 GT Black W/Beechwood Interior & 17" ADR Battle Exe's
Want a 4.9 Installed into your Fiero? PBJ can do it!
My ¼ mile time.
The Cadero Registry.

quote Originally posted by linenoise: I find it very hard to suprise anyone with my 4.9 ,I have had quite a few occasions where someone was ready to race me then backed out once they heard the car. To me if they chicken out it's better than beating them in a race

Ahh, but what you describe is EXACTLY the kind of surprise I was talking about...

Ed

I have the sbc swap and enjoy it very much. But would also like to add the 4.9 to my collection someday. Why is it when someone see's a v-8 in the back the first question is HOw FAst Will it GO? I built mine not to race, just to enjoy the rumble and surprize on ones face when they look in there and see the V-8. 200 HP is plenty of hp to go out and enjoy a nice ride in one of these cars. JMO
Thanks Gary
Have A Nice Day

Well again I want to thank you all for telling me and others about the good points of the 4.9. I can see why this is such a good choice for Fiero owners that want performance on a budget, with the rumble of a V8. I can relate to those that wish there wasn't a lack of aftermarket, and with my choosen swap ( 3.4 DOHC Turbo ) there is next to nothing but i knew this going into it and that is ok. I can see how this is a great "dare I say" entry level V8 that still packs a good punch to those that use it to raise the level of performance in their Fiero. I can honestly say that I have a new respect for the 4.9 because of the people on the forum who took the time to post their views and interests.

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still plays with cars..

Wow I am on a budget and this sounds just like what i might be looking for,..some added burst and an awesome rumble.

Can someone give me some numbers on what i can expect to pay for hte engine and the swap if i choose not to do it myself ?
Kento buddy i may be calling on your knowledge after you do your swap.

How does the sound of the 4.9 compare to a ZZ3 motor ? A guy, Tom Corey, had one (the ZZ3) in his GT at the Florida Fantasy of Flight gathering, and MY God that think sounded awesome !

A Good rumble is essential.

quote Originally posted by exoticse: How does the sound of the 4.9 A Good rumble is essential.

Here is a video of a 4.9 no muffler or cat, just a turbo

http://www.alcanada.com/other/FieroDrag.wmv

Pete

quote Originally posted by PBJ: Here is a video of a 4.9 no muffler or cat, just a turbo

That was AWESOME!!

I wish I had a video of ole choppy at the track. It probably sounded a lot like that, but without the turbo and with a muffler and Cat. But a lot like that though.

Why I have a 4.9, well. COST!!!!!!!!!
I wanted a v8 and was saving up for a sbc kit. I had e-mail V8 Archie and he answered all my questions and I was set. I had saved up $1000.oo Canadian. Then one day while on the net I stumbled on to bubbajoe's site and WOW, a v8 that didn't need a kit that I hadn't been able to save up all the money for anyways. I am no mechanic so I started checking around for some one to do the work. To make a long story short I got a engine and it installed in the car for less than the cost of the adapter kit. I had even called a company out west (in Canada) for the cost of parts for a V6 swap (still $1500.oo canadian).
I keep thinking that I would like to build (have built) another fiero with/for my oldest son, he likes auto's so if he wants I will lean towards a 3800sc (something different) stock engine and auto tranny.

Thanks PBJ very kewl video. 12.8 sec Fiero there very nice. How many pounds of boost, do you know? Just curious.

Absolutely marvelous video, Pete...almost felt sorry for the poor Vette driver, you really get an idea of how far behind he was, if you watch the two cars and when they each cross the shadows across the track. Smokin'!!!

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'88 Formula - 4.9 conversion by The Fiero Factory
Shifter surround resto by Fierotech
SUPPORT YOUR FIERO MERCHANTS
Proud member of the Lightbar Fraternity
PFF Supporting Member
"He who does not oppose evil, commands that it be done!" ----Leonardo da Vinci

quote Originally posted by FieroGT87: Thanks PBJ very kewl video. 12.8 sec Fiero there very nice. How many pounds of boost, do you know? Just curious.

We are running 7-8 psi of boost, Intercooled, With a best of 12.2 @ 114 mph in the 1/4

Pete

Lets all note that the vette in that video ran 14.57@95, You never really hear people bashing vettes as being slow. But we have heard bashing against the 4.9 for being slow, yet my best run on my stock 4.9 turned in 14.1@97 And I'll bet that you can't buy a vette in as good of condition as my fiero for what I have into mine

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100% USDA Certified
1988 GT Black W/Beechwood Interior & 17" ADR Battle Exe's
Want a 4.9 Installed into your Fiero? PBJ can do it!
My ¼ mile time.
The Cadero Registry.

I'm sure this has been covered many times before, but is it true that the 4.9 is limited to being used with an automatic tranny? If so, that's reason enough why a lot of us would never consider using it.

quote Originally posted by Patrick: I'm sure this has been covered many times before, but is it true that the 4.9 is limited to being used with an automatic tranny? If so, that's reason enough why a lot of us would never consider using it.

Not at all! You can use a manual with the 4.9. If you want fuel injection, there are some issues with what years you can use as IIRC the ECMs for the later ones expect an automatic transmission and set codes if they don't see one.

OTOH it's possible to carb a 4.9, get all the performance of the PFI version, and do away with ECM almost entirely. Basically I think it comes down to personal preference....

Ed

PS All info is IIRC and YMMV!

quote Originally posted by Patrick: I'm sure this has been covered many times before, but is it true that the 4.9 is limited to being used with an automatic tranny? If so, that's reason enough why a lot of us would never consider using it.

I have driven a Isuzu 5 spd 4.9 Fiero and am using the Same tranny for my 4.9 swap.

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4.9 Caddy in Garage! Car in Driveway! ACK!

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http://home.cfl.rr.com/fierose
Central Florida Fieros
http://www.centralfloridafieros.org

Proud Member and founder of the DOWN SOUTH SUNNY WINTER PICK ON SNOW PEOPLE COALITION!

Thanks guys, I stand corrected!

This has been a great thread, no flames and some folks actually got some good info out of it; and laid a few myth-conceptions to rest (for now).

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'88 Formula - 4.9 conversion by The Fiero Factory
Shifter surround resto by Fierotech
SUPPORT YOUR FIERO MERCHANTS
Proud member of the Lightbar Fraternity
PFF Supporting Member
"He who does not oppose evil, commands that it be done!" ----Leonardo da Vinci

More info for Patrick The 4.9 can be bolted to the Fieros transmissions. Thus reducing the need for special axles.
I believe all but one bolt hole lines up and a simple L shaped adaptor can be made to fix that if it bugs you enough.

It is a direct fit and all holes line up but there ar certain pitfalls that I discovered first hand during a recent swap,some of the flywheels that is sold by these cheapo discount parts store are made in China and Mexico and Tiawan or not up to OEM specs and as far as thickness and tolerance and when bolted up to the 4.9 the back of it it will jam the engine solid to the extent that you have to space it for clearance so make sure you have a GM or American made one ..

Thanks M.T.A for the correction. I've researched the 4.9 and several other engines extensively. I guess I was mistaken about the one bolt hole. Now I'm not sure which combination it was. But thanks for the correction I would hate to lead anyone astray with incorrect info.

Thanks again.

Just wish my install would be as easy as the 4.9. But we're talking 1,000 times harder.

The bolt hole you are talking about is on the 4.6 N* V8. It is in a higher location because of the larger 4T80E Tranny. The block needed to make room for the larger gear case. The 4.9 uses a smaller tranny, 4T60E so the bolt patern is the same as a stock GM V6.

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Wow this is a great thread - thanks everyone for sharing all your info and experiences.

I am picking up my first Fiero in 10 years tomorrow, a '86 SE 4spd that has been sitting for a while, but it's all there and no rust. I've been gathering info on all the available swaps by searching the forum for the past several weeks and this thread has convinced me - I'm going to do a 4.9 swap. I was 90% certain this was the route I would go, but this thread was the deciding factor.

Thanks everyone!

VTfiero, I take it your located in Vermont?
If so we are not very far from you, being right next door in NH and all of course

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Fiero5 yes I am in Vermont, I live in Colchester, right outside of Burlington. My shop is in Colchester as well.

I make it over to NH on occasion, usually to pick up a car or parts. You make it to VT often?

To me the 4.x is an ok engine. It's the people that make it go one way or another.
Only a few have gotten the engine anywhere close to its potential... MTA, Rockcrawl, PBJ...
Most of the others are slow.

Personally, I have plans for a '90 4.5 with 1.3L Autorotor supercharger, but we'll see where that goes.

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Turn the key and feel the engine shake the whole car with its lope; Plant the gas pedal and feel in your chest neither a shriek nor a wail but a bellowing roar; Lift and be pushed into the harness by compression braking that only comes from the biggest cylinders while listening to music of pops and gurgles. Know that you are driving an American V8. There are finer engines made, but none of them are this cool.

Luck, Fate and Destiny are words used by those who lack the courage to define their own future

quote Originally posted by VTfiero: Fiero5 yes I am in Vermont, I live in Colchester, right outside of Burlington. My shop is in Colchester as well. I make it over to NH on occasion, usually to pick up a car or parts. You make it to VT often?

Yes I do actually, being right next to the West Lebanon NH/White River Junction VT border helps
You say you have a shop. Is that an auto shop, as in you work on cars and maybe even Fieros?
If so and you are ever looking for a little extra work let me know.
I have a few projects currently in the works that I am about to start looking to get a few things done on.
Let me know

Steve

As far as replacements for the 2.8 go, the 4.9 is a very good choice. They are reliable, get decent fuel mileage and sound cool. Spend some money on them and they can be respectable 1/4 mile runners, if you are concerned with that. They are also nice and light, handling should not be affected at all.

Only problem I have with them are the guys that claim to be able to install them for under $1000 and they look like crap. Like they pulled the motor straight from a miled out junker and used scrap parts to throw it in. Lately there have been some very well done swaps that look great. Its not such a bad looking motor if you put some time into painting it and hiding some wires and hoses.

Fiero5 YGM.....

To make a long story short, I purchased a Testarossa replica off of E-bay. It had a tired 2.8 with an auto. The car looked like a million bucks but I had numerous problems with the drivetrain mainly stalling. It was pretty embarrassing when people would look at the car and I would go to take off and it would stall. I did my research and came to my own conclusion that a 4.9 with the mating transmission and ECM was the way to go. I came accross Ed Park's site. Ed found me a 4.9 out of a wrecked Deville with 23k miles. The cost of the wreck and installation cost me about 7k. I added a small N20 system and for me the swap has been all I could have ever wanted. I realize this isn't a track car but it gets almost 30mpg, sounds awesome and is reliable. I own other fast cars a 84 vette and a 91 vette as well as a 351 stroker 65 Mustang. For everyday driving I prefer the 4.9 in the Fiero/ Testarossa over the other's. Just my opinion. Take care. Bill

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TR-512/ on a 7" 85 Fiero w/ 4.9L

There is no reason to turn any post ugly. We are all here to share in this hobby and have fun. An old saying goes "one mans food is another mans poison" and this illustrates that we all have unique ideas for our powerplant. We can certainly discuss the pros cons merits and disadvantages as we see them as it is not what you say, it's how you say it.
I view the 4.9L as offering the best power increase for the money spent. The engine runs silky smooth on the highway, is economical, and provides awesome bottom end performance. On the other hand the 4.6L Northstar provides a better top end but its a very involved swap and quite a bit more expensive than the 4.9L.
If the objective is just massive horsepower then the SBC is IMO a better choice but that is also a costly swap. All swaps are nice as they involve hours of work to do. As for which engine is best- it's the one that you like the best.

Excellent post Dennis. I think constructive critcism and debate is healthy. I like the conversion so much I am aquiring a Fiero/ Ferari 308 replica and I will be having the same conversion done on that as well. Take care. Bill

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TR-512/ on a 7" 85 Fiero w/ 4.9L

quote Originally posted by crzyone: Only problem I have with them are the guys that claim to be able to install them for under $1000 and they look like crap. Like they pulled the motor straight from a miled out junker and used scrap parts to throw it in. Lately there have been some very well done swaps that look great. Its not such a bad looking motor if you put some time into painting it and hiding some wires and hoses.

The only problem I have with them are people who think if they are not a work of art, they are junk.

I put mine on the road in Nov. 03 and put over 15,000 miles on it. This also includes 5 trips to the dragstrip and MANY trips around the AutoX course. As all on the board who know me can attest, I beat on the car from the time I start it till it is shut down again. It has been very dependable.
Total build cost..... Fiero 400.00, donor Caddy 400.00, install ~400.00. 1200.00= cheap, fun, dependable hotrod.

Last night at the track I got a 14.302 @93.581.

A 4.9 will not be the fastest fiero on the road, but it will be fun to drive, dependable and can be built cheap especially if you are not a "checkbook" builder.

Gene

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87 Notchie 4.9 with Delta Cam, Shaved Heads and lots of tedious porting
87 SE 3.4TDC swap almost done (when it gets warmer out)
87 Notchie Caddy 472 longitudinal coming soon

[This message has been edited by scrabblegod (edited 05-29-2005).]

Well, I had $2500 into my 4.9 and my swap was about 75% complete. I did not feel comfortable installing an old used motor into my fiero, so I had the heads rebuilt, new waterpump, new timing chain, rod bearings, etc etc. If people trust a $400 engine, well thats up to them.

I had $3000 into my 3.4dohc swap and expect to have around $7000 into my N* swap. I flew to Seattle to buy my car and imported it. it will be a mid 12 second car with the stock 300hp N*. At under $15k for car and motor, I still consider it cheap and fun.

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Buy a fiero, become a mechanic

[This message has been edited by crzyone (edited 05-30-2005).]

I am having a 4.9 installed now by Rockcrawl (Jon Lagler) and the engine looks great. I chose the 4.9 because of the reliability, gas milage, and the low end torque at low rpm's. I wanted a car with that good V-8 sound also. If I wnted a 1/4 mile drag strip car it wouldn't have been a Fiero in the first place. The car out handels my old 67 Camaro RS hands down and it was a 12-13 second in the 1/4. My main concern was a car that would just start and run without too much tinkering to keep it running. The 2.8 that Rockcrawl removed didn't give me any problems and still is a very good motor with 50,000 miles on it but as HP & torque goes it's very limited. The 4.9 was the most logical swap for what I wanted and with Rockcrawl doing the job I know it will be done right and with the slight modifications it will have more than the stock HP.

Earl

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1986 FieroGT 2.8

quote Originally posted by crzyone: Well, I had $2500 into my 4.9 and my swap was about 75% complete. I did not feel comfortable installing an old used motor into my fiero, so I had the heads rebuilt, new waterpump, new timing chain, rod bearings, etc etc. If people trust a $400 engine, well thats up to them.

...and the engine does run nice But for some reason I ended up having to replace all the gaskets (heads/intake/oil pan/water pump & inlet)...the only one that wasn't leaking was the front side head gasket - although that was changed as well since I had it all apart and did not want to do it all again.

I was able to hide a good portion of the wires the second go around - hoses are a bit tougher...but you could always close the deck lid and hide it all

Tim

...plus the knob with the 7 series BMW leaves me alone now...

[This message has been edited by Mickey_Moose (edited 05-30-2005).]