At out local Fiero Club Christmas meeting today someone brought in the newest flyer from the Fiero Store. They do not send them to me anymore. I see they are now offering V-6 replacement crossover coolant tubes. Seems they look just like mine since they had a guy in CT buy one each of the 4 types. In my opinion they were used for their benefit. He just "happened" to have 3 friends that needed a crossover coolant tube and they all had the 4 cars that took one of each. I knew right away they were going to the Fiero Store. A Matt Hartzog bought them. I wonder what he got out of the deal. I can't blame a competitor from making a needed product I also make. I do fault them that they bought mine to copy. My guess is they know they will loose some respect but in the long run these things are soon forgotten. I would expect them to start offering more of the products I developed in the future by copying my designs. Sometimes I spend months pondering how to make a part or try several variations to only see it copied by a competitor. Since the last episode I have not had one referral from the Fiero Store. I have continued to send Fiero owners to the Fiero Store when they are the only source. I can not falsely tell a Fiero owner nobody makes a part they need if only the Fiero Store offers it considering what they have done to me in the recent past. Fiero Store wins and we as a group all loose.

One plus is it looks like they are offering a coated steel for $149. Mine are 304 stainless steel and my coated ones are power coated. My price is still lower for a much better product.

Thanks,
Rodney Dickman
New web page! http://www.rodneydickman.com

You'd think they'd learn!!!

Rodney, after all the countless hours of effort you've selfelessly put fourth for all of us, you'd think you'd deserve better than this!

The FieroStore is engauging in some pretty stupid practices these days... watch what happens to their customer base. We'll now look for parts elsewhere, and only buy from them at an absolute last resort. 3/4ths of their products can be had elsewhere at (much) better prices.

Best!
Ben.

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Ben Cannon
88 Formula, T-top, Metalic Red           "Every Man Dies, not every man really Lives"
88 Formula, Northstar, Silver                     -Mel Gibson, "Braveheart"

Hey Rodney I feel bad for ya I am thankful that I don't need this crossover tube right now but, If I did I would surely get one from you sounds like they did not copy you completely as yours seems to be of better quality theres would be what I would call a jap knock off that cost even more than your better quality part.I don't know what else to tell ya these people will always do things like this .I wonder if you can get your stuff patened ? Anyway In the future if I need something that you have rest asured I will order from you

I can't blame them for making them. I would not sell to them which forced them to make them. But they bought one each of mine to copy. That is the point I am trying to make.

Dude, that is so ****ing stupid of them. I can't believe they get away with this kind of stuff, I mean seriously this offends me as a Fiero owner and past-customer of theirs. I'll always buy from Rodney before anyone else, and I'll check every parts store and Fiero yard before sinking to the Fiero Stores level.
Mike Schaefer

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http://surf.to/fiero

DOWN WITH THE FIERO STORE TROLLS!!!!

That does suck but I've got an idea. Rodney, you say the fiero store is the exclusive retailer of some needed fiero parts. Find out which ones they are, buy them all, and copy them! Not only will you get them back, but they will no longer hold a monopoly on certain parts, and without that can certainly be run out of buisness. Fight the power!

*looks at the post above, Brady Bunch style*....ass...

Sounds like a bum deal; perhaps you should contact them and see if this is before or after the last little event?

Bryce
88 GT

Wow, that is pretty wrong of the Fiero Store to do that in my opinion. To be honest, if they developed a crossover tube on their own, I wouldn't mind. But since they bought yours to copy it, well that is definietly not right. I also think it is not very kind that they don't give you referrals anymore. But the fact that you still give referrals to them says a hell of alot about how you care about our Fiero's, and I have to say thank you for that.

Will it stop me buying from the Fiero Store? No, if they have stuff that I need to buy that I can't find in another place, I will buy it from them. But if I have the choice between the Fiero Store and Rodney, I will buy it from Rodney.

By the way, I need to order a catalytic converter this week for my 87GT. Who will I be ordering it from?? Rodney of course

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I wouldn't buy there stuff, just to copy it. More than likely they have the time and money to probably get a patent on it so then they could sue those that copy them. HINT HINT!!! Maybe you should try that Rodney, it's pretty easy nowadays, I don't believe it costs much either.

Rodney, I'm a first time owner of a Fiero, for about 4 days now. Sounds like you know your stuff, and if I need anything I'll check with you first. What's all your info so I can have it. Thanks!

Sorry to hear about that man, that suxors!

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Mark Matthews
'87 GT Fastback T-top

I have come to the conclusion that the Fiero Store is the scum of the earth. They are a true predator. The Microsoft of the Fiero world. They already have 95% of the Fiero market and they are not happy with that. They will not be happy until they acquire the remaining 5%. They are out to destroy the small guy. No question about that!
They pi$$ me off so much that I am willing to add a page on my web site dedicated to cross-reference everything they sell and add other sources for it, just so people can go and buy somewhere else. Not everything they sell is unique you know. I know I will make it a point to make the Fiero Store the very very last place I'd look for a part. Only if it is absolutely necessary.

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Winston Ojeda
88 Formula LT1
Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA
http://www.FieroLT1.com
Home of the Fiero LT1
wojeda@FieroLT1.com

FieroLT1, I'd *love* to see that page when it's ready... I plan on buying everything I can from sources *other* than the Fiero Store... rip-off bastards.

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Patrick W. Heinske -- LZeitgeist@aol.com
1988 Red Fiero Formula
- 1st Place - Stock Coupe - FOCOSEVA 2000
- 3rd Place - Stock Formula - FOCOA Nat'l 2001
- Class Winner - 1982 to Present - Tarheel Tigers All-Pontiac Show 2001

<-- Rodney.. It's like beating you're head on a brick wall.. huh...

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www.thefibersmith.com

Technical Support (903) 825-7744 Steve
Shaved door handles, sidetrim, exhaust outlet's, etc.... smooooth!!!

[This message has been edited by Smoooooth GT (edited 12-10-2001).]

If Rodney sells it, he'll be my *first* choice.
If anybody other than the Fiero Store sells it, the Fiero Store will be my *last* choice. Price be damned.

Rodney,
Would it be worth your trouble to publish a catalog? I know a couple of ravenous Fiero fans (who have purchased from you already, BTW) who are not "computer aware".

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Raydar

From the Department of Redundancy Department.

This is messed up of the Fiero Store to do. I will never buy from them. They have nothing I will ever need. Suspension and brakes will come from held motorsports. Engine will come from GM performance (looking at the nice aluminum 60 Degree V6 with the 4 bolt mains), exterior will come from junk yard or custom made parts. Interior will come from kits and such. Rodney will supply what ever he can to my fiero!!!

I put some of your parts on my my Christmas list this year. And your tach filter is still working. And your dew strip tool helped out big time! I'd always buy from you first over the Fiero Store.

Is there anything that you can do legally to protect your work?

quote Originally posted by Raydar: Rodney, Would it be worth your trouble to publish a catalog? I know a couple of ravenous Fiero fans (who have purchased from you already, BTW) who are not "computer aware".

I was thinking that too. If you want, I can help you with that. I own a printing biz.

Let me know.

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Its never going to be finished...

Fierostore = in it for the money
Rodney Dickman = in it to make the fiero's better and for the love of them.

Who do you think will get the business from this forum?

I wish the fierostore would smarten up.

It certainly is terrible if they are stealing other people's ideas and not developing stuff on their own. I would also be interested to hear their side of the story as well before coming to any concrete opinions.

In many respects the Fiero Store is important to the Fiero community (Rodney is too for the same reasons). They do try to keep parts in production and/or get parts out of production back on the market to keep Fiero's running. The FS however, has a lot more capital to do this on a larger scale. Not many other people are doing this.

As GM continues to discontinue parts, and whats left in stock dries up there will be more and more items that will no longer be available. That will make Rodney and the FS even more important to the Fiero community. It would be nice to see some kind of understanding between the two because the loss of either one could be a catastrophic loss to the community down the road.

I sure would die if my Fiero became junk, or cost a fortune to repair because I needed custom parts made because things were not available.

Ok. So how come no one from the Fiero Store ever posts here to defend their business?

I've purchased almost $800 USD worth of stuff from them in the last couple of years (chip, headers and poly bushings).

There are MANY things that I am looking to get in 2002. While I am not disputing Rodney's story, I would be VERY interested in seeing someone from the Fiero Store clarify things on PFF. In fact, I urge them to do so; threads like this one make me question the credibility of certain vendors.

Not to respond to accusations, hoping that the problem goes away is pretty chicken-$hit.

So, let's hear it, Fiero Store.

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First off, this is not meant to support what the Fiero Store has done. Rodney gets my business before FS, but....

Reverse-engineering is very common in the industry. In making reproduction parts, it's almost required. Typically, you acquire an OEM piece and design your replacement according to it. If no OEM part is available, and another repro is, then I can understand them doing this. Mind you, I said "understand," not "approve of."

Do you think companies like Ames Performance and Year One designed all of their repro's totally from scratch? No. They probably acquired good condition used or NOS parts and used them as a reference.

Rodney, if you have designed a replacement part that doesn't infringe on any patent that Pontiac already has, why not patent your own designs? Some parts you make do the same job as the originals, but are designed differently (i.e. your catalytic converter, metal vacuum lines, rear decklid struts, etc.). If, however, the design you're producing is basically a copy of an unavailable Pontiac part, I see no issue with them using your part to create their own. That's no different than you using an OEM Pontiac part to create your own. The difference lies in your proprietary designs where you've changed or improved upon the original Pontiac desgin. That is your intellectual property and should be protected.

Rodney,
Original 1

My headlites go up and
down.

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I do my business all myself. Maybe I should expand and hire on emplyees and become a real threat to them. If they keep scamming my parts maybe I will.

I have had to buy allot of parts from the Fierostore...the prices on somethings are outrageous and I grit my teeth everytime I have to drop a dollar on them. What really gripes me is once I recieve most of the stuff
it has part numbers from someone else that for some reason no one seems to carry. I have been filing these by brand name and part number for future references so if needed next time I will at least know who is still making it and will be able to search else where by brand or pART # and will try my hardest to find the part elsewhere next time !!!!!. I have bought several things from you Rodney and it has been quality, mostly items I could not find anywhere else. And will continue to check with you first, PLEEEEEZE for myself and all Fiero owners out there do not get discouraged and keep up the good works !!!!

Not that I buy very much if any (cant remember) but there def on my list of DO NOT USE anymore. If Rodney dont have it, Im sure I can find it somewhere else. Maybe at somewhere like Carlisle next spring, everyone should put a note or something up, maybe even printouts from the forum to make everyone aware of what there doing.

BTW Rodney, I havent forgotten doing your tape, Ill do it next day its nice out before I do forget. I just seem to always forget to do it when nothing else is going on.

Im sorry to hear this. All I can say is that I buy products from whomever I feel makes the better product. I even have a coolant crossover pipe (stainless steel) I bought from Rodney. I believe that Rodney's products are superior and would pay more for his because of this. I can't see why they could not have gone to the junkyard and bought their own pipes to reverse engineer. If what Rodney says is true, shame on them!

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Fiero Store has had little unique product that really matters. Most of the parts they have is available thru local or online parts stores. They have managed to get lucky in a few cases and buy some closeouts from some dealer or wholesaler....

They knock off other peoples stuff and present it as unique all the time. They did do some bulk buys on a few cosmetic and novlety items. Valve covers, key chains, mugs, so what.

This is round 2 of them knocking off Rodney's stuff. Their brake products aren't much better. Their version of the Grand Am "upgrade" is a law suite waiting to happen.

Fiero Store gets away with this stuff becuase of the same reason JC Whitless exists. People to lazy and/or dumb to go looking for real stuff or better stuff else where. The fact that many parts stores are run by total pinheads doesn't help.

JC whitless has allot of decent stuff they got as close outs etc. Their repro stuff however is generally low quality. Their catalog has always been a fun read. There's always a good number of snake oil items in it.

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11-Sept-01, The day the world as we knew it ended.

Raydar: Publish that croos - ref.This would be a valuable tool to avoid TFS when at all possible.Hang in there Rodney.You are in the biz for all the right reasons.

quote Originally posted by Rodney: Maybe I should expand and hire on emplyees

I hear MM is available! If you ever start a Southern US franchise, or just want to move here, I will make myself available!

Go Rodney!

I plan on not attending the Chicago Fiero club show this next year. They give away a $500 Fiero Store gift certificate. This next year that money will come from the products they scammed from me. I do not want to be there to see that. I plan on not attending any Fiero show that the Fiero Store sends donations to.

That means you'll have to boycott the Dells Run too Rodney because the Fiero Store also
donates to that show. Come to think of it they donate to most of the mayjor Fiero shows. I can't believe that you're going to do that when you don't even have solid proof that they actually copyed your design at all!

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Dave Gunsul
Activities Director
Northern IL. Fiero Enthusiasts
86 GT modified
85 SE daily driver

The most efficient way of protesting a company's policies is via the marketplace. Simply don't patronize them and either they'll get the message and change policy or ignore the protest and lose patrons.

Perhaps the old agage should be e-mailed to them...."It's easier to keep an old customer than it is to get a new one." Particularly one that will buy overpriced products for a niche car that hasn't been produced for 14 years.

The same question I asked before re: Fiero Store still applies...Is their bottom line so greatly enhanced by this particular product line that they are willing to risk alienating customers in order to offer it?

BTW, Rodney...If you can make a compelling enough presentation and show ON PAPER how you could make a significant impact on the market while generating a profit for investors, there is venture capital out there. One just needs to know where to look.

[This message has been edited by Doni Hagan (edited 12-11-2001).]

My Anti-FS X-Ref web page offer still stands. I will be going on vacation in a couple of days and won't be back until Jan 2. If no one has put one together by then I'll bring it on line then.
I can get all the parts they sell off their catalog and/or their web page. But, I will need to collect other information such as manufacturer part number, a source name, source phone number and/or web page, and est. price.
The manufacturer name and part number being the most important for now. I can research the rest on my own.
My web server can automatically track every new addition they make to their web page and report it to be added to the cross reference.
Example:

84-88 REAR KYB STRUTS
FS Part #: 57606
Manuf. Part #: 234005
est. price: $55/ea
Source: Advance Auto, www.Shockwarehouse.com, www.summitracing.com
In a nice table form easy to read, searcheable engine, by year/engine size/style. You know, just like the big guys.
Even if this does nothing to them, at the very least should be useful for the rest of the Fiero community. I know I always wanted to find this kind of info out there anyways. No links to the FS will be created of course and tons of links for the little guys will be there free of charge. AMOF, I think everyone with a web page out there should remove all their links to the FS ASAP.
See how they like that!

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Winston Ojeda
88 Formula LT1
Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA
http://www.FieroLT1.com
Home of the Fiero LT1
wojeda@FieroLT1.com

Rodney,

I am a rep and I deal with this all the time on our products. Everyone of my customers shop and only llok for the same look no matter what the price. I lower some of my prices just a little. When some time goes by and problems arise they always come back to me. It is kinda like buying a honda and having to fix problems or buying a acura at a higher price and not having to fix stuff. I know what you are going thru. I lost all of my customers 2 years ago. It was tough but all of a sudden they all came back. I would offer all of yoru precious customers a 10% discount for their loyalty. By offering a 10% discount they might in fact even buy more product from you. I am just trying to give you some ideas.
HEy how far from Lacrosse Wis are YOu??

ROn

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All Stock plus goodies

quote Originally posted by 86seyellow: Rodney, I am a rep and I deal with this all the time on our products. Everyone of my customers shop and only llok for the same look no matter what the price. I lower some of my prices just a little. When some time goes by and problems arise they always come back to me. It is kinda like buying a honda and having to fix problems or buying a acura at a higher price and not having to fix stuff. I know what you are going thru. I lost all of my customers 2 years ago. It was tough but all of a sudden they all came back. I would offer all of yoru precious customers a 10% discount for their loyalty. By offering a 10% discount they might in fact even buy more product from you. I am just trying to give you some ideas. HEy how far from Lacrosse Wis are YOu?? ROn

Why should Rodney have to lose out even more?

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Technician, West Coast Fiero
www.cwestco.com
310-305-4111

FieroLT1,
Do you make webpages? are you still willing to make an anit FS page. If so i will pay for someone to host www.fierostore.net and make it an anti fierostore page. i dont know how to do webstuff but have no problem forking over a little money to knock these guys off one. on the page it should post links to every fiero site that has a better and less expensive product. for example. fierostore has the coolant lines for $150 but rodney sells them WAY cheaper. all of their products are over priced. i am very much against the fierostore.

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JOEJOE Aol:SSFiero
Two 88FORMULAS Red & Yellow
SSFiero@Aol.com

Just for ref.... Fierostore.net would likely rapidly find itself in court over copyright/trademark stuff.... Don't think so? WWF.org is currently in a WIPO/court fight with WWF.com. The two aren't remotely related but WWF.org and WIPO hold that WWF.com is infringing trademark and confusing the "tree huggers".

Before you even try that one you should read the ICANN and WIPO rules on trademark. ICANN can and will suspend a site for even aleged violations that are later thrown out of court or WIPO. And No, you don't get your fees back if they do that.

Just for the record.... Fiero store is about the last place I'd buy anything from. If anyone notices links to them in my cave that I've missed, let me know. I don't think I had any but with 100+ pages I can't be 100% sure anymore....

On the other hand, I did use Rodneys gen 2 headlight bushings. Shipped fast, got what I paid for, and worked as advertised. Was this product 100% original? No, but it solved the problem of having to file down the ones that one of the Corvette vendors makes. Sure beats the hell out of buying someone's "rebuilt" ones and having to jerk around with a core charge.

Even in such a simple thing as plastic dowels, quality product and business practice shows.

For those of you who want some interesting reading..... dig around at www.motor.com and www.motorage.com

Those are two of the autoservice trade publications... They cover not only how to fix cars but how to run the bussiness. Fierostore and several other bussineses would do well to learn the lessons in those articles. But then we've got people like Rodney and Cliff who's actions speak more than clearly.