Hello, I snuck over here from the Corvetteforum. I have always thought that the Fiero was a neat car. Of course I like Corvairs too for what it's worth. Do the Fieros make good autocrossers?
------------------ Tim80
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03:52 AM
PFF
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California Kid Member
Posts: 9541 From: Metro Detroit Area, Michigan Registered: Jul 2001
Yep!! If you put the right parts on them, they will freak you out!! I found the note below on another board (is the original owner of my car). He wishes he had never sold me the car.
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04:16 AM
thomas_l Member
Posts: 1197 From: Alpharetta, GA, US Registered: Apr 2001
SCCA is over for the year but the local Porsche club has one today and they run a visitor class. IMHO the Fiero will hold it's own with a good driver no matter what class. Key is a good driver. In stock class think some of the newer stuff has a slight edge since um well they have another 15 year technology advantage. But that is offset a good bit by the mid engine weight balance. It's all good and I get a kick out of abusing my 87 GT in the cones This coming year I might start throwing a little money on it to get more competitive. I rescued mine from the brink of the crusher and blew this years budget just getting it streetable. Now that the worst is over, I can start shopping for sticky tires and other racing goodies.
I autocross mine.. it's stock, but running on street tires i kept up and beat the neons running racing tires so i'd say there damn good. Last event of the year i beat a guy running a eclipse set up for nationals, it was a 91 non turbo next season i plan on koni's up front.. and racing tires as well as brake rebuild and bushing replacement.. then i'm goin after you vette boys.. the beauty of solo..
------------------ NOCONES -84 2M4 -4.10 4-speed -SCCA sollo II
Addmit it... it's just as much fun alone... Solo II
i rally mine and the occasional autocross it, they do extremely well if you just tweak the suspension and adjust the settings, my car has a roll cage and skid plates so its quite heavy and corners really well.
------------------ RALLY CAR, FULL ROLL CAGE, SKID PLATES AND SOON TO BE BRIGHT YELLOW
Originally posted by Tim80: Hello, I snuck over here from the Corvetteforum. I have always thought that the Fiero was a neat car. Of course I like Corvairs too for what it's worth. Do the Fieros make good autocrossers?
Corvairs are better autocrossers. Fiero's require a lot more work to make them handle really well. Fiero is a better track car than autocross. The steering is somewhat heavy on a fiero and the chassis somewhat clumsy in stock form. This does not mean it can't be made to be a compitent autocross car , but in stock class it may lead to frustration.
Join the Fiero Racing list for more info on autocrossing your Fiero. I have been doing it for 5 years now. And it took about that long to get things right.
They are fun autocrossers when prepped right though , can be made to handle neutral and be an enjoyable autocrosser , just not competitive in SCCA.
As for the comment On the corvair..We have 3 of them . 2 66's and a 69. The one 66 Won the Street mod class at this years International Corvair convention in chicago and beat 7 out of 10 of the competition class cars. Our fastest time was a 31.48 , Fastest in competition was 30.43. Our other 66 Corsa has a 215 (bored to 4.2ltr) olds aluminum V8 in it. fun Fun Fun.
Hope this helps For fast corvair information , join Yahoogroups Fastvair list.
Takes a lot more than tweeking to make a Fast autocross Fiero , As for going after vettes... A Vette running in Super stock (SS) in SCCA handles better and is easier to drive than a Fiero in an autocross..Have an 87 Z51 built for ASP in Canada and SS in the US. Fast fun car.
Hope I didn't step on anyones toes , I have only been autocrossing for about 6 years now , but have had the oppertunity to drive a number of well prepped cars thanks to a father who has been successfully autocrossing since 1968.
One thing I will say about a Fiero in ana autocross. If you can drive it fast , you can drive anything fast. The last event I was at A friend with an MR2 and I swapped cars , he had a hell of a time driving my Fiero , Whereas the Mr2 was just about the easiest car I have driven. (easy to drive fast that is)
------------------ Jonathan McCreery 86 GT 4spd Koni's , Coilovers, Big Bars , 17" Trmotorsports Typhoons , 11.25" vented discs, Wilwood 4 Piston Calipers , Pirelli P Zero's, Short Shift, No cat , Cold air induction , Geni Stainless tips, White face gauges , Momo shift , momo pedals, Big Bore TB, 70Hp Shot of NOS Autocrossed , Tracked , Dragged? (soon) abused.
[This message has been edited by Slammed Fiero (edited 12-02-2001).]
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07:40 PM
Mach10 Member
Posts: 7375 From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Registered: Jan 2001
i drove mine (and let the other guys on the FSAE team drive it as well) on the course we were testing our Formula SAE car on. i have the most experience in the car, so naturally i was 3-4 sec/lap faster than anything they could put up, but they brought their cars out too. there was an integra, a TT supra, an eclipse turbo. they were shifting, breaking down, etc... i was using 2nd gear only, not abusing it at all, and i still could put 2-3 sec/lap on any of them. it'll be even faster once i get the turbo installed... it came yesterday... *insert evil grin* i think the FSAE car was only about 6-7 sec faster/lap then the fiero too, and it's a purpose built 500lb autocross formula car. i love my fiero...
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08:44 PM
Tina Member
Posts: 2858 From: At an elevation of 8564 feet. Registered: Nov 2000
I haven't gotten a chance to autoX a fiero yet. I got hit (https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Archives/Archive-000001/HTML/20010924-2-009384.html) on my way to the first one I was going to.
I beat our schools formula SAE car by .5sec in my 84 fiero... on street tires.. . at the last event i was 5th overall. and there where some seriously good drivers in some seriously fast cars. I think i'm pretty good tough, because i took the guy that got FTD's car out on a fun run(VW Corrado VR-6, first time i ever drove it) and got a 40.78, and he got a 40.23. not to shabby.. BTW the fiero turned a best time of 43.23 with no cones, i fun runed it with a passenger and got a 42.989 so next year when i get my autocross tires and my koni shocks, retune my engine, i should be giving some people a nice run for there money for FTD with only 92HP.
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11:23 PM
cadero2dmax Member
Posts: 1266 From: Brighton, CO Registered: Oct 2001
Slammed Fiero just knew I couldn't keep out of this one!!
I have been autocrossing Fieros since 1989-1990 season in an '88 Formula. In 1991 I built the Quad4 racer for GT-2 and then back to E Mod (then). where it wasn't competitive. But in 1995, the SCCA let the GT cars into prepared, where I ran A Prepared/F Prepared (they kept moving it around) until last year, when Team Python got their hands on it.
I currently am building a 4.9 for Street Mod 2, which will be a provisional class at Nationals and Divisionals this year. Actually, I am trying to get it ready for the $2002 Challenge in February, then worry about the SCCA and/or NASA. I also plan on track days at Hallett, Oklahoma.
I hope my credentials allow me to answer the question about the Fiero autocrossing - they will never be Nationally competitive in Stock class.
I think a properly built F Street Prepared 4 cylinder could have a chance at a National trophy. The V6 will never be Nationally competitive in either Stock or Street Prepared, the SCCA has the V6 classed with a lot of newer, lighter, more powerful and nimbler cars.
The Fiero also won't have much of a chance in A Prepared, but in F Prepared it could possibly sneak into a trophy.
In Street Mod 2 - any GM motor can power it. Now we are talking!! I chose the 4.9 because of it's light weight, and it's instant-on low and mid range torque.
But I will tell you this much - - the Fiero is more fun to drive than anything else (short of a Formula Atlantic) on an autocross course.
So - - if you are there for grins and giggles, the Fiero is the best choice you can make. If you are competitive, and want to win against equal talent drivers, look at something - - I should say ANYTHING else.
Now, before the flame wars begin, look at the Nationals since 1993 - - the Fiero hasn't won a trophy except for Tamandli in his e-Mod car (really a Formula chassis with Fiero panels, and a Rover racing V8 pushing his 1500lb car). I believe Doug Chase finished in the top 10 - just out of the trophies - in about 1997 or 1998. But no National trophies have been put on any Fiero owners shelves since 1991, if I am not mistaken.
Just the facts. ma'am!
------------------ G Daily Driver - 85 SE 4.9 Cad Isuzu 5 speed '88 cradle lowered 2 1/2" Mr. Mikes interior
i'm at university of minnesota. i think we're gonna be pretty competetive next year. we had SERIOUS dirvability problems at 2001 competition because of a bad throttle body design. that's been fixed now. we got 17th in accleeration with a car that wouldn't shift. 8th in skidpad with a car that wasn't set up at all, we rolled it off the trailer and to the event adn took 8th. unfortunately, the SAE car is WAY too fast for a street car to touch it. we've got accelerometer (MoTeC) readings that say we're hitting almost 1.5g in the tighter corners, and 1.1g acceleration. i know for a fact that a fiero cant' do that. plus, i dno't feel bad beating on the fiero.
yeah, if you fiero FSAE guys wanna get together next may in detroit i'm all for it.
and Tina, the turbo should be done late spring. i'm using a fairly small turbo, more specifically for low RPM boost for autocross so i can just skip 1st gear altogether... next meeting when it's done you guys are more than welcome to try it out....
[This message has been edited by filthyscarecrow (edited 12-04-2001).]
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12:11 AM
Tina Member
Posts: 2858 From: At an elevation of 8564 feet. Registered: Nov 2000
Originally posted by Tim80: Hello, I snuck over here from the Corvetteforum. I have always thought that the Fiero was a neat car. Of course I like Corvairs too for what it's worth. Do the Fieros make good autocrossers?
As others have said they can be made competitive enough to have fun with and not be embarrasing. From my only limited experience ( one event ). I found that the stock fiero on street tires is just too heavy and too slow to be a serious contender. We entered 4 stock cars in the event and we were all a full 2 seconds slower than the Miata's and the vettes. And those 2 seconds were always from blasting down the staight. I ran my stock V6 right to redline every time and could not better my time down the straight as the engine simply ran out of breath. That being said it was definately the most fun I've ever had in the car. I felt no qualms whatever at charging in and out of corners at nearly full throttle and felt if I'd had better tires and a better suspension setup could have taken them even faster. I plan on doing it again next year and though I don't expect to win any races I do know I'll have fun. I was in the lead in our group last year when Tim in his 88 GT finally beat my best time on his last run. Well that won't happen again :^)
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85 WS6 GT partly modified 87 GT Loaded resto project
i need to try a v-6 sometime.. sounds like you guys have it rough on autocross. I hear es is geting bumped to Gs next year for me.. i'll be competing with celica alltracs and corrado vr-6's and g60's.. but it's still fun.. and i don't know what you guys are talking about.. i gave all the neon boys a nice run in the last autocross and i only have the duke? neons where running 42.8-44.5 and i was running low 43's so my car must just be special
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01:30 AM
cadero2dmax Member
Posts: 1266 From: Brighton, CO Registered: Oct 2001
I must tell you that autocrossing is about 70% driver, 30% car. You must have some pretty lousy Neon drivers in Illinois
This years National Champion in ESL is in my region. We also have an E-Mod Triumph with a Nascar SBC dead center in the car (perfectly balanced high horsepower BEAST), a three time National trophied EP Honda, and until last season my Q4 (which is currently taking FTD in Arizona against Formula Fords!!!). In other words, purpose built race cars. And we all competed Nationally.
On MOST autocross courses, Ann in her Neon ACR would beat most of us. And I live in the Midwest, where 50 or-so acre lots are the normal size that we play on - almost every event we host has a National sized course (60 to 70 seconds).
Here's my challenge to you. Go to a Central Division event next year, then report back how well you did. You will have a chance to meet Lee Miller in his 4.3 powered A Prepared Fiero in CenDiv (I think he lives in Ohio) - - or the Tamandli brothers (who live in Ft. Wayne, I believe) with their 5 time E-Mod National champion Fiero bodied Formula car.
Anyway, after seeing the talent just in your Division, you should see how much higher the driving skills are at just that level of competition. Compare to the Neon times there, and I am sure you will have it perfectly illustrated how un-competitive a stock/street prepared Fiero really is just at the Divisional level (Especially the 4 cylinder - and the '88 is far superior to the early chassis for autocrossing).
I would endorse anybody going to Nationals, just for the experience. But don't plan on being anywhere near the top in a Fiero - no matter how good a driver you are. At that level of competition the car is the last word, and the Fiero at 2700 - 2800 pounds with limited things that can be done to the suspension and engine will not catch some of the lighter, nimbler, more powerful and modern suspended cars it is classed against.
------------------ G Daily Driver - 85 SE 4.9 Cad Isuzu 5 speed '88 cradle lowered 2 1/2" Mr. Mikes interior
Just for grins, I will give you a URL for Photopoint and pictures of me and my Q4 at the drag strip (practicing my ProSolo launches), autocrossing, on a road course, and of course doing the ProSolo thing.
There are also photos of the Q4 at a car show (and the resulting trophy) and at The Fiero Factory the year before last, where we showed it off on Ed's showroom floor during the Swap Meet.
The photos also include a picture of us hot-lapping the oval at Texas Motor Speedway, and of course a couple snaps of me or my wife on course at the Nationals.
for me.. i'll be competing with celica alltracs and corrado vr-6's and g60's.. but it's still fun.. and i don't know what you guys are talking about.. i gave all the neon boys a nice run in the last autocross and i only have the duke? neons where running 42.8-44.5 and i was running low 43's so my car must just be special 
