As Fieros age it is becoming more common to find rear cradle bolts that just won't come out easily so I opened this thread to compare techniques. Here is ours 1. We heat both the bolt head and the nut to a cherry red color with the Oxy acelylene torch. . The rubber will be destoyed but most times you will be replacing it anyway. I keep a water spray bottle handy to insure that any ignition of the cradle bushing is immediately extinguished. 2. Then we try to tap out the bolt ( not much room there) and hit it with the impact wrench and sometimes that does it. 3. If that doesn't work we put an air chisel tip into the fold line of the metal sleeve inner bushing to open it up or use a small hammer and chisel. By this time the bolt always gives up its hold and comes out but I often wonder if there is an easier way to get those often frozen bolts out easier, so please post your method.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, ZZP Intercooler, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
3. If that doesn't work we put an air chisel tip into the fold line of the metal sleeve inner bushing to open it up or use a small hammer and chisel.
I've often heard people say this, but I can't imagine how you would have access to the sleeve. The way I see it, on the front cradle bolts you can't get to the bushing sleeve because the two mounting flanges or ears that form part of the chassis completely block off access at either end. You can't get to it along its length either because, well, the bushing is in the way not to mention the outer metal bushing tube that's part of the cradle. There has to be something I'm missing.
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12:18 PM
Dennis LaGrua Member
Posts: 15147 From: Hillsborough, NJ U.S.A. Registered: May 2000
I've often heard people say this, but I can't imagine how you would have access to the sleeve. The way I see it, on the front cradle bolts you can't get to the bushing sleeve because the two mounting flanges or ears that form part of the chassis completely block off access at either end. You can't get to it along its length either because, well, the bushing is in the way not to mention the outer metal bushing tube that's part of the cradle. There has to be something I'm missing.
As you apply heat, the rubber in the bushing melts away and exposes the inner sleeve. You rotate the bolt which turns the sleeve and you will see the line that forms the bushing. You get in there with a pointed air chisel (or hammer and small chisel )and pry the sleeve open a bit. You can't pry it along its entire length but the prying in the one spot will spread the bushing open just enough to allow it to give up its hold on the bolt. This method assumes that one owns a good torch.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, ZZP Intercooler, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
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01:55 PM
olejoedad Member
Posts: 18208 From: Clarendon Twp., MI Registered: May 2004
A good soaking for a day or two with KROIL usually takes care of the issue for me. If I can't turn it by hand after the KROIL creeps in, I loosen the nut a full turn, doble nut the threaded end very tigh with the nut lands on both nuts aligned and blst the bolt with the 1/2 impact, back and forth. After it loosens up, spin it with the impact, remove the double nuts and out it comes.
The impact usually doesn't break the bushing loose on the sleeve, if it does, I just cut the ends off of the cradle bolts.
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02:04 PM
Dennis LaGrua Member
Posts: 15147 From: Hillsborough, NJ U.S.A. Registered: May 2000
A good soaking for a day or two with KROIL usually takes care of the issue for me. If I can't turn it by hand after the KROIL creeps in, I loosen the nut a full turn, doble nut the threaded end very tigh with the nut lands on both nuts aligned and blst the bolt with the 1/2 impact, back and forth. After it loosens up, spin it with the impact, remove the double nuts and out it comes.
The impact usually doesn't break the bushing loose on the sleeve, if it does, I just cut the ends off of the cradle bolts.
I can see validity in your method but I try to avoid cutting the bolts. I have done this in the past but the 12MM bolts that are available locally don't fit like the OEM bolts with the shoulders. Those cradle bolts are a special hardened size. BTW, how do you get the impact wrench on the nuts as they reside next to the ground effects towards the outside of the car. Not much room in there at all for a 1/2" impact wrench..
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, ZZP Intercooler, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
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03:33 PM
olejoedad Member
Posts: 18208 From: Clarendon Twp., MI Registered: May 2004
The vertical bolts at the rear; I've had the nuts break the welds and spin on me, at this point I use a hole saw and drill a 1 1/2" hole in the frame to get a wrench in there to hold the thing solid. Then you can either re weld everything or leave it open for another use later.
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05:33 PM
Indiana_resto_guy Member
Posts: 7158 From: Shelbyville, IN USA Registered: Jul 2000
I forgo the heat, remove the nut either by removing with a socket or by splitting it off. Then instead of an air chisle I use a narrower chisle and hammer to split the sleeve and hit it with peneratring oil and drive it out/impact it. No damage to an otherwise good bushing.
ive had to cut the rear cradle bolt and one of the fronts off of my 84, the front actually was a paint to cut as i ended up cutting the tab off and then rewelding it.
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08:11 PM
RotrexFiero Member
Posts: 3692 From: Pittsburgh, PA Registered: Jul 2002
The vertical bolts at the rear; I've had the nuts break the welds and spin on me, at this point I use a hole saw and drill a 1 1/2" hole in the frame to get a wrench in there to hold the thing solid. Then you can either re weld everything or leave it open for another use later.
You don't have to mutilate and weaken the frame by cutting to get to those nuts. Removing the rear facia for access is a simple 30 minute job When removed it is easy to gain access to the nuts and get a faucet wrench on them. Spray them w PB Blaster or a penetrant of your choice, and impact remove from below. Works every time.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, ZZP Intercooler, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
Cut rubber to see more of inner sleeve. Can rotate inner sleeve to see seem w/ no torching etc... Then hit on or just next to seem w/ a dull center punch to expand sleeve.
Need both end of sleeve to expand enough to loosen...
Work for front cradle, control arm, etc...
See my cave, bushing in suspension section...
------------------ Dr. Ian Malcolm: Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should. (Jurassic Park)
When removed it is easy to gain access to the nuts and get a faucet wrench on them.
What is a faucet wrench? Is it a pipe wrench? If so, can you find a pipe wrench long enough yet slim enough to reach? Can you really grab the "witch hat" nuts and hold them tightly enough this way?
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11:50 AM
fieroguru Member
Posts: 12134 From: Champaign, IL Registered: Aug 2003
What is a faucet wrench? Is it a pipe wrench? If so, can you find a pipe wrench long enough yet slim enough to reach? Can you really grab the "witch hat" nuts and hold them tightly enough this way?
I usually slide some flat steel bars into the frame rail along the flat side of the witch hat nut to keep them from spinning, but the faucet/basin wrench should work too.
Everyone seems to miss this one. (or not beleive me) This is for the front bolts on the rear cradle. The biggest thing to getting out cradle bolts, is to have all of the weight of the car OFF of them. You have to jack up the car or cradle untill the cars weight is off the bolts, not just untill jacking the cradles moves the car, sometimes takes up and down alot to get it just right. Then you can use above methods IE: a big hammer, etc..
It helps when the rust doesn't have hundreds of pounds helping hold it in.
BTW this works rusted or not, non rusted bolts, after taking the weight off, I pull out with my fingers. That should show you how much a difference it makes.
Hey our cradle bolts came out lickity split with a couple of shots of WD-40 and a socket, course we only have 20k miles! Any tips on how to keep it that way in the future? Like new bolts or bolt dressings?
Very interesting thread. Well be watching this one!
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08:33 PM
olejoedad Member
Posts: 18208 From: Clarendon Twp., MI Registered: May 2004
You don't have to mutilate and weaken the frame by cutting to get to those nuts. Removing the rear facia for access is a simple 30 minute job When removed it is easy to gain access to the nuts and get a faucet wrench on them. Spray them w PB Blaster or a penetrant of your choice, and impact remove from below. Works every time.
Durn! Never thought about a faucet wrench! Good idea!
I usually cut a flap open and reweld it after I'm done.
That allows me to weld the witch hat nut in place after reinstalling the cradle.
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09:23 PM
olejoedad Member
Posts: 18208 From: Clarendon Twp., MI Registered: May 2004
Hey our cradle bolts came out lickity split with a couple of shots of WD-40 and a socket, course we only have 20k miles! Any tips on how to keep it that way in the future? Like new bolts or bolt dressings?
Very interesting thread. Well be watching this one!
Always anti-seize coat the bolt shaft before reinstalling.
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09:26 PM
olejoedad Member
Posts: 18208 From: Clarendon Twp., MI Registered: May 2004
Our biggest problem here in the Midwest is the shaft of the bolt rusting to the bushing sleeve on the pre-88's. 88's aren't so bad because it's a solidly mounted metal tube, no flex as with the pre-88 bushing. When the bushing sleeve breaks loose from the rubber and spins in the bushing, it's a real problem - new bushing time!
Once the bolt is tirning freely inside the sleeve, then it goes without saying to take the weight off of the bolt and slide it out..............
[This message has been edited by olejoedad (edited 10-10-2011).]
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09:30 PM
Nov 5th, 2011
altair909 Junior Member
Posts: 4 From: Ferndale, MI, USA Registered: May 2011
Good question. I plan on replacing ours with poly soon. For sure it's somewhere on the forum.
Don't ya know, as soon as I start the job I'll be looking for bolts.
Appreciate the thread, great tips!
Front and rear cradle bolts are 12 MM. Rears have 15mm hex heads while fronts have 18mm hex heads. I've tried to match these up at the local farm supply store and you can buy only straght unshouldered bolts. The OEM front shouldered bolts are hard to find. You also need hardened bolts as regular strength bolts can break under the repeated stress of use.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, ZZP Intercooler, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
