i wasnt aware of a difference beside one has the hd diff and the other doesn't.

i have a 4t65e from a 2002 impala and i also have an ls4 out of a 2006 impala. dave at triple edge performance just told me that it wouldnt work

so what else is different besides the internals, as i was going for a full rebuild


I did notice the starter location was at the bottom

That what won't work?

darn, so i should have gone with the f40.

would it be possible to relocate the starter like with the f40.

could put the starter here??



of course i did only spend 200 on the trans, so im not out that much hell i could probably turn a profit selling it. as soon as i put it back together

[This message has been edited by ZombiePenguin (edited 01-23-2011).]

Besides the starter mount, I believe there are electrical differences within the transmission from a 2002 and 2006. I have a 2007 LS4 4T65e-HD with 18K miles if you are looking for one. I am using the F40 with my LS4 and would like to sell the 4T65e-hd. PM me if you are interested.

pm sent

First off, the HD diff is not really a needed upgrade for any fiero.... many FWD people use the SD diff with 500hp without issues... The fiero rarely even uses the diff function anyway. You can also install a HD diff into any 4t65e transmission.

Secondly, it all depends on what sort of engine managment you are going to run, to determine the trans you can use. 97-99 PCMs only work with 97-99 transmissions, 99.5-02 only work with 99.5-02, and 03+ works with 03+. The 03+ V8 transmissions got a revised version of the Gemini drive chains, that many consider to be a great upgrade and increases power handling for the FWD guys from 275whp to 350whp on average.

[This message has been edited by darkhorizon (edited 01-24-2011).]

quote Originally posted by darkhorizon: Secondly, it all depends on what sort of engine managment you are going to run, to determine the trans you can use. 97-99 PCMs only work with 97-99 transmissions, 99.5-02 only work with 99.5-02, and 03+ works with 03+.

Not exactly accurate.

1997-02 4T65-E's are basically interchangeable with all 1997-02 PCMs. There may be some minor wiring differences with some C and H body 4T65-E's used from 2000-02 (where the trans range switch was moved inside the trans - GM called this the "IMS" - or Internal Mode Switch), but these transmissions will work fine with the older PCMs as long as you wire it up correctly or install the external gear range (neutral safety) switch onto one of these transmissions that has the IMS.

2003-later 4T65-E's saw the big change. GM dropped most of the fluid pressure switches from the the manifold pressure switch assembly. As a consequence, any PCM older than 2003 looking for these switches won't like not "seeing" them. So if you are running a 2003-newer 4T65-E trans, you'll need to be running 2003-newer programming to make sure it is 100% compatible. There are some pre-2003 PCMs that will accept the 2003 programming just fine.

Starting in 2004, the TAPShift option was made available on some 4T65-E's. A TAPShift optioned 4T65-E trans won't work correctly with a PCM or TCM that is not set up for TAPShift.

-ryan

------------------
OVERKILL IS UNDERRATED

Custom GM OBD1 & OBD2 Tuning | Engine Conversions & more | www.gmtuners.com

[This message has been edited by Darth Fiero (edited 01-24-2011).]

Im probably just gonna sell the one i have, and go with the one fieroguru is selling, a 2007 trans on a 2006 motor should work out fine

i do have another question regarding these trans missions.

is the gemini chain-set stronger than the 7/8" chain from triple edge performance


7/8" chain $299.95
The stock dual chain setup works great but once you start making power above roughly the 325whp mark and make frequent track passes, especially with slicks, they will fail and break which leaves you stranded. These single chain conversion kits use a Borg / Morse HyVo 7/8" chain and estimated ratings are 400-450 WHP depending on application. Available ratio options are 2.93, 3.29, and 3.69 when used in combination with a 3.29:1 final drive.

quote Originally posted by ZombiePenguin: is the gemini chain-set stronger than the 7/8" chain from triple edge performance

Not according to Dave at TripleEdge. He says the single 7/8" chain is the strongest thing you can get these days. The 1" GM racing chains have not been made for a few years now so good luck finding one of those.

And for the record, the "V8" wasn't used with the 4T65-E until 2005 model year (not "03+" as was previous stated in this thread).

Also according to Dave, the gemini V8 chain is still a dual chain setup that will work with the stock dual-chain sprockets and is only slightly stronger than the standard "V6" dual chains.

quote Originally posted by Darth Fiero: Not according to Dave at TripleEdge. He says the single 7/8" chain is the strongest thing you can get these days. The 1" GM racing chains have not been made for a few years now so good luck finding one of those. And for the record, the "V8" wasn't used with the 4T65-E until 2005 model year (not "03+" as was previous stated in this thread). Also according to Dave, the gemini V8 chain is still a dual chain setup that will work with the stock dual-chain sprockets and is only slightly stronger than the standard "V6" dual chains.

exactly, but ive been hearing that people are getting 500 hp (no one talks about torque) from the Gemini or stock chains, while the 7/8 chain is 450 hp
so would it be worth upgrading the chain

quote And for the record, the "V8" wasn't used with the 4T65-E until 2005 model year (not "03+" as was previous stated in this thread).

That seems a bit obvious now doesnt it? Glad someone is around to fix all of these drastic mistakes I seem to be making.

quote 1997-02 4T65-E's are basically interchangeable with all 1997-02 PCMs.

External range switch aside, there is a difference. In the trans there is a manifold pressure switch. In 98 it monitors every gear and in 00+ it only looks to one pressure. Slight differences like this need to be accounted for. I could have just swapped the pressure manifold and wiring, but I didnt see a need to. The problems on my car were very obvious and was fixed instantly by a PCM swap.... So I dont see where you get off saying that I am wrong here.

quote Originally posted by darkhorizon: External range switch aside, there is a difference. In the trans there is a manifold pressure switch. In 98 it monitors every gear and in 00+ it only looks to one pressure. Slight differences like this need to be accounted for. I could have just swapped the pressure manifold and wiring, but I didnt see a need to. The problems on my car were very obvious and was fixed instantly by a PCM swap.... So I dont see where you get off saying that I am wrong here.

I think you need to do a little more research. The SAME pressure manifold switch was used in ALL 1997-2002 4T65-E's. It wasn't until 2003-newer 4T65-E's that this switch assembly was changed to drop all the gear pressure switches, not "00+" or "99.5+" as you state.

Here's a direct link to the diagrams for a 97 GTP trans schematic for this manifold pressure switch: http://sm.gpona.com:9001/si...Syskey=84693&from=sm

Here's a direct link to the diagrams for a 02 GTP trans schematic for this manifold pressure switch: http://sm.gpona.com:9001/si...yskey=767302&from=sm

Notice something about them? That's right - they are the SAME!

Now, here's the schematic for the 03 GTP trans manifold pressure switch: http://sm.gpona.com:9001/si...yskey=836416&from=sm where you will clearly see the change had been made.

In addition to this information, you can just call Dave at TripleEdge and ask him. He will verify what I posted and confirm your statements are wrong.

Please do some more research to confirm your statements are factually correct before you post more misinformation on this forum. Thanks...

If I eluded to the wiring being the difference, i was wrong. The issue is with the differences between the XA and XB valvebody, and how it monitors pressure changes.

quote you can just call Dave at TripleEdge and ask him.

Just because Dave says something... that means it is now fact eh?

I notice you dodged explaining why swapping from a stock 98 PCM to a stock late 00 PCM fixed my issue?

[This message has been edited by darkhorizon (edited 01-26-2011).]

quote Originally posted by darkhorizon: In the trans there is a manifold pressure switch. In 98 it monitors every gear and in 00+ it only looks to one pressure. If I eluded to the wiring being the difference, i was wrong. The issue is with the differences between the XA and XB valvebody, and how it monitors pressure changes.

You "eluded" to more than a wiring change. You tried saying that 00+ only had one pressure switch and you were WRONG, since that change wasn't made until the 2003 model year.

Besides that, the XA and XB valve body issue only applied to 2000 model year. And in that year, one version didn't have a boost valve or 2 that the other had, and those only had to do with band apply. The PCM has never monitored these valves or pressures so it doesn't care. Hell, you can even swap valve bodies if you want to. But the point is, the PCM DOESN'T CARE ABOUT THESE DIFFERENCES!

quote Just because Dave says something... that means it is now fact eh?

I didn't say that. I said you could call him and verify the information. I would consider him to be a MUCH MORE RELIABLE source of CORRECT information about these transmissions than I would you or whatever internet search engine you are using to get your information these days.

quote I notice you dodged explaining why swapping from a stock 98 PCM to a stock late 00 PCM fixed my issue?

I didn't dodge anything. I simply refused to comment on your issue. Why? Because I've seen your car and the way you do swaps, and I'm not surprised you have issues.

Don't get mad because you were proven wrong once again. But that doesn't change the fact that all 97-02 4T65-E's are compatible with all 97-02 PCMs (that are designed to work with this specific transmission).

-ryan

[This message has been edited by Darth Fiero (edited 01-26-2011).]